Talk:Hail Mighty Joan

This page is to discuss possible ways that Joan of Arc might have not been killed, and how it would have impacted the world. Please comment! Falconier111 20:15, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

Some Possibilities At Present:
 * Burgundy did not split with France
 * The French army was somehow larger and/or better-armed than in OTL
 * The English didn't adopt the longbow from the Welsh
 * Improbable IMO - if they hadn't their longbow, they'd never come into the situation owning half of France. England's population was much smaller.--Max Sinister 22:27, 22 November 2007 (UTC)


 * The Normans adopted its use from the Welsh, perhaps by Joan of Arc's time the French had been able to introduce it as well.--TEAKAY 18:16, 23 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I don't think that they would have adopted the longbow simply because the English used it; the aristocratic French usually held peasant longbowmen in disdain. Perhaps a way Joan tips the war France's way is introducing longbows into her army?

Going about it the long way, it could be considered that France reformed its recruitment policies a while after England had so they had a paid standing army that was not just intended to protect the kingdom. With a larger population than England, France could have brought up a larger army to counter England's longbow sooner. Then Joan of Arc could potentially have had access to a larger force during the Compiègne skirmish.--TEAKAY 14:08, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Yes, but wouldn't that have effected the war earlier, and not play in too much during Joan's time? The new policies would certainly have boosted the French army and made the war much more difficult for the English, but the French often outnumbered the English anyway, and still were defeated (Agincourt is an example). By Joan of Arc, the difference would be negligible.Falconier111 19:56, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Yes true, I'm probably focusing too much on France's victory than Joan of Arc's survival. Maybe her lift of Orléans' seige could have been more appreciated and she was given command of a larger army and made a successfull sally forth at Compiègne's seige-or made a successful one with the numbers she had, or Charles VII DID think the ransom was worth the money and she returned to the battlefield, or she WAS able to escape one of those many times she tried. I doubt these are GREAT ideas but they couldn't hurt.--TEAKAY 23:10, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I'd think that Charles giving her army big enough to win at Compiègne after her performance at Orléans is the biggest posibility. I like the idea of Joan escaping better, though. That way, the French might be able to claim it was divine intervention, which could damage English moral even more than thinking they had burned a saint did in OTL and give her a way larger command in the French army. Afterwards, she could win a load of battles and greatly accelerate the French victory, all the while becoming adored by the French royalty.Falconier111 04:46, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

If she managed to escape as late as possible, perhaps even between trial sessions (did the trial last more than a day? I don't know)the botched justice of her trial really would have embarrassed the English legal reputation too... though that in particular probably wouldn't have all that much effect on the war. She could have led a second successful siege against Paris, it may have quickened Burgundy's switching of allegiances to protect its expansions into Holland. If she commanded another few victories, would England try to form another truce? And would the French government be nervous enough about their luck to accept it? Giving England a chance to reorganize would be a bad idea.--TEAKAY 21:04, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

About England's legal reputation, who knows? If the English didn't trust their legal system, that would mean that their trials could be discredited more easily. This might lead to revolutionaries claiming that their trials were unjust, making it easier to stir up the masses into a rebellion. But that's assuming that the effects of Joan's failed trial last that long, and it still is a bit of a stretch. But we're getting ahead of ourselves. If Joan had managed to win several more important battles after her escape, the French wouldn't be nervous about their luck. Instead, they might be more concerned with cleaning up the wreckage of the war, or leery of something similar happening to them in England. Or, maybe not; a scenario where the French decide they want revenge on the English is also possible. Falconier111 19:50, 23 November 2007 (UTC)