Talk:Sopron Frontier Territory (1983: Doomsday)

Sorry to tell you this, but this isn't at all accurate. Said it before when your work was first brought to our attention here, and I'm saying it again. Lordganon 05:32, June 9, 2012 (UTC)

I understand. It's just that I tried to expound on the scant detail surrounding the fate of Western Hungary and Sopron in the Alpine Confederation.

Also, it was admittedly an attempt to shed a little more light on an area that seems largely ignored by the rest of the timeline. Mdc 1957 05:44, June 9, 2012 (UTC)

...There would be no villages anywhere near it. Alpine troops would have either evacuated the villagers or annexed the villages long ago.

Not going to be just for the "foreseeable" future.

The military headquarters holds more power than any civilian authorities.

And it's still going too far - there is no governing body.

Nor are any of the Alpines going to support them in such a manner.

Lordganon (talk) 08:00, August 4, 2012 (UTC)

Point taken with the villages. Though there might be maybe a handful in the fringes that may be off the record.

Anyway, I'll try to make the right edits. But still, I stand to the "28-29 years is sufficently long enough for a more substantial entity to emerge" line.

Mdc 1957 (talk) 08:21, August 4, 2012 (UTC)

A valid opinion, but it's not what the Alpine article says, or what other ones have indicated. Needs to be changed.

Really, not even the Austrian public is going to be all that sympathetic or supportive. I'm sure that there would be elements of Alpine society that would be, but far from a majority - nor would the matter be an issue to the Alpine government. Still sounds like it is.

Lordganon (talk) 08:57, August 4, 2012 (UTC)

To be honest, I was actually basing the Austrian reaction on historical context relating to its relations with Hungary. After all, they were the ones who brought in refugees before and during the 1956 Revolution, and not to mention Sopron's past as an Austrian area. Not that the goverment would actually say outright as official policy in any case.

Although admittedly, there were parts of the Alpine article that haven't seem to be updated or expanded for a while, so there's still some leeway to work out something.

Mdc 1957 (talk) 09:07, August 4, 2012 (UTC)

Big difference between refugees and this.

The Alpine article needs to be what's taken at face value, no matter how long it has been since any real work has been added. Really, the creation of an article at all is leeway, all things considered.

Basically, this area is going to be more of an "unofficial" territory or military zone than anything. Not a political body in its own right.

Lordganon (talk) 09:29, August 4, 2012 (UTC)

Can't there be a compromise? The region hasn't quite been given some perhaps substantial attention other than "empty wasteland." After all, it's happened to Britain.

Mdc 1957 (talk) 10:02, August 4, 2012 (UTC)

...Nothing like that has happened in Britain.

It's not an empty wasteland in western and central Hungary - there would be tiny, very scattered settlements on rare occasions like has been found in the east. Nothing substantial, mind - few thousand people in the whole area, overall.

But, irregardless, there's no such government in the area. An informal designation, sure - but not a governmental area.

Lordganon (talk) 05:09, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

Still, perhaps it would make sense to have some sense of order. After all, if Debrecen could organize itself into a viable nation with Transylvanian help, it would also be logical if Sopron had something similar albeit on a smaller scale. Also, I put emphasis on both military presence and the refugee camps.

Mdc 1957 (talk) 05:48, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

Debrecen, however, was already independent in all but name. Sopron has not at all been in such a position. Lordganon (talk) 06:39, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

Thing is, you do have a point regarding Sopron as a military base. Though that would only make sense in my opinion for at least the initial years after Doomsday. Factor in the potential refugee camp locations, residual Hungarian nationalism, some nostalgia and intermingling...

Mdc 1957 (talk) 14:28, August 5, 2012 (UTC)

It has been noted elsewhere that small bands of Soviet troops that survived both the nukes and the "invasion" of Austria remained in western Hungary for a long time thereafter. Matter of fact, I'd bet they still exist in Central Hungary today. Even besides that, the area was not peaceful. It's not as bad as the other border regions, but still very needed to have a large military presence. Serb actions in the former Yugoslavia, both in the present and in the past, would not help the matter any.

Would be no refugee camp locations. Doesn't make any sense, either, quite honestly, that there would be.

Nationalism is minimal, and would be irrelevant here. It is a security zone, nothing more, and Partium is a fairly big trading partner, too. The Hungarians can want anything, but that doesn't mean it happens.

Nostalgia and intermingling also would do very little. And would be far more attuned to the Austrians, anyways.

Lordganon (talk) 09:01, August 6, 2012 (UTC)