Talk:Axis vs Allies: Reborn (Map Game)

Location
Location is how close the nation is to the place of the conflict. Goes by capital city.
 * At the war: 5
 * Next to the war: 4
 * Close to the war: 3
 * Far from the war: 2
 * Halfway around the world: 1

Tactical Advantage

 * Attacker’s advantage: 1
 * Defender’s advantage: 2
 * Home is desert: Defenders +3, attackers -3
 * Home is island: Defenders +4, attackers -4

Strength

 * Every nation militarily helping with belligerents/defenders: 3
 * Every nation nonmilitarily helping with belligerents/defenders: 2
 * Side with greater population: 3
 * Side with greater industry: 3
 * "Big Cheese" Advantage (USA, Soviet Union, UK, Japan, Germany for now):+4

Motive

 * Life or death (country’s sovereign existence is threatened): 10
 * Religious: 7
 * Social/moral: 6
 * Political: 5
 * Economical: 3

"Special" Status
In many points in history, a revolution (Hitler, Napoleon) has led to massive military successes at first. However, such revolutions have also led to massive failures (Mussolini, the South in Amer. Civil War). If a revolution has taken place in your nation in the past 7 years into an autocratic dictatorship, you are eligible for a bonus in military. If all of the above, +10.
 * If revolution to autocratic dictatorship in past 7 years.
 * If you get 6 or more in chance.

Morale

 * Recent military defeats (battles): -2
 * Extermination of conquered peoples: -3
 * Motive is less than 6: -1

Nuclear weapons

 * Strategic nuclear weapon use on capital city: +10 for belligerent, -10 for defendant (of nuke). +2 per additional nuke for belligerent, -2 per additional nuke for defendant.
 * Strategic nuclear weapon use on major city: +7 for belligerent, -10 for defendant (of nuke). +1.5 per additional nuke for belligerent, -1.5 per additional nuke for defendant.
 * Strategic nuclear weapon use on minor city: +5 for belligerent, -10 for defendant (of nuke). +1 per additional nuke for belligerent, -1 per additional nuke for defendant.
 * Tactical nuclear weapon use: +5 for first tactical nuke, +.5 per additional nuke.
 * Nuclear weapon use for belligerent: -5 morale this turn and next turn.
 * Nuclear weapon use for defendant: -2.5 morale this turn only.

Economic situation

 * Great economy: +5
 * Fair economy: +3
 * Average economy: +1
 * Poor economy: -3
 * Crashing economy: -5

Chance
Take the UTC time at that moment. (ie 21:32). Then, multiply those numbers. Any zeros count as one. Then take the declaring user's edit count. Then divide the UTC number by the edit count. Multiply that number by 3.14 Take the fifth digit in the number, and there's your chance. Then, for the opponent, take the eighth number. And there you go!
 * 2*1*3*2= 8
 * ie 2831.
 * 8/2831= 0.00282585658
 * 0.00282585658*3.14= 0.00887318966
 * 7
 * 8

Plausibility Points
Take the difference between the user with more plausibility points and multiply it by 1.5. That number is added to their score. If it is against a non-user nation, the user automatically receives a +2.

Result
The winner will get to take the city(ies) they were targeting. If the winner wins by more than 1.5x the score, they will take 4 cities. If they win any number less, they will take 2 cities. If the user wins by more than 2x the score, 8 cities will be taken. If the user wins by more than 4x the score, the nation will capitulate.

Changes from Axis vs Allies: Revolutions

 * Added mod rules section
 * Added regulations to mapmaking
 * Added Plausibility Points
 * Added inactivity penalty.
 * Added proxies.
 * Changed start time to 22:00:00 UTC.

Patch 1

 * Added plausibility points to War Algorithm.
 * User will be penalized 1 point from their Plausibility Points if the miss a day without any notice.

Patch 2

 * Removed penalty for inactivity in Plausibility Points.

Patch 3

 * Removed Plausibility Points.
 * Removed Plausibility Points from algorithm.

Patch 4

 * Removed the algorithm.

Patch 5

 * The algorithm has been reinstated with major changes.

Discussion
Thanks for dealing with the last game's problems with 'power gameing' and mod bias.The River Nile-2 (talk) 21:28, January 6, 2013 (UTC)

who was the biased mod? Sine dei gloriem (talk) 21:29, January 6, 2013 (UTC)

Well, Zaire vs S. Africa was a bit ASB on the previous game as the mod and the player power-gamed and hyper-conquered. Don't worry, Sine dei gloriem, since both you and Pitakang are not the fellows I was talking about. What ever, let's forget about the other game and start anew on this one. The River Nile-2 (talk) 21:38, January 6, 2013 (UTC)

ok. and yeah i remember zaire's player aswell made a Turkish empire aswell, lets hope this doesnt happen here Sine dei gloriem (talk) 21:40, January 6, 2013 (UTC)

I'm still going to build my empire. If Japan, Germany, Britian, and Italy can do it, I see no reason I can't. Of course it will be more plausible. I'm gonna build up to it like the Japanese, come up with some lousy excuse of friendship or something, and then go in for the kill. The East Asian African Co-Prosperity Sphere. Unless, you have a problem with that... Vivaporius says: "I don't need a slogan!" 18:20, January 9, 2013 (UTC)

That's OK.The River Nile-2 (talk) 23:42, January 12, 2013 (UTC)

"Come up with some lousy excuse of friendship or something" The quote of the week

Thanks
Thanks, PitaKing, for fixing my flag (Francoist Spain), since I didn't know how to fix it. I really appreciate it. Stewdio333 (talk) 21:23, January 4, 2013 (UTC)

No problem! Although it's Pita Kang, not King, lol. PitaKang- (But here's my number | So call me maybe) 23:36, January 4, 2013 (UTC)

I actually misread your name as PitaKing for the longest time. The first time I saw your name, I thought 'I like pita bread too'. CrimsonAssassin (talk) 23:22, January 7, 2013 (UTC)

^^Exactly what I thought. Fegelein! Fegelein! Fegelein! 23:28, January 7, 2013 (UTC)

Plausibility Points
Interesting concept. Will they be used in war algorithms? ChrisL123 (talk) 23:58, January 4, 2013 (UTC)

Yup. Just a thought. PitaKang- (But here's my number | So call me maybe) 00:13, January 5, 2013 (UTC)

How are these going to work? I'm asking because there's really nothing on the main page... Also, there was no "powergaming" by me or Scraw on the last game. Evidently, I(and obviously Scraw) do not tolerate implausibility. The Turkish Empire was an example and so was the near-miss we had with that implausible African Empire. I hope the mods in this game are as much anti-implasogasm as I am. Though, I'm not worried since Scraw is still there,AP (talk) 02:17, January 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * Still you ignore the tons of information I and others gave you (funny thing is I and two other players told you you were wrong). Regardless, so long as your willing to read it and own up to the proof, then we'll be fine. Vivaporius says: "I don't need a slogan!" 18:22, January 9, 2013 (UTC)

I agree about limiting hyper-expatiation and hyper conquest.The River Nile-2 (talk) 16:03, January 7, 2013 (UTC)

Mongolia
Mongolia was under heavy Soviet influence throughout its history, so can it be coloured in the USSR colour like Manchuria is with Japan?

And BTW, can we control our puppet states or does it go under the "one country per player" rule? Fed (talk) 16:49, January 8, 2013 (UTC)

It's been coloured in.The River Nile-2 (talk) 21:38, January 8, 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. Fed (talk) 21:40, January 8, 2013 (UTC)

Algorimth (Or Whatever Like That) and something else
I am one of the final two players of Axis vs Allies Revised, the only Map Game of the Axis vs. Allies series that have finished by date. I am willing to tell what I am feeling as not good in this map game: Laptop_Zombie 05:01, January 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * 1) I do not like the characteristic of Chances in the Algorimth calculated in such a random way. I myself don't like the idea of Algorimth, believing this was one of the reasons map game can go too difficult to understand and so challenge people like me to understand these map games. This is one of the reasons why I left the position of Denmark in AvA Revolutions. Too complicated.
 * 2) Rather than having quite a random thing for nukes, it would be better to force players to explain all their scientific researches out in the game, so mods could determine who can get nukes first. And being Big Cheese doesn't have any meaning in nukes, it's about science, not military or population, about its discovery.
 * 3) Using proxies? Ridiculous. ALL UNCHOSEN NATIONS SHOULD BE GOVERNED BY MODS, or they should be incorporated as colony, autonomous regions or associated states.
 * 4) Signature rules away? Only 3 tiles please.

I played as Egypt in Axis vs Allies Revised and was the 3rd nation. I loved Axis vs Allies Revised.The River Nile-2 (talk)

So no algorithm, because that decides alot for me The old baby (talk) 11:13, January 9, 2013 (UTC)

I doesn't mean Denmark in Congress of Vienna, I mean in AvA Revolutions I was the player of Denmark, then I left. Laptop_Zombie 12:53, January 9, 2013 (UTC)

That has nothing to do with what i asked.

I agree with Laptop and River Nile, algorithms make the game too complicated, but you still must be plausible, as I took a similar amount of time in invading the part of China I did as otl, being a little faster by using Chemical weapons instead of bio weapons

I personally believe the algorythm is necessary for wars; I mean, otherwise we'll eventually end up with Finland conquering the world. It happened in most early map games for a reason.

Big Cheese does matter for nukes. Maybe not for nuclear research, but nukes also need a lot of resources and military power, something, say, Bhutan will not have.

And how come no proxies? Proxies were extremely important in this age of history. Fed (talk) 00:01, January 13, 2013 (UTC)

Axis vs Allies: Revised did better than any other Axis vs Allies game, and it had no algorithm for computers. If we do get a finland take over  the world type player, we just ban him for implausibility, but have that said we should still have an algorithm for player vs player wars.The old baby (talk) 00:10, January 13, 2013 (UTC)

Well, proxy was actually invaded all the time, and it became more difficult to make maps. In AvA Revised, all the proxies were cleaned not long after, and all nations annexed their proxy, starting with USSR - Kurdistan. Interestingly, the CoA was formed by Russia (OTL Soviet Union), China and Hindustan (OTL India) and all their colonies and proxies fully integrated. Laptop_Zombie 01:29, January 13, 2013 (UTC)

Hurrar, I'm joining the Game! (and may pull out soon though)

@The old baby: In your very first post in this section, do you mean that decides a lot for your map game (Napoleonic Europe Revised!) huh? Laptop_Zombie 13:31, January 14, 2013 (UTC)

Boring
Is this game going boring?

A new War Algorithm idea?



 * I might have an idea?!


 * State of Economy: +10 (Florishing), +7.5 (Okay), +5 (Mild), +2.5 (Poor), 0 (Non-existent or colapsing)
 * Many or major defences and fortified places: + 10
 * War Weariness: -5 Every turn while in war, after the first turn
 * Technology: 0-10; with 0 being the worst, 5 being normal and 10 being ahead of time.
 * Knowledge of landscape: +20 for in one's homeland, + 10 for warring in an adjacent nation, -1 for low knowledge of an non-adjacent lands which are on you continent, -10 for no knowledge of a distant realm that is not even on your continent.
 * Morale: -10 In face of larger army, - 20 for completely surrounded, +5 for in face of a smaller army, +10 for surrounding enemy
 * Storming on to a coastline from the sea or on to an island, the attacker - 10 and defender + gains 10.
 * Storming in to a desert or jungle the, attacker - 10 and + defender gains 10.
 * Nuclear war gives the atomic user +10 and defnder- 10 for Strategic arms or +5 and -5 for tactical arms. +1 to the attacker and -1 to the defender if  the capial is hit
 * Every nation militarily helping with their side= +1
 * Religious, ethnic and cultural war motives = + 5 to the attacker.
 * Economic war motives = + 2 to the attacker.
 * Tactical Advantage: +5 defender/-3 attacker (for exsampel crossing the Kalahari desert)
 * Armed exspantion in large extremism climates like Greenland, Niger, Nepal and Amazonia will also be very slow due to lodgistic and climate problems for any wood-be invader. In this case the defender gets an advantage of +5 and the attacker gets a disadvantage of -6
 * Life or death = + 10 to the nation who is fearing being wiped from history.
 * Strength: # of troops divided by a factor of 10,000 (ie, 1,000,000 =100 pints)
 * Luck and weather conditions- 0-10 on Random Dot Org (to be used only as a tie breaker)
 * Add the totals up and find the biggest total. The biggest wins.
 * Do this for every turn your warring in.
 * The River Nile-2 (talk) 16:39, January 13, 2013 (UTC)

Oh lord, I hate these types of algorithms...

Fegelein! Fegelein! Fegelein! 19:22, January 13, 2013 (UTC)

OKThe River Nile-2 (talk)

Japan
economy:-7

Tech: 6.5

weariness -4

Knowledge of landscape: +10

Morale:+5

Nation help= +1( Korea)

coastline -0( remember, Manchuria)

Economic war motives +2

troop Number: 1,750,000, so +175 pts

total:203

China
economy: +5

Defenses +10

tech: +5

weariness: -4

morale: -10

nation help +1

Life or death: +10

numbers: 1,500,000, so 150.

total: 187

tell me if i did that wrong. The old baby (talk) 20:34, January 13, 2013 (UTC)


 * It is OK, the algorithmic is correct, but I think we are supposed to use this other one [].The River Nile-2 (talk) 22:01, January 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * Well that sucks, this one is faster and easier.The old baby (talk) 22:17, January 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree.The River Nile-2 (talk) 22:57, January 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * Stop being so lazy. [[Image:IMPERIAL NY-SPQR 1.png|25px]][[Image:Regen Flag.png|30px|border]] Fegelein! Fegelein! Fegelein! 23:04, January 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm not lazy, I have a byciacl!The River Nile-2 (talk) 21:04, January 16, 2013 (UTC)
 * Look. No offense, but you could at least spell "bicycle" correctly. Stewdio333 (talk) 10:59, January 17, 2013(UTC)
 * Jpan had a chrashing ecomany so ecomany is -7 for japan Warman555

Algorithm
After a couple players complained about the complicated algorithm, I have decided to remove the algorithm for the game in Patch 4. They can, however come back in Patch X. Feedback, please! PitaKang- (But here's my number | So call me maybe) 20:35, January 15, 2013 (UTC)

I disagree. The algorithm is one of the few things that keeps the game a bit away from becoming ASB. It is essential to any map game and I vote for its return. Fegelein! Fegelein! Fegelein! 21:31, January 15, 2013 (UTC)

I disagree as well. The algorithm has worked (for the most part) in all games and removing it would be a huge mistake. Plus, the people who are complaining are just to lazy to do math. Enclavehunter (talk) 22:04, January 15, 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, I am in multiple map games that have algorithms, some that don't, and a life outside the computer! I've never liked the Axis vs Allies algorithm anyway. The old baby (talk) 22:08, January 15, 2013 (UTC)

Well, I'm afraid there's nothing we can do about that.

Also, I think we should get rid of the "Big Cheese" thing, as the Big Cheese could always change over time so radically that the benefit would be useless.

I agree about ending the Big Cheese stuff.The River Nile-2 (talk) 21:01, January 16, 2013 (UTC)

Fegelein! Fegelein! Fegelein! 22:16, January 15, 2013 (UTC)

Sorry. I left after 3 turns of things I've complained. Thanks for nice idea, but I suppose I will never join any Axis vs Allies map game from now. Laptop_Zombie 14:28, January 16, 2013 (UTC)

It's getting stultified, this argument is getting me down.The River Nile-2 (talk) 21:01, January 16, 2013 (UTC)

Time to vote. Mods only, and people in the Algorithm League. Fegelein! Fegelein! Fegelein! 04:13, January 18, 2013 (UTC)

Keep the algorithm

 * [[Image:IMPERIAL NY-SPQR 1.png|25px]][[Image:Regen Flag.png|30px|border]] Fegelein! Fegelein! Fegelein! 04:13, January 18, 2013 (UTC)
 * I've changed the algorithm to match World War II a bit better. Instead of taking x percent of the defendant's land, we go by cities. For example, lets say France invades Germany and takes Franfurt or the Ruhr area. If they win by a lot (which is to determined), they get x number of cities. Still working on it. -Flag_of_South_Korea.png PitaKang- (But here's my number | So call me maybe) 14:19, January 18, 2013 (UTC)
 * Never saw anything wrong with it in the first place too be honest. Vivaporius says: "I don't need a slogan!" 21:41, January 18, 2013 (UTC)

Germany
Me no understand what happened. Italy turning into a democracy: What the hell just happened? Italy riding the moral high horse and telling Germany to back out... Lulz. Also, by the way, Italy had one of the worst armies in Europe at that time. Have fun trying to take over Germany. Also, Austria wanted to join with Germany. And, Italy with blitzkreig? Even more lulz.

Sweden invading Germany: WTF!!?! Sweden: Ally of Germany. Has been and will be. And Sweden blockading Germany coast... if it were Britain I would understand. Sweden??!?!

Anyways, whatever.

PitaKang- (But here's my number | So call me maybe) 14:36, January 19, 2013 (UTC)

Oh and by the way, you guys didn't support Czechoslovakia before the invasion so I already took Czechoslovakia as in OTL. PitaKang- (But here's my number | So call me maybe) 14:37, January 19, 2013 (UTC)

Also, should the special status last the whole war? My inclination is that it should, since that was what happened in OTL. PitaKang- (But here's my number | So call me maybe) 15:00, January 19, 2013 (UTC)

Sweden had a popular revolt and a change in Parliament and King.

Fegelein! Fegelein! Fegelein! 21:04, January 19, 2013 (UTC)

Germany (Belligerent)

 * Location: +3
 * Tactical Advantage: +1
 * Strength: Germany (L, BC +8), Soviet Union (M, BC + 7), Ethiopia (M +3) = +18
 * Greater Industry: +3
 * Greater Population: +3
 * Motive: +6 (Social/Moral)
 * Special Status: +10
 * Morale: +0
 * Economy: +5 (Germany had a great economy before World War II)
 * Chance: +6
 * 09:46
 * 9*4*6= 216
 * 216/7758= 0.02784222737
 * 0.02784222737*pi= 0.08746893699
 * Total: 56

Netherlands (Defendant)

 * Location: +4
 * Tactical Advantage: +2
 * Strength: Netherlands (L+4), Britain (M, BC+7), France (M+3), Italy (M+3), Sweden (M+3), Greece (M+3) = +23
 * Motive: +10
 * Morale: +0
 * Economy: +5
 * Chance: +3
 * Total: 47

Result

 * 1939.5: Narrow German victory. Germany takes Apeeldorn and Almere, closing in on Amsterdam.
 * 1940: Decisive Germany victory. Germany takes Amsterdam, forcing the capitulation of the Netherlands.

Discussion
Wait...algorimth was removed in Patch 4!Laptop_Zombie 15:03, January 19, 2013 (UTC)

It was reinstated due to a majority mod vote. PitaKang- (But here's my number | So call me maybe) 17:20, January 19, 2013 (UTC)

Greece is supporting France/Sweden/Italy JSYK. Airlinesguy (talk) 23:30, January 19, 2013 (UTC)