User talk:Tbguy1992

French Industrial Revolution
Your "French Industrial Revolution" timeline has been nominated for deletion because it hardly contains any actual content, if you are still interested in writing this AltHist you are given four weeks time to let us know and to start writing on, otherwise it will be deleted.--Max Sinister 10:41, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

L'empire de Napoleanic se lèvera!‎
The title in proper french should be "L'empire napoléonien se lèvera!"--Marcpasquin 14:03, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Napoleon's World
I myself am perpetually working on my own Napoleonic AltHist Napoleon's World - however, his victory occurs in 1813, not 1805 as in yours. The early 1800's is the section I struggle the most with due to believability and such. Let me know what you think? I'd appreciate it enormously. Regards, KingSweden 00:42, February 12, 2010 (UTC)

Of course, always a pleasure. Let me know what I can do to improve my own TL. KingSweden 22:54, April 7, 2010 (UTC)

Linking articles
You don't need to use the url to link articles in a wiki. Just add brackets around the article as so: The French Empire (French Trafalgar, British Waterloo). Thus it creates this: The French Empire (French Trafalgar, British Waterloo). If you don't want the title to show or you want the text of the link to be different from the destination, use a "|", for example: The French Empire. That would get you this: The French Empire. Mitro 20:08, April 5, 2010 (UTC)

Images
You can't get an image to appear simply by linking to wikipedia. You have to save the image onto your computer, upload it onto this wiki and then use the file name on whatever article you want it to appear on. Mitro 20:20, April 5, 2010 (UTC)

Culloden
I would love to write an alt his on what would have happened if the Jacobites had won Culloden. I know you are into the Napoleonic wars, and that would be the right time period, but I am having a lot of trouble finding out information about this time in history, specifically what would have changed. Please help. thanks.

Anna Geddes

Chinese modernaisation
I was reading about China in your French Trafalgar, British Waterloo timeline. I think you fail to realise that just because of a few wars, the Manchus would be unlikely to change their armies. They refused utterly to believe the Western barbarians were technologically more advanced than they were. In OTL, it took an army in Peking to convince them and even then they believed the upstart Europeans would be crushed by their obviously better armaments. It took the destruction of the Summer Palace to hammer home the point. I therefore find is somewhat disbelievable that they would look at the barbarians wars and think they would signify. Bob 20:32, April 28, 2010 (UTC)

The denouement should not be a simple war. In the Manchus eyes just because the drill, disciplihne and armament of the Europeans is better, means nothing. In their eyes, they are barbarians and they will certainly fail. They think like this, just because a bigger boy can stamp down your sandcastle, it doesn't make him more civilised than you. I think the truth should be brought home in a more subtle way. For example, assuming the British get Hong Kong (or whoever, French Portuguese, Swiss just so long as they are Westerners and presumably imperialists) they would go to Peking to sign a treaty. The mere fact a barbarian Westerner entered the Forbidden City would shake them. And because he wouldn't kow-tow before the Celestial Prince, but look him in the eye as a man and as a man who has lost would be the killing blow for Manchu arrogance. Bob 17:12, April 29, 2010 (UTC)

Possible collaboration
I was hoping that maybe I could possibly help you with some of the aticles in your timeline. It has the makings of a real whopper. Bob 18:48, May 5, 2010 (UTC) The population of the British Empire would at this point be overwhelmingly Indian. India alone compried about a third of the Empire's population. Whats to stop the colonial government from using this enormous population as a colonial tool. It was working in Sarawak where Chinese(themselves with a decent population) were encouraged to settle. Why not put that population to good use and use it to settle the sparsely populated and therefore weak British American territories. Or to beat the French in the Scramble for Africa. In OTL we encouraged British nobles to go to Africa. In this world why not a few Indian princes. Not only that but by reducing the population of India you would reduce nationalism, therefore tightening British power. Its like a vaster and more elaborate version of Sierra Leone. Bob 16:37, May 10, 2010 (UTC)

With the advent of this ethnic mixing a trend would appear which I have detailed on the UK page. The typical Britisher as seen around the world would increasingly be an English-speaking man who wears British style clothes and works hard for Queen and country but his ethnicity is closer to the Punjab than Perth! The Empire would be reforged over a matter of years as the white British identity and the Indian colonist identity are fused together. Bob 10:44, May 11, 2010 (UTC)

Allies, Axis and Communism
Would you accept a version of the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact and the German-Soviet Commercial Pact? I hope you will accept. Fegaxeyl 14:48, May 22, 2010 (UTC)

As you may know Vegas Addict and I have been debating as to whether Brazil would invade Argentina, and which side the USSR would support. I'll just lay out the basic situation:

Supporting Brazil: Supporting Argentina: It's your choice as to which way you go, but remember there will be CONSEQUENCES... Fegaxeyl 17:52, May 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Gain powerful South American ally
 * Ally has mostly identical political leanings
 * Loss of any benefits gained in the alliance with Germany, Japan, Italy and other Axis states
 * Earn trust of Germany and other Axis states
 * Solidify position as an active and powerful member of the Axis
 * Lose some face in the global communist community (but as in OTL the USSR had dropped its World Revolution rhetoric this may not be as important)

Write Next
Please write the next section for The New & Improved map game (Map Game). --Catherine 22:41, May 24, 2010 (UTC)

I would love to see more on your timeline Titanic, the Luckiest Ship in the World. --Catherine 19:47, May 27, 2010 (UTC)

You could write that the Titanic remains in service for 40 years, from 1912-1952. Have it it survived World Wars I and II and that instead of being scrapped when it was retired, that it was instead restored to it's 1912 incranation and made a floating museum of maritime history. --Catherine 20:00, May 27, 2010 (UTC)

That would not sound fair. I want Titanic to still be pretty famous. --Catherine 20:12, May 27, 2010 (UTC)

Britanic would have been called Gigantic in this timeline as it was only renamed after the sinking of the TitanicVegas adict 20:15, May 27, 2010 (UTC)

Oh.

Will you please also read Russian Empire (Constantine's Russia) and give me advice on how I can improve it. Also, please continue work on the Titanic timeline. I die for more.--Catherine 20:17, May 27, 2010 (UTC)

French Trafalgar, British Waterloo
I took a look at the additions you've made, it looks great! I was wondering if you could sneak a peak at a few of my pages (specifically the ones concerning Alaska and let me know what you think - there's only a few, but I've been giving them a lot of work. KingSweden 23:33, May 30, 2010 (UTC)

That would be alright I guess, as long as everything fits into the TL I envisioned. If things deviate too much I'll probably give them an edit or two, so don't take personal offense if I do. KingSweden 17:19, May 31, 2010 (UTC)

You know, I took a look at your TL and love the way you're setting up the pending World War in North America and Europe - I don't know what I could do to add to it at the moment. But feel free to make your contributions to Napoleon's World like we discussed! Once there's more on yours so I can get a sense of your direction, I'll make a few articles for you. KingSweden 23:41, June 1, 2010 (UTC)

When will you?
When will you expand Timeline (Titanic, the Luckiest Ship in the World)? I am begging for a lot more, and have been waiting for days for the adventure to continue. --Catherine 15:15, May 31, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah! When will you get back to work? --Catherine 15:19, May 31, 2010 (UTC)

Good work. I look foward to more. I would love to see Titanic and Olympic surviving World War II as well, also acting as transport ships, and them being de-commissioned in 1952, renovated to their 1912 look, and made maritime museums on water. --Catherine 16:22, May 31, 2010 (UTC)

Ok, make the Titanic the museum ship, and sell the Olympic to a rich businessman. --Catherine 18:14, May 31, 2010 (UTC)

I die for more on Titanic. --Catherine 18:49, May 31, 2010 (UTC)

Roger that. I will not message for Titanic anymore. --Catherine 18:56, May 31, 2010 (UTC)

Yesterday, you said today you would work on Titanic. --Catherine 16:47, June 1, 2010 (UTC)

Whoa! You had no right to be rude like that. I will leave you alone, but don't yell at me again. You made me f***** angry! --Catherine 16:58, June 1, 2010 (UTC)

Apology accepted. Continue with whatever you want to do. --Catherine 17:20, June 1, 2010 (UTC)

Why are you taking so long to work on the Titanic timeline? I am impatient and irritated. --Catherine 17:17, June 4, 2010 (UTC)

Oh okay. I have another question: can you tell me a link to a good alternate history timeline of the British Empire? --Catherine 17:41, June 4, 2010 (UTC)

Help me!!! (AAC)
I wasn't counting on Japan making Chile a puppet, as i was asuming that they couldn't get past the carriers (Which it seems everyone has ignored) and would apreciate the USSR's suport in thisVegas adict 21:16, June 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * Uraguy might fall into the USSR's sphere of ifluence as it had been ocupied by the Nazi'sVegas adict 09:09, June 6, 2010 (UTC)

Great Britain in FTBW
I noticed on the last paragraph that Great Britain has one of the largest armies in Europe. Now even up to the First World War in OTL, the UK tended to have a small army and a menacingly vast Navy. Whats changed? Also about the American Civil War thing. I was thinking that the British would support the CSA because they would want to weaken the USA in any way they can. Bob 09:01, June 16, 2010 (UTC)

Whats next?
Whats happening next in FTBW? Bob 12:56, June 30, 2010 (UTC)

Sounds good! I like the fact the real Napoleon III comes to power. Maybe you could have a thing that the British utilise a few native regiments. I had a thought that one of the Indian officers performs brilliantly whearas elsewhere on the battlefield, white officers are doing poorly. This further disproves the myth of the white mans superiority. This means elsewhere in the Empire, native people become more key in the running of the Empire, drawing it closer together. Bob 10:09, July 1, 2010 (UTC)

I am back from my exile. Did you edit the Titanic timeline or did you just go f*** around? --Catherine 19:24, July 3, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry for using the word "f***". I am just angry and frusturated a lot of the time. I am just waiting for you to edit.

Fine, I give you time, you little f***face! You have had two months to expand the timeline, and that you did not do! --Catherine 19:41, July 3, 2010 (UTC)

You can be that way! I don't give a damn thought about your ideas. If you will not update the timeline, I will do so myself. --Catherine 19:50, July 3, 2010 (UTC)

My Official Apology for my Behavior
I am sorry for my behavior and my manners towards you. I never actually intended to call you "fuckface" or to be rude to you. I am sorry for trying to prod you into working on the Titanic timeline. I will no longer bother you, and you can have as much time as you want to work on your timelines. Again, I am sorry and revoke my actions. Please accept my apology. It never happen again, and if it does, in any way, you can report me to the administrators.

Signed,

--Catherine 01:53, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for accepting my apology. Now I can help you with your Titanic Timeline. --Catherine 02:54, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

I well do nothing wrong. --Catherine 03:12, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

Let us move foward with what we must do, General. (The picture was that of a military officer, which I thought was a General. Smiles.) --Catherine 03:20, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

Europe 1430
I wasn't going to work on it originally, but if you're going to help me I guess I'll do it. ProfessorMcG 14:45, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

Oops! ^ That must've came out wrong! No, I'm only reluctant because I've never done a timeline before and I don't want to be a hassle to you. But it will most likely work so, let's do it! ProfessorMcG 19:51, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

P.S. You have 911 edits....wierd. ProfessorMcG 19:52, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

Jeanne d'Arc doesn't get captured by the Burgundians in 1428, or whenever... ProfessorMcG 23:54, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

France already became a superpower. ProfessorMcG 15:36, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

How about Jeanne d'Arc convinces the French to make a gamble against the English, but they make a mistake and England takes advantage and instead of France slowly taking Normandy, France belongs to England. Burgundy would get into a war with England and a lot could happen. ProfessorMcG 15:40, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

The Sun Never Sets on the French Empire. I like it =) ProfessorMcG 17:48, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

I don't even understand how it works. Can you enlighten me? =) ProfessorMcG 04:55, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

On CYOAH, how do we make an edit? ProfessorMcG 05:01, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

Idea
That might be a neat idea. Kinda like a map game only with more detail and fewer maps. Go ahead if you feel like it.Oerwinde 07:26, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

I'm not sure how to turn something into a community project. Most seem to just spring into life.Oerwinde 08:08, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

Like the choose your own alt
I love that someone has finally stepped up and tried something COMPLETELY different for a change. I choose to poison Hitler by the way, in the earliest POD.--DaBigUn 04:06, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

It's not a bad idea, very original. And btw I LOVED what you did with "Titanesque." Petain dying onboard actually fits more perfectly into canon than you can ever imagine, even if I didn't realize it until you stuck it in there. Well done my friend. KingSweden 15:23, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

TL
What you're describing for Winston Churchill could work, at least in 1915 - however, do keep in mind that in his later career he becomes a leading member of Socialist England and even their Premier before his assassination in 1945. See: The Anarchy (Napoleon's World) for more details on that. Your Churchill idea doesn't actually breach canon though, since the Socialist Revolution in England doesn't occur until 1920-22, and perhaps Churchill rode his fame as a writer into power within the Socialist Party? An interesting idea.

Also, Winnipeg exists under its OTL name, and is in fact the capital of the State of Kahokia, just north of Minnesota and Lake Superior. The strike would still probably happen as you are describing it though. KingSweden 16:20, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

I think it works just fine. I was just making sure you wouldn't put a whole bunch of effort into the life of Winston Churchill, I'd feel bad if I had to make serious edits to something somebody else put work into because it doesn't fit canon. Your idea is a good one and works out great.KingSweden 18:55, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

Very true. Besides, look at men such as Reagan, Schwarzenegger and Jesse Ventura - many people who started off careers in film/literature later pursued talents in politics. You make a great point. KingSweden 01:43, July 11, 2010 (UTC)

That sounds great, but what was the OTL Alfred Dreyfus affair? And what Emperor would have been reigning at the time? KingSweden 02:11, July 11, 2010 (UTC)

I think you've got a potential article there. I told you before you could contribute to the TL as long as I could modify small details to fit canon, so go ahead. I think that could fit well into the leadup to the Iron Revolution as well, if in OTL it had lingering consequences all the way into Vichy France. Use your imagination and whip something up!KingSweden 02:59, July 11, 2010 (UTC)

It looks good, I'll do some work on it to refine some of the finer points and details. Good work though. KingSweden 08:10, July 11, 2010 (UTC)

Central World
Hi Tbuguy1992 might you create an article for Central World, I'm trying to turn it into a community project. Please Answer Me. VENEZUELA 18:01, July 15, 2010 (UTC)

Maps
I'd love to help you! I have a drawing tablet, photoshop elements and corel paint in my inventory.--Smallpox 04:42, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

You didn't sound harsh at all, and I'm completely fine with your rules, are there any maps that have a sort of priority for you right now?--Smallpox 05:58, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

Sounds good.--Smallpox 06:13, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

Alright, I'm eastern time here, so it'll be 10 here. Whoo, 700th edit...--Smallpox 06:29, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, I never got around to helping you, and every time I see your user page saying thanks for maps and stuff I feel really bad, it looks like you have a map know, right? Anything else you would like help with?--Smallpox 23:43, August 12, 2010 (UTC)

I could use a new read actually, I'll give you TL a read, sure! I'm still happy to help with the maps and such as well. I am from central Ontario. Try not to get stabbed in Winnipeg, it's a dangerous place!--Smallpox 04:22, August 13, 2010 (UTC)

Well, you know what they say, "♫Stay alert, stay safe♫".--Smallpox 04:36, August 13, 2010 (UTC)

Not to mention the "My name is Astar, a robot" commercials that played between segments of Reboot, and the ZONE, damn, growing up Canadian is the best.--Smallpox 04:57, August 13, 2010 (UTC)

I'm reading about that right now, haha, pretty great.--Smallpox 05:12, August 13, 2010 (UTC)

Rioting (well, not really) over a giant banana? That's sillier then those damn quebecois!--Smallpox 05:38, August 13, 2010 (UTC)

==Wasteland Europe==

Hey, if you can, could you help me out with Wasteland Europe? Feel free to expand it, because it is an open timeline afterall. Arstarpool 21:58, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

Reply: Chuck Norris
To answer your question, I think you have a good start. The Olympics in this TL are in 1978, 1982 and 1986 (in Samarkand, Kialgory and Cairo, respectively... there's a page with more information on that in the sports subcategory.) However, the course of their lives are a little too similar to OTL I feel, especially Johnny Cash's. The Foxworthy idea I like as a core idea, but how do these ideas reflect the ATL as a whole? That is the one complaint I've had with some of the additions made to this page - they're just an Alternate Destiny, not an Alternate Destiny in Napoleon's World, if you get what I mean. Don't get me wrong, I love the contributions, I guess the challenge I'm giving you is this: what makes these three people unique within a different reality, as opposed to our own? Maybe I've just seen Inception a few too many times... Hmm.

I do think that you have a great start on those three though. Keep up the good work! KingSweden 15:37, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry if that last post came off as harsh. You've had really good contributions to the TL.

The Brooks idea is great. I was thinking about it over breakfast actually and I realized that his initial fame could be as a star track athlete at the 1982 Kialgory Olympics in Alaska, where his performance was a Michael Phelps-esque epic in an otherwise pedestrian showing for American teams, and an especially unique one in a neighboring rival such as Alaska (when thinking of Alaska, imagine the US's playful rivalry with Canada fused with the American fear and distaste for Russia fused into one country). Maybe he later rode his athletic fame into journalism? As for his "uncovering of scandals," that could work circa 2004, when despite the popularity of outgoing Nationalist President Mitt Romney, Brooks could expose major flaws in the National Party's campaign structure, thus paving the way for Jay Leno's narrow victory over Jeb Bush?

I don't think the War on Drugs would ever have become as major of a concern in ATL, since there is no real Reaganesque figure to lead that charge (the conservative icon is Richard van Dyke, a pragmatist, and Liz Shannon and Robert Redford were too busy stopping economic collapse and nuclear war to bother with drugs). However, that doesn't mean that drugs wouldn't have been a major problem in the US - an interesting idea. Go with Cash however you see fit. And while the Philly Race Riots are significant, maybe his decline in the public eye by 1983 would be a major reason why he was unable to respond in the same way to the far more violent Covenant Race Riots in January of '83? A thought. Let me know what you think.

Why not just have Foxworthy replace Stewart or Colbert? We're giving him an alternate lifetime anyways, maybe its Foxworthy who is on the Daily Show, not Stewart. I like your satirical "Colbert 2012" idea though. KingSweden 17:09, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Sounds like you have a future governor of Kahokia on your hands (you were from Winnipeg, right?) KingSweden 15:01, July 20, 2010 (UTC)

Oh okay. Well, you would still be a proud Kahokian in ATL and probably wear the green and white of the U of K Thundering Herd (I'm a sports nut haha). I see no problem with you including your grandfather in the TL in a minor but honored role. However, I feel your statement that "fictional characters opens a Pandoras Box," and I personally am 100% against the prospect. The Alternate Destinies page is getting out of control as it is, AND, although you yourself have contributed a lot of good stuff to this TL, other users seem to think that the entire timeline is like a Napoleonic Puget Sound-1. I want to start getting the whole thing back on track towards the fully-fleshed out world it is meant to be.

That said, guns away on putting your grandfather in. Maybe a state page on Kahokia and mentioning him in the state's history? I'll leave it up to you, its your grandfather and your region of expertise (literally). KingSweden 15:31, July 20, 2010 (UTC)

Use Your Discretion
This is your part of the country and your family, so use your discretion. Obviously Kahokia is a larger state than Dakota (population wise) so that's really your decision. KingSweden 16:34, July 20, 2010 (UTC)

CYOAH
I would be honored to be a controller for CYOAH. I assume the responsibilites would be like a moderator on the site, except for the timeline? Azecreth 17:57, July 20, 2010 (UTC)

Joining CYOAH
Hi! I really like your idea for CYOAH, and was wondering if you would let me do the follow-up articles for "Hitler dies 1933, by accident".

Thanks!

Eastward Expansion 22:03, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

Oh well...

That was really my fault not yours, but thanks for saying sorry anyway! Eastward Expansion 01:05, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

A radical idea for the future of CYOAH
TB, CYOAH is huge success, and quite popular too, but I think we are leaving money on the table. Thus far, all the POD's have pertained only to a small section of history, so I think, why not open it up? Not just "Hitler must die" but also stuff like "A Spartan victory at Thermopolyae" I mean, there are many more historical eras that could be explored in this Choose Your Own Alternate History kind of way. Of course, first we would have to wait until the heat dies down on the first one; it is just getting going, with more brainwashed slaves followers joining our ranks every day, we ought not pull the rug out from under their feet just yet.

TL;DR, I think we should explore different areas of history with the CYOAH genre, but not until a later date when we have plenty of minions community helpers, helpers who can not only be exploited, but also have begun to get bored with the current area of CYOAH; IE a stimulus package to stop CYOAH from pulling a 1983: DD.

Signed,

CYOAH lieutenant Jazon Naparleon

Jazon Naparleon 23:51, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

P.S.: For any "helpers" out there, I meant no offense when I refered to you as minions.

Deletion of certain years...
In CYOAH, there are two starter years that me and Jazon listed our reasons to delete here. We think that those pages and their subsequent pages should be deleted.

If your ok with this, than I can just delete them for you.

Eastward Expansion 22:50, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

Whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on here. EE, I hate to go JFK on your Cuban revolution here, but I never actually stated that I wished both of those to be deleted. But, TB, I must say that the 1971 offshoot is lacking in realism, or any real explanaion on how Hitler came to rule over all of Afro-Eurasia without a PoD until the seventies. The '61 offshoot is also lacking in those areas, henceforth, it is both my opinion, and that of the people, that they either be changed, or deleted. Your call.

Sincerely,

Lieutenant Fuhrer grammar Nazi, WSJ Chairman, CYOAH Lieutenant Jazon Naparleon 23:23, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

EE have edit my CYOAH Hitler dies in 1971, and changed putting some stupid things that I never put like controling all Afro-Eurasia, the original story is not like that I already change it, EE is a vandal with CYOAH. VENEZUELA 23:36, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

What? I just fixed grammar mistakes. The English was so ummmm....I got the impression that you meant for Hitler to control Europe and Africa, and I thought the readers deserved a little more explanation. Please don't go around calling people vandals without hearing there side of the story first. And Jazon, (that analogy with the Cuban Missile Crisis was great!) I supposed I thought you implied that, though I now recognize my mistake. Eastward Expansion 01:36, July 23, 2010 (UTC)

Dang it! I thought I was the grammar Nazi!Azecreth 16:47, July 23, 2010 (UTC)

"Lol" said the Grammar Nazi's assistant. Eastward Expansion 16:48, July 23, 2010 (UTC)

@Azecerth: You may be a GN as well, and becauseI am the LT. Fuhrer, I can put in a good word for you! ;)

@EE: W00t, I have an assistant!

@Tbguy: After a group effort, the '71 divergence non longer needs help, and now we are off to fix '61 as well.

Jazon Naparleon 17:02, July 23, 2010 (UTC)

Sounds nice, I think Ill give it a try..Duchland 19:37, July 29, 2010 (UTC)Duchland

A new CYOAH law
Damn unregistered contributors! I think a new CYOAH law should be laid down: No unregistered contributor may do anything on CYOAH! If they want to make a page, they may sign up, so we can tell whose incompetence to blame. If they wish to edit an existing page, well, TB, you, Aze, and I will deal with that! So what do you say? Will you ratify this new law, or shall we be forever plagued with fools who can get away with whatever they want? As evidence just look what they've done to the main CYOAH page! Not to mention this, this, and this! All suckish, rule-breaking edits/pages that should be deleted, not repeated! Before it is too late, ratify the new law, while Aze and I deal with the new additions.

Sincerely, Jazon Naparleon

Jazon Naparleon 15:57, August 2, 2010 (UTC)

Seconded Azecreth 17:43, August 2, 2010 (UTC)

New CYOAH POD
Okay, I'll think up something. I have an idea, that involves Napoleon, the Third Coalition, and Prussia, but I don't know how I should set up the first POD.

Actually, I was going to ahve it where Prussia could side with France, side with the Coalition at a point where it can make an actual difference in the war, or stay completely neutral, even after Napoleon violates it's territory. I'll put it up later. Azecreth 15:06, August 3, 2010 (UTC)

New POD is up. Let's go to it. Azecreth 20:57, August 3, 2010 (UTC)

Jaz's Request
Jazon has ordered me to give you a list of all the CYOAH pages that violate some CYOAH rule or have a red link,

Nuked USA

Hitler Dies 1971

Collapse of the 3rd Reich

Start of the fourth reich

Soviet American Invasion

I'm not done yet, but this is it for now.

Eastward Expansion 16:55, August 4, 2010 (UTC)

Well, I haven't noticed that. In the ones that I've done, you get to choose or its Goring. Eastward Expansion 16:22, August 5, 2010 (UTC)

Nomination
Hello Tbguy, I was wondering if you would be supportive of me nominating your "Choose Your Own Alternate History!" as a featured timeline? I haven't made any contributions on it myself but it seems to me to be a very creative addition to the site and definitely deserves a few weeks on the main page, especially as that would bring in new contributors to it. If you're hesitant though, keep in mind that by the time the nomination and stuff goes through and it becomes featured on the main page (which I'm betting it will) the entire project will be even bigger than it is already.

I know this question may be coming as a bit of a surprise, but I very much respect innovation and hard work and it seems to me that you've put in a lot of both here, and I think that it should be rewarded. So can I nominate it? Red VS Blue 18:59, August 5, 2010 (UTC)

Of course, I promise you that!

And the honor is mine I assure you! I've unfortunately never taken the time to contribute and I'd like to do my small part to help the project out. I hope that what I write for the nomination doesn't disappoint =P Red VS Blue 23:26, August 5, 2010 (UTC)

Russian Timeline
Hi, Have you seen my new Timeline, and the articles of And Broke into Pieces, My Russia. Please give your opinions of everything and feel free to edit it, please answer me. VENEZUELA 04:09, August 6, 2010 (UTC)

Hello As Always
Hello, friend!

1) Added your Garth Brooks idea to the Alternate Destinies (Napoleon's World). Have a look and see what you think.

2) I'm shooting blanks on the Alaskan War... I know how it ends, I'm just not sure how to sum it all up, if you know what I mean.

3) That being said, I remembered you wanting to guest-contribute to some of the TL's pages. Brazilian War (Napoleon's World), Cyrene War (Napoleon's World) and Siamese War (Napoleon's World) all need a little love. The basic description of each war is already in the beginning, and I'm sure you've read enough articles by now to understand the parallels of each war (Brazil is to ATL America what Vietnam was to OTL, Siam is to France what Afghanistan was to the Soviets, Cyrene War is like the first Gulf War, etc.).

For extra fun, it is the air operations in Siam orchestrated by a one General Schwarzenegger of the Air Command that makes him known in French political spheres... have fun!

4) Edited the Dreyfus Affair a little on the Iron Revolution page, but it's still the same basic idea you proposed.

5) Any other ideas?

Regards,

KingSweden 04:54, August 8, 2010 (UTC)

More or less, yes. The Alaskans are devastated but survive the American onslaught - the borders remain at the 51st parallel status quo, and the stagnant Lermontov line of Tsars is overthrown by Grand Duke Dmitrov and, of course, Anasenko. I think the ideas you pitched me were similar to ideas I already had in mind, so it's good to know that our minds are both working realistically based on our knowledge of true history. (Little something here for you, Mr. Canada: Kialgory = Calgary, Evgenigrad = Edmonton... any other big cities the Alaskans would be occupying? Aleksandrgrad = Alaska and Yunova = Juneau, btw).

That'd be great, since the Imperial General Staff idea was yours to begin with. Flesh it out if you'd like. Just make sure that a one "Ricard Cerf" is the Grand Marshall during the Iron Revolution - more information on that guy is on the specific article. Petain's death aboard the Titanesque could actually be a factor in the rise of Cerf and the success of the Iron Revolution...?

Well the 2012 election is still a ways away, obviously - we have to see how President Springsteen fares in the 2010 midterms. He's a lot more leftist than Leno and doesn't appeal to the center as well as his predecessor did - right now, if Rock loses in November and Springsteen's opinion polls continue to slide, then Kennedy is the Democratic frontrunner as well as possibly Colbert. Brian Williams and Steven Young look to be powerful National Party contenders.

There is a literature page currently, but it contains all sorts of stuff. I created the Film page to split from it, thinking that Yankovic would jump at the chance to fill it up with his ideas. Music and TV would be good, I haven't given either much thought.

KingSweden 06:00, August 8, 2010 (UTC)

I wrote a temporary 2012 election page, but Colbert is a possible Democratic choice - especially since it looks like centrist Democrats will pounce on the chance to nab the nom away from the far-left Springsteen. Leno's resignation may have seriously, seriously damaged the party. What do you think as far as Nationalist contenders go? You've got three strong Governors (Brian Williams of NY, the Palinesque Soph Katalana from NS, and Connecticut's Mormon Governor Steven Young, following in the Romneyian footsteps.)

That sounds great. Cerf is an integral part of the Iron Revolution, after all.

They're more guidelines than anything, but I've realized that the Alaskans and Americans have been killing each other off by the tens of thousands for two years and the ceasefire arranged immediately prior to the Dmitrov Coup isn't for a whole nother year... I only have a framework for the 1886 campaigns.

Regards,

KingSweden 06:33, August 8, 2010 (UTC)

Ideas from Bob
I think that following the trend of increasing liberalism in the British Empire, after the successes of various Indian commanders in the War, this would usher in a protracted era of rule by the Whigs. Whigs were essentially anti-imperialists and believed that they should if not stop, slow down conquests. Britain and her Empire would enter an era of slow expansion, and internal reflection and reform. However the bitterness of the Tory Party would ultimately result in it becoming more and more extreme. After the next war, the Whigs would be voted out, bringing in the reactionary and bitter Tories who never expected to rule. This would bring about a dark age for the British Empire, only ending in a civil war. Only ideas though, think of them what you will. Bob 17:42, August 8, 2010 (UTC)

Television
The article looks good. There's a few things I'm going to swap around and I'll fix the mess with the italics (they frustrate me too! arghhh) but it looks really good, very thoughtfully written.

The only things I'm changing:

Sebastien was coronated in the 1943, Albert II was coronated in 1975. And I imagined Reagan being on the air starting in the late 1950's or early 1960's. Other than that, tremendous job! It looks great.

KingSweden 06:44, August 10, 2010 (UTC)

TSPTF
FYI those nominees on the main page are from older times and no longer apply. We have new process when it comes to nominating people to the TSPTF: Alternative History:Request for user rights. Mitro 19:43, August 11, 2010 (UTC)
 * No one has been nominated yet, so if you have someone in mind go ahead and nominate them. Mitro 04:39, August 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * I can take a look at it. Give me a couple of days and I will message you with my comments. Mitro 04:50, August 12, 2010 (UTC)

TSPTF Lieutentancy
I would be honoured. Though I'm not too sure what I've got to do. Bob 08:07, August 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * If I may, just read the rules/requirements at Alternative History:Request for user rights. It explains everything there. Mitro 14:28, August 12, 2010 (UTC)

French Trafalgar
Yes, I tried checking out the world of FTBW (my abbreviation) and my only thought (so far) is that it just doesn't seem like it has a good portal page.Eastward Expansion 13:21, August 14, 2010 (UTC)

Well, you may want to use a format like this,

A Century after the Napoleonic Wars, Britain and France... (talk about their rivalry here)

In North America...

(Now Talk about other important powers)

This is the World of French Trafalgar, British Waterloo!

I know its probably not much help though...its a start.

Eastward Expansion 17:08, August 14, 2010 (UTC)

FTBW (From Bob)
I take it South Africa and Canada are Dominions and so are a different colour. Bob 15:00, August 17, 2010 (UTC)

Hey TB!
Well, I'd say that CYOAH is in the slump of what I refer to as Dragonfly Syndrome. I call it that because that was the first thing that came to mind. This is what happens in the immediate aftermath once the initial awesomeness of a new TL appearing has worn off. The would-be contributors are all waiting for a catalyst to re-ignite the once-bright burning flame. Eventually it will become "retro" and people will start contributing once more. I myself have constructed a blog to help these people help CYOAH, with a list of pages that need their attention. It is a near-complete list, and I'm working on it, though it will take some time.

I read through the portal page of FTBW, and I thought it was terrific! It does, however, have dozens of red links, and is by no definition complete, which brings me to my next point. Lately, I have seen that the pages you are creating are born from pages with all red links. While this is good, it is not as good as what could be done. I think the best coures of action would be to spawn pages from those with a mixture of red and blue links, thereby spreading uniformity, and opening more spots for contributors. It will all be done eventually of course, so no harm no foul.

Finally, I never noticed what the official PoD for French Trafalgar, British Waterloo is. What is it? If you never need any specific help on it, let me know, because usually I'm just bored and thinking up new CYOAH articles, which, more often than not, don't get published.

Anywho, that's just what's going on in my neck of the woods, so don't worry; CYOAH will be back on its feet and Prussia-ing in no time!

Regards,

Jazon Naparleon 19:43, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Hey
Hey TB, I've been meaning to come back to CYOAH for a while; but since the Hitler POD is drawing to a close, and I really don't know much about the Napoleonic POD, there hasn't been a lot that I could do. Anyhow, I'll help out with finishing the Hitler scenarios; and hopefully the next POD will be something I know more about.

As for your Timeline, I will certainly have a look and give you any advice that I can; but Napoleon is probably the Historical era I am least knowledgeable about. I'm quite good with the later 19th Century, though, so hopefully there is something I can do to help :) - Mister Sheen 01:01, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

You mean like setting up another POD? - Mister Sheen 12:28, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Right, that seems fair; as the Napoleonic POD is stilly pretty new. And I'll be sure to have a closer look at FTBW, and offer any help I can :) - Mister Sheen 12:54, August 22, 2010 (UTC)

Template
Hey TB, I was wondering how do you get that big fact template on your user page? Ownerzmcown 06:10, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Northwest Confederacy in FTBW
I had an idea for a nation covering the former Northwest Territory. It will mean changes in the American Civil War, but it is pretty cool and will lead to new directions for the USA and the CSA. In OTL, there were a number of civil rights abuses made by the Republican Govt. Not just that but Missouri fought a bloody guerrilla war and the common feeling was a friendliness towards the South and if it weren't for one spy then the Northwest would have gained independence. With Britain aiding the Confederates, a lot of British troops would help form this new state. Because of this aid they would probably be firmly in the British camp. After the war, the French itching for more influence in North America help the chafing Texans achieve their independence, placing a puppet King on their throne as King of Texas. Because of a loss of land in the direction of the Pacific, the USA and CSA turn their bellicose wrath on Africa, thinking back to Liberia. What do you think? I suppose if you don't want it to happen in the Civil War, there is every chance that the South, wanting to humiliate the North would want to summon their British allies and tear the Northwest from them to stop them in their Pacific march. But the Kingdom of Texas sounds good doesn't it. I like the idea of a homegrown American monarchy. Bob 15:59, August 22, 2010 (UTC)

Are the Falkland Islands a dependency of South Africa? Oh and by the way, if the Russians had extended their empire as far as this is shown, they wouldn't have to worry about any costs because those areas like British Columbia were profitable, so if their is to be an independent Alaska it would be a lot smaller.Bob 19:30, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

Your Time Line is good
Hi, TB. I don't like doing conversations by bouncing between user talk pages. Any discussion on a particular subject should be all in one place -- at least if I am meant to follow it. :-)

Your analysis of the UK becoming a superpower at the expense of the US is brilliant. It just took me a little while to see how losing to the French would be such a turning point. Personally, I think 1812 is too soon for them to build up their forces after loosing a major conflict less than a decade earlier. In OTL it took Germany from 1919 to 1939 to pull off the same feat.

Overall, though, the time line works well, and deserves further exposure. How hard would it me to change the name of the time line? I am not up on all the technical stuff (though I have "moved" one or two articles). I don't know what you would call it, but it's a thought worth considering. SouthWriter 20:33, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

FTBW
I read the the history up to 1831. I plan to read the rest later. I don't know much about Napoleon, but the TL seemed pretty interesting. I am more knowledgable on American history, so I do have a few questions and comments concerning that (with a few other questions and comments thrown in):


 * You mention the British downsizing the military in 1808 but managing to gather a large enough force to fight in America, how is this possible?
 * Andrew Jackson would not be made Sec of War during the War of 1812. At that point he was only an obscure western politician. He hadn't made his name yet outside of Tennessee, which he would do serving in the military during the War of 1812 (or in this ATL the First Americas War). You also have Jackson being the Sec of War and leading troops at Albany, which is very unlikely. The Sec of War is a civilian position.
 * I'm curious about whether the Star Spangled Banner would still be the American anthem. Though the events that led to its creation seemed to have still occured, we have America coming out of this war a confirmed loser. OTL, the US neither lost nor won the War of 1812, it was a white peace. Nevertheless, Americans see the War of 1812 as a point where we confirmed our independence by fighting for our rights as a sovereign nation against another nation who was trampling them. With the bitter taste of defeat, I am not sure if the US would approve of a poem created during one of the war's battles.
 * Britain wins the First Americas War, but yet leaves the Indians out to dry. One of the goals of the British during the War of 1812 was to create an independent native state in the Midwest. It seems they would have the same goals in this ATL since they were supplying various Indian nations with weapons.
 * The Federalists were always pro-British, seems odd they would adopt a French policy to rebuild the US or for that matter form an alliance with them. Later I realized you wrote that they suffered for that in the next election, but I doubt they would do it in the first place.
 * You said the United States created a permanent army during the King Administration, but the US has had a standing army since 1784. You should probably change that to say they increased the size of the army.
 * Would France and Russia really cooperate post-Napoleon victory?
 * Is it the First Americas War or the First Anglo-American War? You use both names in your TL.
 * I don't think France would care to much about Spain's colonial empire. The British had more of a stake in the outcome because they were better placed to snatch up some good trade deals.
 * I don't think the Confederation of the Carribean is a viable nation. Attempts have been made in the past to unite the region and have always failed. Why do you feel in this ATL it would happen? Also why does Puerto Rico succeed in gaining independence when in OTL they are still controlled by a foreign nation?
 * I think the death of Napoleon would have led immediately into another major war on the continent as the defeated powers attempted to destroy French control of the continent. You still have war happening shortly thereafter, I just think the timetable would be earlier IMHO.

Well that is what I got so far. I'll message you again when I read the next chapter. Mitro 00:53, September 1, 2010 (UTC)

Alright I finished reading the next chapter, but here are a few things I want to say in regard to your last message:


 * At first the US military was primarily Militia, except for forces stationed in the western frontier and at West Point. However by 1791 the US government was already expanding the size of the regular army. Furthermore, I don't think the US would have a full volunteer army in the 19th century, that is a 20th century creation brought on by Vietnam. The US might follow a conscription model so they always have a large regular army.
 * Jackson would certainly serve in the war and if he gets credit for saving Albany he probably can use that fame to catapult himself into national politics.
 * Common interest has always existed in that region of the world, but real people don't always see that. Consider how better it would have been for South America if Bolivar's dream of some large federation was a reality. Would the US have even tried to intervene and carve out bannana republics? But people don't always see the big picture and lets face it, hindsight is 20/20. Take the West Indies Federation of OTL. It failed for several reasons even if it would have been better for all of those island nations to be together. The larger islands felt they were carrying the weight of the smaller islands, there was nationalism and lack of popular support to deal with.
 * Its hard to be loyal to a foreign empire. That was one of Napoleon's problems in OTL. His wars and occupations ignited the nascent nationalism of many countries in Europe. It doesn't matter how benevolent someone is or how much they can benefit your country, people don't like being dominated by a foreign power, even indirectly. Look at the insurgencies in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Now onto my comments for the next chapter:
 * What happened to the Royal Navy? The most powerful navy in Europe got its ass kicked.
 * I don't think Frederick William would take his exile in a Muslim Empire. There had to be some minor European nation that would take him in.
 * I don't think you spent enough time on the divide between slave and free states in America. That issues was #1 concern of any American politician trying to make it in national politics and it affected the fighting of the OTL Mexican-American War.
 * The US was still an isolationist country. Washington's farewell speech affected American diplomacy all the war until 1914.
 * Questions on India: why doesn't France have more control? What happened to the British East India Company? Why are the French in Bombay, wasn't that city founded by the British?
 * You might want to consider renaming the Central American Republic to Grand Colombia.
 * How did the Liberty Party win the Presidency? Even if they diversified their platform in this ATL, they would never be popular outside of New England.

That's all for now, I will get to the next chapter by tomorrow. Mitro 02:39, September 2, 2010 (UTC)

I thought you would like this quote:

We look at this as the best of all possible worlds, but the French know it isn't, because most people speak English. -Mark Olson at the "Histories: The Way We Weren't" panel at Boskone 28

Mitro 18:07, September 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * Hey just wanted to check in and say that I have not forgotten about your TL, its just that I have had some issues in my real life to take care of. I promise to get back to work reviewing your TL soon. Mitro 14:10, September 13, 2010 (UTC)

Alright I finally got some time to read more of the TL and here is what I have to say;
 * Would the Germans really support the Republicans in Italy? They had to be worried about such a thing happening in their own territory.
 * Why did the Liberal Party form a coalition with Buchanan? And if they were also responsible for his failures, shouldn't they have suffered more in the polls?
 * Please choose someone else other than Robert E. Lee to be president of the CSA. I'm sorry but it is one of the biggest cliches in alternate history and an implausible one too.  I don't think he ever showed any interest in higher office during his life.  Plus he was supposed to did in 1870, he is an old guy.  Even if he did decide to run and get elected, the stress of being president would probably mean his early death.
 * When France lost the Franco-Prussian War in OTL it led to a revolution that established the Third Republic. Yet here France loses this global war and everything seems calm politically.  I think you need to detail some of the post-war changes a little better.
 * Unlikely the Turks and Russians would be so buddy buddy in this TL. They have a long history of fighting each other and I think that will continue even with your POD and the subsequent changes.
 * The Confederacy would not industralize. That would mean high tarrifs and a large government to finance the infrastructure expansion, the exact same things (besides slavery) that the CSA was fighting a civil war over.  They would likely remain primarily agricultural.
 * President Blaine going to war in 1882 against everyone else on the continent of North America, seems way to much like How Few Remain.

Mitro 20:46, September 22, 2010 (UTC)

Superpowers
haha I was just gonna suggest that lol It's a deal. I'll try to do what Mitro's doing and give you some detailed feedback, but you only have to go that far for mine if you want to, cause the timeline is pretty long lol I'm pretty busy today so I don't think I'll be able to do that today, but I might be able to find the time somewhere =) Red VS Blue 11:30, September 2, 2010 (UTC)

Wow, I managed to finish up with my plans a lot quicker than I expected lol So I'll check out your timeline in a bit Red VS Blue 13:33, September 2, 2010 (UTC)

FTBW (Red)
Ok, I figure I'll give you my analysis in chunks that follow the way that you divided the timeline yourself. Also I'll see what Mitro has been asking and I'll try to avoid the same questions (unless I'm still confused :P ) As a consequence of that I have a few praises to offer as well on things I especially like about the timeline =D


 * I'll start off by saying I really like the description of the Battle of Trafalgar. The tactics you talk about are very sound and I wonder, how different are the events of that ATL battle to the one OTL? (I suppose I could research it...)
 * On that note, if the British Navy was spread out so thin (with only 20 ships at the largest battle of their life) why wouldn't they renege on the Peace of Copenhagen and press the fight to the French once they'd regrouped? In OTL, the UK had enough fight left after Trafalgar to keep going for another 10 years of war. I don't think that the loss of 9 ships would disturb that.
 * How did Napoleon unite Italy so easily? Napoleon's OTL Italian Kingdom was a tiny rump state in the north, but this one includes the Papal States and the Kingdom of Naples. Even in OTL the Italians themselves were opposed to being united when it was Italians, not French doing the uniting.
 * I like the bit about Andrew Jackson, I know I wouldn't want to meet him in a war haha I heard about how once during his presidency when someone ran up to him and shot off a gun in his face (it misfired) and then pulled another one which also misfired, Jackson didn't blink an eye and started to beat the attacked with his cane. The assassination attempt ended with Jackson's aides having to restrain him (the President!) to stop him from beating his would-be-assassin. Anyway, just thought I'd share that fun story
 * How are so many countries instituting sweeping education and military reforms so quickly? In the former case even Victorian England couldn't provide full education for the people of London, and the British Empire was a lot richer than the Austrian Empire. One thing to consider with expanding the military, there are pretty serious upkeep costs, does Russia have a reason to expand its fleet in the Black Sea?
 * Lastly for now, what happened to slavery in the British Empire? The Slave Trade was banned by an act of parliament after this POD and slavery itself wasn't banned until 1833 or so. Is it the same here?

That's all for now. I'm enjoying the timeline though, and am looking forward to hearing your replies, plus your thoughts on my own timeline. Cheerio =D Red VS Blue 20:32, September 2, 2010 (UTC)

Perez Jimenez's Venezuela
Hi Tbuguy1992, I'm just wondering why do you thing Perez Jimenez's Venezuela is nationalistic. VENEZUELA 04:53, September 11, 2010 (UTC)

Hi Tbuguy here are my answers:


 * 1) about the oil and europeans, that was true it all happen in OTL, in fact the dictatorship protected all the people that came with the inmigration, and ALL were pro-Jimene, my grandfathers were Jimenistaz and they come from one of this inmigrations,


 * 1) About Guyana, I'd haven't think of that form, but the uprising against Guyana were real. the people there wanted to be Venezuelans, maybe I will delete that part, but I did because Perez Jimenez invaded a Colombian island that they have taken us, and know is ours, and we invaded and annexed Ankoko Island from Guyana in 1966, and neither Guyana and UK respond.

I wish I answer your question and change your opinion, regards. VENEZUELA 17:06, September 11, 2010 (UTC)
 * 1) I haven't really think about the part of Cuba. But Venezuela was a growing baby at the time, so why they would send forces to Cuba. when their master, USA did not sended, but maybe Venezuela could contribute to the invasion of Pig Bays, and instead like OTL where they sended just a ship to the missile crisis, he could send a float.
 * 2) And about the Venezuelan economic crisis, it happened, because Mexico enter in crisis during the Iraq-Iran war, so they ask us to pay them their internal debt, causing chaos in the country, and making more expensive everything, but at Perez Jimenez's time, we doesn't have external debt, which would have not caused this crisis, and the external debt started in the Carlos Andres Perez presidency because he manipulated bad the money.

Well I'm gonna add the part of the UN and the US veto, and the part of the crisis, thank you for helping me turning this real, also what do you think about Venezuela having the biggest building in the world in the 1970's at the oil boom in Venezuela. VENEZUELA 18:46, September 11, 2010 (UTC)

French Trafalgar
Hey Tbguy, I just figured I'd get back to you about FTBW (you asked for some input a few weeks ago). I've been looking over the Timeline, and you really have covered all the bases; it's one of the best I've seen on here!

One suggestion: a War in Siam (Thailand). Since the British lose some of their hold in India (which was basically their most prized Colony), they would presumably want to claim some more land in South Asia to make up for it; and they would likely look towards Siam. And on the other side of Siam is Indochina - probably France's strongest colony outside of Africa.

My understanding is that Siam was a kind of buffer state between French Indochina and the British Raj, so if Britain tried to expand into Siamese territory, it might spark another Franco-British conflict.

The 1820s, 1850s or 1880s would be the most likely time for this War, as that was when the British were trying to push East of India in OTL (based on the dates of the Anglo-Burmese Wars).

Any thoughts? - Mister Sheen 20:52, September 12, 2010 (UTC)


 * Yeah, I could certainly see a "Siamese Crisis" being either the prelude to a Franco-British War, or a narrowly-avoided World War. If you do decide to use it, I'll do some research into Siamese politics/military/society at the time, to see how they might react.


 * If I think of anything else, I'll let you know :) - Mister Sheen 15:49, September 13, 2010 (UTC)

Napoleonic Wars Map Game
The first turn has started!

Television/Brian Mulroney
You have a good eye, that is Mulroney. I needed a picture to represent Burwin (since he's a fictional character). Similar instances would be President Elizabeth Shannon (used the picture of Geraldine Ferraro), Adam Eisler (obscure Florida Senator Frank Stone), Clyde Dawley (former Idaho Senator Frank Church). I've also done this for some Alaskans (Yakov Sighovaryin = Anton Antonov, Svetlana Karalova = Yuliya Tymoschenko, Nikolai II = the King of Norway, etc.) and I really went overboard with this practice on my Alaskan War page.

From what little I know of Mulroney, though, I've determined that Canadians view him as a gigantic prick and a blemish on the office of Prime Minister, so he fits perfectly as the arbiter of John D. Burwin, who is a less noble, more slimy and less likable Bill Clinton. I haven't fleshed it out yet, but his extramarital affairs extended far beyond two actresses and actually bordered on the completely illegal, and Romney grants him a pardon similar to the one given to Nixon by Ford in the late 1990's to end a turbulent decade that saw the Lipcourt scandal and two unpopular Presidents (Redford and Burwin) lose in their reelection campaigns by heavy margins.

Second! Two notes on your television page. I love the work you've done on it, it looks really, really good. Just a thought though: shouldn't NBCable be the conservative-leaning cable channel, since Ronald Reagan anchored The Ronald Reagan Show from 1959 to 1980 and Tonight with Ronald Reagan until his retirement on regular broadcast NBC? Clinton's more liberal programs were always on ABC, as a direct competition to the right-leaning Reagan forum shows on their competing channel. I like the Sarah Palin throw-in for the Revolution of '91 btw.

Also, a quick pointer: the televised broadcast celebrating the end of the French Civil War would be given by Sebastien, the victor of the conflict. Albert I died in 1939 and Edmond committed suicide during in November 1943 when Paris fell to the European Alliance (this is a page/event I haven't been ambitious enough to start working on yet, unfortunately :P)

Everything else looks fantastic though!

KingSweden 04:28, September 16, 2010 (UTC)

FTBW Venezuela
Hi Tbuguy I like yout timeline it gave the idea to do this: The Turbulent 1910's and Roaring 1920s for Central World, but I write you to know the following: In which year FTBW finish in 2010? and what is the Great Senate of Venezuela in the Venezuelan article also you have bad the Venezuelan flag if Chavez is not president, if he's not use the one I add to the 1983 Venezuela's article, also if the year is not 2010 the flag must be changed because the pre-2006 flag was adopted in 1930. Please Answer. VENEZUELA 23:27, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

Of course I will help, maybe in the Venezuelan article, but just to know, here in Latin America they teach us that we are independent because of Napoleon's invasion of Spain. so why is the South American map so different? like Venezuela. Also in the part of Bolivar you mentioned the treaty of Batoga but I think you're confused with Bogota. regards. VENEZUELA 23:50, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

yes. VENEZUELA 00:25, September 25, 2010 (UTC)

I want to know why Venezuela has less and more territory?VENEZUELA 00:37, September 25, 2010 (UTC)

Here is the Venezuelan flag from 1863-1930 and the coat from 1863-1954. VENEZUELA 23:04, September 26, 2010 (UTC)

Flood of '97
I completely forgot about adding the Flood of '97 to the Assiniboia article. That's kind of odd, because my grandparents (on my mom's side) were living (and still are living) in Morris at the time. They told me that the flood destroyed my Grandmother's wedding dress. And on Winnipeg, since the radiation doesn't last forever, I thought that the radioactive zone around Winnipeg would slowly contract to blast crater before vanishing completely. This would mean that it might be safe enough to restore the floodway without getting radiation sickness.

Yankovic270 23:31, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

Quick Answers to your Questions about Virginia
Here's my response to your comments
 * 1) Great idea! Of course he would serve in the military. The military is the largest employer in Virginia.
 * 2) I don't think Stephen Colbert has every really ranted about the government on his show. All his jabs at the government (especially under Bush) were usually disguised as praise or innocent comments.
 * 3) He might dance around mocking the President-General, but it's basically open season on every other member of the government. Now that the Republicans are the Virginian Republic equivilent of the NDP (or maybe the Bloc Quebequois), that means that he can start targeting GOP candidates and let his true Democratic values out.
 * 4) I still want it to known as the Colbert Report, and I want it to be the mostly the same as OTL except for one thing. Instead of being a radical Republican, Colbert plays a radical Democrat or Federalist (the Virginian equivilent of the OTL Republican Party with some OTL Democrats thrown in). Besides, It just wouldn't be the Colbert Report without Colbert acting brash and obnoxious.
 * 5) As far as I'm concerned I think Jon Stewart would have a show on Virginian TV too. I want it to be known as the Daily Show as well.

Yankovic270 16:17, September 25, 2010 (UTC)

Since the Virginian Republic encountered Jerry Falwell's provisional Virginia state government in 1997, and since this government was probabbly to the east of the college (or it included the college (the history is still pretty vague about Provisional Virginia's borders)) I would guess that they would enter the town arround 1997-1998.

Yankovic270 17:45, September 25, 2010 (UTC)


 * Actually, Lynchburg is 40 miles northwest of the college - and three counties over. Yank's description of the towns run from the "ceremonial" governor's office describes an arch covering 130 miles over seven counties in the foothills of the Appalachian Mountains. This would be a natural area for Thomson's troops to come marching into town. If the extent of the provisional government was spread to include Hampden-Sydney would have tripled the size of the survival community and probably made it much more difficult to overwhelm. Rather than extend Falwell's Virginia, it would probably to assume a more gradual extension toward the coast -- putting off acquisition of Appromatix county and parts east for months if not a year or two. By that time, of course, Colbert would be in his mid-thirties and working hard to keep his adopted home town safe from invasion. I suppose, though, after fifteen years the relative peace of the regimented life of a soldier might appeal to man.


 * As for Jon Stewart, he went to school in Williamsburg, on the coast. He would have long since become a citizen of Delmarva. His political satire would be a sure instigator of the "resistance" in that coastal community to the advancement of the Republic of Virginia. I don't see him being popular on Virginia TV. However, in post-Tompson Virginia it is a possibility. SouthWriter 20:09, September 25, 2010 (UTC)

Jon Stewart could be a popular host on Delmarvan TV. He and Colbert could have a "rivalry/friendship" (like in OTL) that is a more friendly version of the rivalry between Virginia and Delmarva. Colbert's overzealous onscreen persona and Stewart's sardonic humour make them perfect matches for the nations they represent.

Yankovic270 20:27, September 25, 2010 (UTC)


 * That's the spirit. Now the lives of these young college students just have to be molded by the circumstances -- survival and life with few luxuries for at least a decade -- into the characters we know today. We can assume that their personalities are more or less the same (nature vs. nurture) and that they would become comedians no matter what. Again, it takes some of the tedium of the dystopia out of the way. SouthWriter 20:35, September 25, 2010 (UTC)

Though there is a change to the Colbert Report. Because of the fact that the Republican party is more or less a minor political party now, Colbert's onstage (and onscreen) character is an overconfident uber-Democrat/Federalist rather than an uber-Republican. It's basically a caricature of his own personal political beliefs.

Yankovic270 21:10, September 25, 2010 (UTC)


 * In OTL, Colbert indeed is a Democrat, and as such is able to take the other side's view and exaggerate it with great success. However, when it comes to sarcastically presenting one's own views, I am not so sure he would succeed so well.  He is not like Leno and Letterman, knocking both sides equally for a quick laugh.  Instead, he has built a persona that makes fun of the opposition.  Every once in a while his religious convictions make him sympathetic to his character's conservatism - but only very  rarely.  The humor would not be as effective if he ridiculed the ruling class  with which he agreed.  I never have understood the almost complete eradication of the Republican Party in Virginia - but that's an argument for another place. SouthWriter 21:58, September 25, 2010 (UTC)

The reason I don't wish to deal with the Republicans in either Vandalia (in Illinois) or Virginia is simple. I hate the Republicans. Any political party that can choose George W. Bush for President is bad in my book.Anyway, could we have Colbert be a temorary stop-gap Senator selected by Thomspon to serve out the rest of a dead senator's term? Simply put, I want Colbert to mostly stay a comedian. And could someone please start Jon Stewart's article?

Yankovic270 21:35, September 26, 2010 (UTC)

Chile in FT, BW
I saw the article about Chile, and i ask myself, what is the Assembly of Chile? And if Chile is defeated in the war against Argentina, Peru and Venezuela, which is his post-war situation? Greatings and thanks for you attention --Katholico 22:02, September 26, 2010 (UTC)

New Ideas for South America in FTBW
Hi, Tbuguy1992, I came with a better idea for South America, well in OTL the main causes of independence war were: inspiration because of USA independence, Inspiration from the French Revolution, and finally the French Invasion of Spain, in which at least in Venezuela, because of the abdication of the king to his son, the government of Venezuela tricked the Spanish government saying that they recognize the original spanish government which was soon used as a trick for start the war, so what do you think that because of the joint spanish-french invasion of UK, the Latin American governments decide to use this moment to fight for independence? VENEZUELA 02:48, September 28, 2010 (UTC)

And also remember that Holland was later annexed by the French, and parts of Italy, also look this map I think this would be the map of Europe after the war except of the part of Spain and Portugal, and what do you think of France annexing UK after the Prussian war and turning English into a minor language but later let it free as a puppet named Empire de la Grande-Bretagne with the house of Bonaparte as the royal family. VENEZUELA 02:55, September 28, 2010 (UTC)

Ok! Also I'm creating a better World Map here is the Preview. VENEZUELA 04:25, September 28, 2010 (UTC)

The Attack at Minot
Hi, TB, I read what you wrote at Yank's talk page, but I did not want to butt in to a private conversation, so here I am. Anyway, you wrote:


 * But that leads to another question: what would see as the attack on Minot Air Force Base? Everyone in my area say that if WWIII did happen we would have been killed because of the explosion itself, but I think a smaller weapon would have been used, and we would have had to worry about fallout more than the actual detonation. I may have to write out my grandfather (Ken Bugg) because of that, though some people in SW Manitoba would still have survived after the fallout runs its course. 

You have followed a common misunderstanding - or at least from my info is a misunderstanding. Many writers assume nearby blasts will spread fallout to their locations without considering the prevailing winds. Up on the border of Saskatchawan and Manatoba the fallout from Minot (not the base, but the nearby silos) would spread east and slightly south, not reaching much (if at all) above the border. Lower Assinobia might have a little fallout trouble, though. SouthWriter 05:31, September 30, 2010 (UTC)

Map
Hi Tb, would you like to play mi new map game, WwIII 1962 (Map Game) also I'm almost finishing the flag map. VENEZUELA 18:16, September 30, 2010 (UTC)

like what nations would fall under Marxism? also I think the Ottomans would collapse winning or losing WWI, they were very weak because of the Ottoman laws. VENEZUELA 04:13, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

Assiniboia/Colbert
Go ahead and add what you want to Assiniboia. Any changes that would improve my masterpiece are sorely welcome. There are some plans I have on the article. I am planning to have an Assiniboian businessman build a "Disney" theme park, which is unliscenced until the Assinboian makes contact with the remants of Disney presumably operating in either the ANZC or the NAU. In the same section, I was planning for the Assiniboians taking atvanage of their central location (between Canada, the Dakotas, the NAU, and Athabaska) by building a new Las Vegas in an abandoned town. They'd get a new source of income from the tourists. I'm also planning on them having a deal with the Athabaskans to slowly reclaim the part of Saskatchewan uncontrolled by the Provisional Canadian regime in the NAU.

I like what you've done with the Colbert article. I have some ideas for it. I think that in places where there aren't many TV sets, the Virginians play Colbert Report episodes in movie theaters, like the old news reels. It would also be interesting to have them produce an animated episode every April Fool's Day. Seeing a cartoon version of an already pretty cartoony character would be pretty funny. Could you also mention the friendly rivalry going on between Colbert and Delmarvan comedian Jon Stewart in the article?

Yankovic270 20:42, September 30, 2010 (UTC)

You know, the more I read your last message, the more pissed of I get. Everyone knows that morale is important, and both of my ideas were to boost Assiniboian morale. Did you even read my message? I said that the animated Colbert Report was a single episode a year on April Fool's Day. Assiniboia is has a population of about 2,000,000, and has grown economically strong shipping grain to the Provisional Canada in the NAU, Canada, Athabaska, and the Dakotas. Do you really think they would let the infastructure deteriorate, especially with grain being the biggest part of the economy? I could see tourists coming from all over the place. Via land for in two directions, and via the sea in another. The region isn't so devastated that a return to normalcy is impossible. While I agree that Colbert might have a radio show, most of what you wrote was overly pessimistic garbage. 27 years is plenty of time for the region to restore itself enough for my ideas to become a reality. Basically most of your message wildly underestimates the ability of humanity to survive even the worst catastophe. If the rapid recovery of Japan after WWII thaught us anything, it's that it is possible for a region struck by atomic weapons to recover economically, and even prosper! I only imagined the Assiniboia ideas happening in the last 2-3 years.

Yankovic270 01:57, October 1, 2010 (UTC)


 * Cool down, Yank. TB is as pessimistic as the original creators of this time line were, that's all.  If the creators of the time line had been as optimistic as you and me, the US administration would not have abandoned North America in the first place.  But you yourself assumed total collapse in West Virginia in a capital that was not hit by nukes.  So your initial vision of the area was one of utter failure of mankind to sustain order in time of crisis.


 * What is it with the odd-ball holidays, Yank? The first elections in the VR were on Halloween (rather than a few days later on the first Tuesday of November as is traditional in America). Now, a special cartoon is prepared for "April Fool's Day."  I agree, though, a single animation would give artists some work, and provide images for marketing  (maybe the government could liscence the Colbert image for propoganda purposes).  Besides that, the cartoonists could work for Colbert - maybe a weekly strip to illustrate some point he wants to make to a wider audience.


 * As far as rebuilding after the war - Japan had massive help from the very government that bombed them. It the case of this doomsday, the government ran away and didn't send help back for over 25 years!  Assinobia had its major city - Winnepeg - destroyed and its southern frontier (North Dakota) bombarded with ground level nuclear explosions - creating irradiated ground and tons of fallout.  And the home government in Ottawa had been run out of town - if they survived at all - to set up ship in the maritime provinces.  No help there.  It's left up to the scattered towns to put things back together.  Sure, the roads have to be maintained so grain can be shipped.  The trade with neighbors, though, would hardly make them "rich."  They would need to have things that were in short supply.  Fuel, machinery, a variety of foodstuffs to suppliment home grown food and game -- all in exchange for grain and oil pressed from shale.  The entertainment centers in Assinobia really wouldn't work.  How much traffic comes to Manitoba in OTL to enjoy the pleasures known only to those in the subtropics of the Southwest and deep south?


 * Virginia, on the other hand, needed a lot of work. You provided the incentive through massive government control over the region.  We never have established just how a few hundred men could accomplish this, but it has been established to be that way, so it is.  Any way, I've written enough.  I just wanted to check your mood swing here.  :-)


 * I hope you have a good day. SouthWriter 13:55, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

Contributing to 1983DD
TBguy, we love having you contributing to the sanity in this time line. A lot of what we have is teenagers in a role playing game. True historians, and historian wannabes, have to take the feasable along with the plausible when dealing with the diversity that this genre draws to its pages. If you've read much of this time line, you've seen that Yank, and to a certain extent Arstar, are trying to build their own little worlds. Arstar has done a better job of transitioning to this time line than has Yank, I think, but if you wish to contribute to articles, you might want to avoid to many edits of articles they "control."

Arstar has become a bit ambitious lately, adopting articles of established nations intending to improve them. For some of them, though, he is just "caretaker," and these might be articles you might be able to improve. Or you could work with Brian in his many projects - he is very easy to work with. I understand your wish to contribute to Assinobia, though, since it is your home. Unfortunately, it is Yank's home as well! My suggestion is to put the article under review -- then in discussion the community could decide what was more viable. Review works by the changes being discussed, and if approved being implemented. If after 30 days, though, your changes are not approved, the article reverts back to the way it was prior to your "complaint," complete with full recognition of the original version. SouthWriter 14:24, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

Changed Destiny
Hello, I am a new user to this site, and recently inquired about potential collaborators on the main page discussion thing. I was then pointed to the experts page, which led me to you. Looking at your page, you look like you have plenty of projects on your hand, so I understand completely if you cannot respond to this or help. My timeline is about an alternate America, and is very centered on the development of this alternate America. But, I would like to flesh out the rest of the world. The only thing I've established about the rest of the world is that Napoleon beat the British in Europe (No betrayal of the Spanish is the mini-POD for that). But, after that, I am at a bit of a loss as to what would have happened. How would Europe have developed after the Napoleonic Wars, with half of Europe under French control? Would the hegemony eventually be broken? And, to be a bit more specific: Would France try to regain French Guyana? Leave it to the Americans? Would it be reasonable for the Americans to demand Britain give independence to their area of the Guyanas (pr to hand it over to America)?

Wow, that was quite a rant. Sorry about that. Get back to me if you can. Thanks! Randomideaguy 23:36, October 3, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome back, TB!
Oh man, school has been a killer; I can hardly find time to visit the computer anymore, let alone work on CYOAH! Eventually, I'll make time, and we will gather the hearts and minds of the people, as we reglorify CYOAH!

To Victory!

Jazon Naparleon 02:51, October 4, 2010 (UTC)

Titanic
I guess the big question always is why? A survivor state is probably strapped for cash and would likely not fund an expedition of this sort. The ADC might have the resources, but at the same time you have to consider history. Its only been a few months since the Saguenay War has ended, and its always assumed there is some sort of fighting going on in Sicily. Also there is the question of why this one act would strengthen them in the first place. Is finding the Titanic really likely to bring them together? Mitro 03:45, October 4, 2010 (UTC)

Re: Central World
Yes!!! I would be glad if you create an article!! Central World is growing! it's on the Hot Spots of the page, create what you want! regards, VENEZUELA 15:52, October 12, 2010 (UTC)

Timeline I do in my spare non-CYOAH time
Yeah. This is about my timeline The Last Chance for Peace. I do it in my spare time, when I'm not trying to finish the pages I start on CYOAH. I was wondering if youi could like check what I have so far, and offer suggestions and advice? That would be good if you could. I also understand if you are too busy to. Azecreth 17:55, October 13, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for our opinion. I appreciate the comments. Currently I am working on events outside of europe, and starting the ATL WW1. I guess I could also expnd on WHY Wilhelm didn't back Austria against Russia. As you can see, it is still a work in progress, so I may come back to you later for another reality check. Azecreth 11:39, October 14, 2010 (UTC)

Political turmoil in Britain in FTBW
Please don't use that BUF take over Britain stereotype. If anything, we would have become socialist. Fascists were laughed at whereas socialists were taken seriously. Bob 08:45, October 16, 2010 (UTC)

You make a good point, but the view that socialism is a dangerous violent ideology is a view of the establishment not the potential revolutionaries. OTL, Britain was a fiery, highly political place in the 20's. But fascists did not dominate the scene. Our largest radical political group were the Greenshirts, in favour of Social Credit. Look it up on wikipedia if you don't know. The unemployment and weakening of Britain following a great patriotic war, would stir sentiments of the left rather than the right. Besides, European style fascism has always felt faintly ridiculous in Britain. Mosley in his jackboots and peaked cap looked out of place in the traditional British right. Even Hitler felt that Mosley imitated him and Mussolini too closely, believing that the image of the English country gentleman was more likely to appeal to the right wing in Britain. Nazis in Britain are always a thing to point and laugh at. That was how we kept our balance against the right. Socialism on the other hand was taken much more seriously. At one point there was almost a mass armed rebellion which ran out of steam due to lack of central control. But it was taken seriously enough that Churchill called lodly for troops to be pulled out of Ireland, no matter the consequences, and use them to put down the revolution. But the right wing and the left wing are inextricably linked in Britain. Mosley started off as a member of the Labour Party and held aloft the policies of FDR in the USA as the way to run a country. Over time he turned to fascism. Bob 16:45, October 16, 2010 (UTC)

Answers and Questions
Hi Tbuguy1992 first of all, about the ships and all that of Central World, you should create the Technology article, also remember the world is more advanced, and second, in FTBW during the dezcolonization era, is there going to be a French Commonwealth? VENEZUELA 16:38, October 17, 2010 (UTC)

Well, as you state in FTBW there will be 3 WW so ethnic nationalism would instead start after OTL WWI and not OTL WWII, the europeans powers would have not managed to stay with their colonies, so France as you state, is more dictatorial, and for controling their former colonies they create a "commonwealth". VENEZUELA 16:50, October 17, 2010 (UTC)