Alternative History talk:TSPTF

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Visual Editor
Visual Editor is now online on the wiki. However, personally, and I have receieved the same view from others, the new editor is a bit of a pain and quite annoying. Now for those user who do not know, you can still use the old editor by changing personal preferences and choosing the "Classic Wiki-editor".

Although I would like toknow what the general opinion of this new editor is and if we should generally still use the old wiki-editor throughout the wiki? Imp (Say Hi?!) 19:46, November 13, 2014 (UTC)

I have seen a lot of people upset about the new editor, including EoGuy, LaptopZombie, and Crim to name a few, and personally have sent messages to some people showing them how to switch back to the old editor. Based on that I'd say the new editor is very unpopular. Perhaps we should hold a vote here. Mscoree (talk) 20:42, November 13, 2014 (UTC)

In Eo's case, he needs source mode- so for him it's justified. I can't speak for LZ, but Crim is being a whiny old fusspot.

I personally love the new system.

22:56, November 13, 2014 (UTC)

With regards to map games, I don't like the new editor, although for editing timelines or general articles I like it. However, I don't know if we as a wiki have the authority to change something on that scale, and I think there would be opposition if we could. I think we should just ensure that people know how to switch back if they want to.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 23:01, November 13, 2014 (UTC)

The new one is garbage except that it makes editing templates easier. I still use the old format  (classic or whatever). I vote to have a vote.

23:47, November 13, 2014 (UTC)

Me, I've always used source mode, seems best to edit on a tablet, In my opinion. Especially if you always use it for wikia XD. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 00:27, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

Personally, being new to the wiki, I think that the new editor is better than the old. But I do think that we should have a vote on it. Upvoteanthology (talk) 01:20, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

Personally, I hate it. I want to use the old editor and had to change it in my settings. Reason why I don't like it is because it takes forever loading on my crappy school laptop, I also just want to edit particular sections when it seems to edit everything. Aternix !?  01:24, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

Advantages:


 * On fast connections, it loads WAY faster cause you don't need a whole new page to be loaded.


 * Makes editing general TL pages and talkpages much easier.


 * Makes editing templates easier.

Disadvantages:

Well, not so much a list of disadvantages as a list of salty old curmudgeons.

01:48, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

Source editor ftw, just give people the choice to switch between editors if possible so we are all happy? We each have different preferences and needs for the editor so lets do the best to accomodate as much diversity as possible. VonGlusenburg (talk to Von!) 02:46, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

Guns I don't know what you're talking about. For me, on several devices, it takes on average five times longer for the new editor to load. On top of that it makes editing large pages and templates almost impossible, and makes even the most basic edits difficult. I literally tried three times just to sign my signature on TE v. CP, before having to switch to source editor in preferences. Mscoree (talk)

Well, I dislike the new editor (primarily due to the map game issues) and the first day it came out, I figured out how to fix the problem by setting preferences. The new editor definitely needs to be worked out on a Wikia-wide scale, in my opinion.

For now, however, we can manually revert to the Classic or Source editors depending upon our preferences. Are we even sure that the TSPTF can change the default on the wiki, or is this all hypothetical?

I agree that we need to have some sort of a vote on the matter, that or the TSPTF should have a vote on the matter. But, as I indicated, this vote will really have no effect on users who can access preferences. The best solution would be to simply inform people who are upset how to change their preferences in the event that we decide to stick with the system. Yours in Wikihood, 05:50, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

Ok, so some like it and some don't. A clear solution is just to put up a guide on how to manually change personal preferences. It keeps both sides happy. I'll put up a guide on here in a few hours. I'll also put up a link for it on the community messages. Imp (Say Hi?!) 09:29, November 14, 2014 (UTC)W

We cannot disable it since Wikia staff made it.IrishPatriot (talk) 12:45, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

No, we can do that. Like what Imp said, just go to personal preferences and let the who want to keep a Classic editor disable it personally. FirstStooge (talk) 14:55, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

I meant we can't remove it completely from the wiki (i didn't mean that we can't disable it personally). IrishPatriot (talk) 15:04, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

No Liker we can completely remove it from the wiki. We can remove it wiki wide. This thread was made to discuss whether or not we should. Mscoree (talk) 15:11, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

Why SHOULD we? Some of us like it, some don't, and it takes 10 seconds to change! If you don't like it, go to preferences and click a button, dammit!

23:36, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

I believe at this point the discussion is no longer about banning it outright, as a few users have voiced their opinion in keeping it. I was just trying to explain to Liker that it is possible to remove it hypothetically. Mscoree (talk) 23:43, November 14, 2014 (UTC)

I personally use Source mode for anything except Copy-Paste stuff.

Only use source mode myself.

As for removing it, Ms, no such option. It is here to stay whether we like it or not.

Lordganon (talk) 12:06, November 16, 2014 (UTC)



There is the step by step guide for those confused on how to change editing preferences. Imp (Say Hi?!) 21:32, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Notice
Many people are drawing similarities between the names of Ratc333 and Ratcolor. They are not the same person. I've talked with Ratcolor. I'd go as far as saying they're opposites of each other. Going to clear this up before this becomes an issue. Thank you.

Crim de la Crème 23:09, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Woah. I was just thinking the same thing. I was like "could Ratc not have chosen a more imaginative title that Ratcolor?" Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:58, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, I was initially suspicious too, but I love this guy.

Which, note, is almost certainly NOT a ringing endorsement, but still.

00:38, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

End PM3, Vandalization, and more
So, a few users on chat (Tr0llis, Toby2, Harvenard2, Mscoree and RexImperio) have started propagating the idea of forcibly ending pm3. This wouldn't have been such a problem, had one of them (Harvenard2), vandalized the pm3 main page.

Moreover, a member of the TSPTF (Toby2) seems to have indirectly allowed this to happen, as seen below.

Finally, Feudalplague is constantly portrayed as some sort of tyrant who does whatever he wants. Now, I'm not saying he doesn't have some flaws, but this is taking it too far. Sky Green 24 (P, Q ) 14:52, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

Hopefully someone sees these before they are deleted. Guns is now really mad at us and cursing us off in all caps. It's all a manner of time before I'm banned from chat, and if what Guns is saying is true, before he "pays off" an admin to ban us. I don't even know what to think anymore. Tr0llis (talk) 16:07, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

Maybe Guns has a victim complex or something, but now he's saying us non admins, the people he's supposed to be moderating, are out of control and insulting to him, even though the evidence seems to say otherwise. "Guns, if we had done what you said, you would have prevented us from getting banned?" - Mscoree; they are having a conversation now about buying their innocence. Is this really how it's supposed to work? Tr0llis (talk) 16:13, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

12/10 logic. I state that I'm going out of my way to stop you from being banned, and you assume you're going to be chatbanned. I state that I'm defending you and the other people who did this on the TSPTF talkpage- true, BTW- and you assume that means I'm "paying off" other TSPTF members. I state that I'm one of the few TSPTF members here who DOESN'T actively dislike you and Ms, and you decide that means that I'm corrupt.

I mean, I can't even comprehend the illogicity of those statements.

16:11, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

Great, somehow this has spiraled out of control into a completely different issue. Lordganon or one of the bias admins Guns describes are going to get one look at this and ban ms for all eternately most likely, probably Tr0llis too. Simply put he tried to uncover something far beyond him, and it's going to come off all wrong. Another thing, Guns came on chat today and immediately banned me, not sure why. Wouldn't be surprised if the people on this page were banned by Guns, "accidentally" in some cases. Harvenard2 (talk) 16:20, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

This is some bullshit right here. VonGlusenburg (talk to Von!) 16:53, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

First I will give a full detailed explanation of what happened

Well here is how this started. Early in the morning i was on chat when NK suggested that PM3 be rebooted. we liked the idea, but both left so originally none of it  was taken too seriously. In the morning, i come on to find blocky and ms arguing over westphalia (i even had to kick blocky once for repeated insults hurled at the user). Here is where I resuggested the reboot. Many people were tired of the apparent mod bias (mostly those who they deemed undesirable, which were Ms and his allies). In order to enact this Ms stated we should change our avatars in a silent protest. We did, to enact a little humor and give our point across. Now at this time (before Windows eight updated and i lost all my work >:(. ) You can see my first post in the picture above. I meant to say "das good" in respoince to my accidental descaling of the picture, which i fixed. When he mentioned the banner, i said "I am not allowed to allow what those deem vandalism" (although since crim did it before i was hesitant to do anything) I mentioned johnston's tennessee because i was working on it, as well as other wiki and non wiki stuff, so i was kind of busy. Hoping guns wasnt away (because his name didnt say away under it) I went to do just that. I come back realizing that people had considered it vandalism and guns WAS away., so i rollbacked the page. Yes i know i did wrong, a lot, by even taking part in this, and i probably should have been more specific, but apart from the PM3 mods seeing it vandalism i dont see the problem here. I also should have known that it was vandalism, that i take full responsibility for.

As for the Fed issue. '''If you are going to compare someone to ISIS, do it in your head, at least until Mscoree and Tr0llis start killing Shias and Stoning gays. Seriously that was way too low a blow. '''Unfortunately it has come to a lot of our attention that not just in PM3, but the whole wiki, is biased towards some users. And seeing how everything you say will be copyedited and posted on a talk page for a kangaroo court, i shall say no more.

Thank you Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

Its funny people think Ms is going to be banned, when he isn't even on my radar for people I may potentially ban because of all the shit which has happened over the last month. Harv push his luck, lets hope one month gives him time to think. If anyone feels this needs to be extended in the TSPTF, be my guest.

You do realise Guns was trying to help you correct? Talk about burning an olive branch.

I did expect more from Toby however. And the others, this is your last warning. I don't want to know what happened, because I have seen all I need to. I just do not want any more discussion on here on this topic. Imp (Say Hi?!) 19:10, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

Goddammit Imp, I had all these words I was going to write and then you write this.

19:12, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

Soz man, go post them up anyway. Would appreciate some backup. Imp (Say Hi?!) 19:15, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

Isn't a month kind of extreme? I mean we've give anonymous trolls who spam multiple pages with curse words one to two weeks on occasion. Going off what Imp said, the punishment is one month simply because "no one would object" and because "he's annoying". Basically because people are mad at Harv, rather than give him the punishment for the crime, they might as well give him a month. In my opinion that's not really fair, it brings in your personal bias/opinions on Harv. At the same time all he did was post a single image, honestly just delete it. Tr0llis (talk) 19:31, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

It's still vandalism. Anyway, it's hard to take any screenshots of chat at face value because you can't tell if they've been taken out of context or altered or whatever. Also, Guns was most definitely offering to vouch for you but apparently you thought it was a trap.

19:42, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

It's not that we thought it was a trap, it's the fact he was willing to sell his testimony basically. Regardless Imp is promising that there will be consequences for Guns, which is slightly relieving. Tr0llis (talk) 19:49, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

Wow. Way to have another pointless argument-of-the-week. Literally nothing was accomplished from this giant wall-of-text on the TSPTF talk. Personally, I think we should implement stricter rules for when chat mods should kick/ban, as it seems that either a chat mod is doing too little or too much when these arguments come up. —Bfoxius (talk)

"Sell" my testimony for what, exactly? I asked one thing of you, and that's that you stop arguing with me when I said you shouldn't be banned!

Hah, funny. If there are any consequences beyond him buying me a drink (figuratively), I'm going to laugh at the absurdity of this wiki.

Harvey, you were banned for vandalizing the PM3 page.

21:13, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

I'd say concerning how its all built up over this last month a ban for a month is warranted. The annoyomus trolls get those bans because they are looking for somewhere to attach themselves to troll, if you stright-away show you won't put up with that crap and ban them, then they quickly lose interest. The bigger problem is the trolls which get latched onto the Wiki and develop a personal grudge (e.g. the whole Owen saga). They will have some friends which voch for them and they have contributed stuff, so ultimately mods feel bad about removing people who have contributed to the wiki in a postitive way. However when the treshold for a user becomes more bad contributions than good, well then its time to say no thanks and ban them to stop more bad contributions. Obviously though people will seem to be biased because they see more good contributions or bad contributions to the Wiki. I see more bad contributions from the people involved here so I say ban them. Once the majority of mods feel this way as well, then a ban will happen. Hopefully then the person improves and stops being bad. If they keep up the bad then they are banned again because then it seems they developed a grudge or something.

But when users are repeatedly banned and show no sign of correcting their behaviour, then I must just say they are neither use nor ornament. Why bother giving them the time of day to try and reason with them. They are more trouble than they are worth. Whatever happened to three strikes? Thank you for blocking Harv for a month Imp. I'd make it a year if he comes back and continues his bullshit. If you could now just deal out some more bans to people so we don't have to keep having one of these big clusterfuck arguments about a map game that'd be great.

The ISIS thing was low, but obviously 1 man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. This video explains this difference of viewpoints very well. But yeah I think its safe to say ISIS are not fighters for freedom, rather freedom to impose a horrible ideology.... VonGlusenburg (talk to Von!) 03:41, December 1, 2014 (UTC)


 * Thank you Von. [[Image:1.png|23px]] Imp (Say Hi?!) 15:42, December 7, 2014 (UTC)

Minor Vandalism
Apparently this person has been vandalising articles, probably not knowing the rules of proper edict. Just decided to bring it to the attention to the TSPTF to deal with this and to disipline correctly. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 17:13, December 4, 2014 (UTC)

That anonymous IP was already blocked twice by LG and Kogasa. Only way to discipline that person is by blocking it for more longer time. FirstStooge (talk) 01:42, December 5, 2014 (UTC)

Gave him a three month block. He really is going to do no good. Hopefully gets the idea and stops visiting us. Imp (Say Hi?!) 10:19, December 5, 2014 (UTC)

Imperial Machines
Some commotion in chat came up about this timeline Imperial Machines and whether it was a derivative work or not. It does have a lot of references to Wreck-it-Ralph, but I figured I would ask the Brass for their thoughts on the matter, as in my opinion it seems to be in a gray area in that regard.

Thanks,

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 18:16, December 5, 2014 (UTC)

"Gray" is a good word for this one. This is about as close as one can get to derivative, in my opinion, and not get it deleted. Lordganon (talk) 12:52, December 6, 2014 (UTC)

Upvoteanthology
I have suspended Upvoteanthology for three days. This is because he uploaded a clearly inappropriate file for the purpose of harassing another user (TechnicallyIAmSean). I have removed the file and the comments. -- 05:13, December 7, 2014 (UTC)

Greatly disappointing, coming from Upvote. Too bad. 05:38, December 7, 2014 (UTC)

Wow wow wow calm down. I get that it may seem as harrassing, but I request you unban him. It was a joke, and it has a seperate context. I was not offended. I actually laughed about it a lot. Tech (talk)

^ i also believe it was a joke. IrishPatriot (talk) 11:29, December 7, 2014 (UTC)

When I saw the image I too was under the impression it was a joke. Mscoree (talk) 13:50, December 7, 2014 (UTC)

It was just a joke, it was Upvotes Secret Santa gift for Tech, resembling what happened in the latest ATWar game beetween them. Though I do admit that the image might be a bit inappropriate for the wiki, I think you should Unban him due to this misunderstanding. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 15:08, December 7, 2014 (UTC)

As they all said, please have a TSPTF member unban him. Tech (talk) 15:56, December 7, 2014 (UTC)

Technically, regardless of whether it was offensive or not, it was inappropriate, which is against Wiki rules. That's the cause of the ban, so he'll be back when the ban is over. It's just three days. Cour *talk* 16:06, December 7, 2014 (UTC)


 * Couldn't have explained it better, Courageous. Context or not, Upvote's "gift" was poor judgement at best and still not tolerated. His suspension will remain in place. -- 19:09, December 7, 2014 (UTC)

Sign-ups Issue
So, if you click on the link, you might notice that there's something wrong with the sign-ups section of PM3 (or it might just be me, but that'd be even weirder). Sky Green 24 (P, Q ) 14:18, December 8, 2014 (UTC)

This belongs on the PM3 talkpage, I think, not here.

00:58, December 10, 2014 (UTC)

But you see, the issue isn't that it's outdated, the issue is that it somehow glitches when I click on that section. I checked it in source mode, but I didn't see anything wrong with it there. Sky Green 24 (<font color="A00000">P, Q ) 10:21, December 10, 2014 (UTC)

Wikia App
Please see this message left on my talk page. I think I am the only admin who got it. Looks like AltHistory is getting an app. Mitro (talk) 18:41, December 10, 2014 (UTC)

What is the process of making this app? Is it actually going to happen? <font color="Green">Upvoteanthology''' ( Talk | Sandbox )