Alternative History talk:TSPTF/Archive 4

This has to stop
There an issue I feel I have to bring to your attention which I think is a big problem on this wiki. The problem in question is bullying.

A number of people on this wiki are subject of insults, curses and bullying. I admit, I occasionally throw in one or two, but it's unacceptable. One of the main victims involved is a certain Octivian Marius. This started with simple jabs at his poor grammar, but soon led to an entire script and story, "Revolution: The Movie", in which a rebellious renegade by the name of "Mocktavian Sorryass" (really? It's not very subtle...) attempts to take down the mighty power of the TSPTF with his trusty gang of "rebles". I'm sure you're all familiar with the story. But this all stemmed from a harmless blog post in which he unfortunately spelled a couple of words incorrectly. After the creation of this character he was mocked relentlessly, and no one took him seriously any more. He now frequently gets greeted on chat as 'Octard', despite his repeated requests not to be called that. You might all think it was in good nature, but I know what it's like, it starts of as a few funny jokes but it builds up and up and you can't take it. I know I can't tell what's going on inside his head but I can guess. I mean, what did the guy ever do to you, other than his poor grammar and spelling, ridiculous ideas, terrifyingly ASB map game nations... nevermind.

Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that this is not acceptable. We can't have this on a supposedly respectable establishment. This has to stop. I know I shouldn't really have a say in it, and that's why I came to you guys, the only people with the power to do something. I hope you heed my words and think of a solution.

Yours sincerely, - FP(problem?) 15:47, May 20, 2014 (UTC)

I think you are painting Oct as too much of a victim here. He has been targeted, but has also targeted others. Those of us that go on chat, including Oct, have to stop this. I include myself in this. I'm not claiming to be blameless, just that we must stop insulting each other, and bullying members of this wiki. Local Mafia Boss (Talk) (Blog)

Ok, maybe I did add in a bit of drama, and yeah I agree, we all just bicker a lot and occasionally it goes too far. (Of what I've seen) Chat mods don't do a thing, they're busy kicking people for squirrels. They need to get their priorities straight. - FP(problem?) 17:49, May 20, 2014 (UTC)

Agreed.

I agree with the squirrel part.



20:56, May 20, 2014 (UTC)

Vandal
http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Sir_Mark_Granger_(Washington_Shot_at_Murdering_Town!)

Someone block home please ❂ FOR THE REPUBLIC OF CHINA ❂ 14:48, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Really Ratc!?!


At this point, I really do not know what we should do. Here Ratc is confessing to another sockpuppet account. All of the people on chat at the time can attest to his presence, and TOB deserves the credit for making Ratc confess. 20:46, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

After observing parts of the convo which I was not really involved in, I can tell you that he meets a large number of features Ratc has previously shown - obsession for future history, video games, Deus Ex, etc. 20:48, May 21, 2014 (UTC)



More... ~Rex
 * Another traite is heavy profanity.Whipsnade (talk) 16:55, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

Banned from chat for eternity. Bfoxius (talk)

Guys please. Let me explain!!!TerraFutura01 (talk) 20:54, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

You were banned and you must accept it. I sorry Ratc. It's for the wikis good. ❂ FOR THE REPUBLIC OF CHINA ❂ 21:02, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Rat is like a ghost. I don't think we can block him IP for forever, but we could do our best to get him away. ❂ FOR THE REPUBLIC OF CHINA ❂ 20:58, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

You were banned and you must accept it. I sorry Ratc. It's for the wikis good. ❂ FOR THE REPUBLIC OF CHINA ❂ 21:02, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Guys, please. I have been waiting a fucking goddamn month. Ok? Now can you please just stop this bullshit already. I already have problems with my parents and I dont want anymore with you guys. And remember I mentioned I needed a new PC? Well, its true. Also, I am simply feeling,bullied and unwelcome wherever I go here. And besides, I am not the same rat you guys know and love to hate ok. I just in other words, dont want to wait anymore.TerraFutura01 (talk) 21:14, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

The great Scraw says this is sockpuppetry. If you had attempted to reveal yourself beforehand, I think it might have been allowed. But this is hiding/lying/cheating/whatever you want to call it.

22:00, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

I'm kinda surprised he hasn't attacked BFE:W yet.

Also, it's sockpuppetry regardless. Rat, three more and it's a felony, and we get to contact SWAT.

22:20, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

I'm telling Wikia about the new socks.Whipsnade (talk) 14:43, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Could care less what "problems" - not that I think they are real for a second - you have. And a month into something that is forever? Pssh.

Scraw, even if he had revealed himself, would be the same block. Sockpuppeting is permanent banishment.

Lordganon (talk) 16:10, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc has returned once again, under the name "Ur-Quan01". Mscoree (talk) 20:59, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

He was not being silly or profane, so was it necessary to ban him. He may have changed and got help with is asperger's. give him a chance to prove him self.Whipsnade (talk) 14:36, May 23, 2014 (UTC)

Um whip, that isn't a good excuse. I have Asperger's part of the Autism Spectrum and I haven't done anything that would warrant a ban. No offense but that sounds like a cop out. I still don't have help with mine and I am functioning just fine, I may get irrationally angry at time,but otherwise just fine. I'm sorry whip but I disagree and say Ratc should still be banned.ALLONS-Y!!,Basically, RUN!! 16:54, May 23, 2014 (UTC)

I understand. I am new to all the Autisum/Autstic/Asperge's stuff. I had childhood ADHD, but it is mostly gon now. Thank you for your advice on Autisum/Autstic/Asperge's stuff. It is noted and will be concidered.Whipsnade (talk) 16:55, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

I told Wikia and they globally blocked the Ratc socks Global conquer and Terminal warrior, along with that Q-uarn guy. They did not block that Kansas IP 172.56.4.150 or that S. Carolina IP 172.56.4.72. I think they think the IPs are not Ratc.Whipsnade (talk) 16:55, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

TSPTF talk page
On a separate note, archived TSPTF talk page after 100+ subsections made it hard to get to the page's bottom. 23:26, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Are you foreign to the "end" key on your keyboard? Or perhaps the other keys and shortcuts that take you directly to the top/bottom of a page?

23:29, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Scraw, be nice. I don't have an "end" key on my keyboard. I just go to the contents.

But isn't there some bug with Wikia where if you don't archive the page after a bunch of subsections the whole thing disappears? We had that problem with PM2, not long before the GCC...

23:30, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

As I stated, Guns, I archived the TSPTF talk page. 02:09, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Not even remotely your place to do that, Rex.

"End" is normally a shift or "fn" key and then pressing a number from the numberpad.

Lordganon (talk) 16:11, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Vandal
124.124.4.218, as evidenced by: this edit log. I have undone the damage, but would like to let the admin know. 05:52, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Blocked. Lordganon (talk) 16:12, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Juuh Okei
There is another vandal, 80.220.169.157. He's replacing content of pages with "juuh okei". Mscoree (talk) 19:22, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

He deleted your user page Mscoree Sky Green 24 19:24, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

I have undone all his acts of vandalism, but he continues to redo it. Mscoree (talk) 19:25, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

Possibly another vandal/troll: 85.76.146.228. Appears to be making nonsensical pages. Mscoree (talk) 19:39, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

Possibly the same person, both IPs are in Finland. Sky Green 24 19:46, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

So just to fill everyone in. These two IPs vandalized for some time, before the database went down (not sure if related) and remained down for about ten hours. Glad it's back up now, and it looks like staff has helped a bit. Mscoree (talk) 13:31, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, the one seems to have been more than just here - wikia actually blocked all edits to the wiki, among others, for a while. Their bots later removed the spam pages.

As for the other one, the location is probably meaningless - seems to just be an angry person.

Lordganon (talk) 15:02, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc, again
GlobalConqueror is another Ratc sockpuppet, I checked his IP it is in Puerto Rico.

Sky Green 24 19:31, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

Guys, hello. It's me. Yes, yes I know, it was me the entire time but I really have improved. I don't know what else you guys want from me. LG, honestly I don't know what else to say other than the fact that I ask you this one last thing:Will you and the rest of the TSPTF ever forgive me?GlobalConqueror (talk) 19:42, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc, nope, you are banned for a millenium. Quit making sockpuppets. Bfoxius (talk)

Once again Ratc has returned, under the name Terminator Warrior this time.

Mscoree (talk) 15:48, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

I propose we make an "Implied Consent" rule. If a new user is acting really suspicious, then admins have the right to ask them to preform a manual IP check. Refusing will be like refusing a breathalyzer test and shall result in further investigation. Tr0llis (talk) 16:00, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Guys please, I am telling you:STOP BLOCKING ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please?!TerminatorWarrior (talk) 15:58, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

No. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 16:49, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

What part of permanent do you not understand? Lordganon (talk) 15:00, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

I told Wikia and they globally blocked them and that Q-uarn guy.Whipsnade (talk) 15:50, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

I told Wikia and they globally blocked the Ratc socks Global conquer and Terminal warrior, along with that Q-uarn guy. They did not block that Kansas IP 172.56.4.150 or that S. Carolina IP 172.56.4.72. I think they think the IPs are not Ratc.Whipsnade (talk) 16:57, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

Expected of them. Any Ratc IP would be located in Puerto Rico Sky Green 24 17:08, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

Spartian300 Sockpuppeting
I had a map game called Look Out, Sir! Revised, which is now defunct. But, besides that, a man signed up to play the USA, by the name of 'Eastest566'. He posted a couple of turns and disappeared, removing his name. A day or two after that Spartian posted this on the talk page: Link. I thought I would just bring this to your attention. Thanks. Blocky858 (talk) 16:04, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Taken care of CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 16:50, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Whoa whoa wait. Wasn't this already brought the TSPTF like a month ago and they determined he wasn't a sockpuppet? Tr0llis (talk) 16:52, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Crim this was already reported to the TSPTF (see Archive Three), at which point it was determined that when Spartian made that confession he didn't even know what sockpuppeting meant. You should probably look into the matter before  banning him. Mscoree (talk) 16:55, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

And this is why doing this from a mobile device is a bad idea. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 17:04, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Okay fair enough. All I'm saying is it warrants further investigation first, since he was tried for this crime previously and found innocent. Mscoree (talk) 17:07, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Crim, you're still here?

04:48, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

It's hard to let go (inb4 frozen reference) CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:13, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

I think this is irrelevent. Spartian300 (talk) 17:01, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

BridgittLaura
This one is suddenly appeared last two days and making extensive editing in on America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire TL. Then, user AmericaLoove also suddenly missed and not even disturbed BridgittLaura's editings.

BridgittLaura has a very bad grammar, has not a best ability to write, speak, or understands English, and has a similar fond for Bella Thorne, all of characteristics that almost like AmericaLoove. She(?) also did a copyright infringement for blatanly copying my Italy (Cherry, Plum, and Chrysanthemum) page for her Italy (America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire) page.

Lately, she stupidly asked on the forum discussion for being appointed as an admin of wiki. (http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:148709#3)

FirstStooge (talk) 11:44, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

I noticed the other day in chat both these users came on and were conversing in a similar manner. It was the first time I had seen either of them in chat, and after they were both on they both left. I'm not sure if that helps, but that's what I witnessed so far. Mscoree (talk) 14:09, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

Seems less "there" than AL, to me. Blocked for spam for three days.

FS, using another article as a base in some form like that is not an infringement. They may have failed at it, but that was surely the attempt.

Lordganon (talk) 15:06, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

May i be an admin? Spartian300 (talk) 17:02, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

Spartian, on this wiki you cannot get a promotion simply by asking. Please read the rules on the TSPTF page on how to apply. Asking for a promotion won't help. Mscoree (talk) 17:47, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

It was more or less a joke. Spartian300 (talk) 22:41, May 28, 2014 (UTC)



Today in chat the user  BridgittLaura admitted that he/she is also  AmericaLoove. Can an administrator please deal with this accordingly? Mscoree (talk) 01:15, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Not sure what the best course of action would be in this scenario. Based on what she said before she was promtly removed from chat, she seemed to have made the two accounts in case she cursed on one of them. Given that she openly admitted to having a sockpuppet and it was a "backup," so to speak, I shall ban for a month each until further admin consensus.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 01:27, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Isn't sockpuppeting a permaban though? Why do we keep (attempting) making exceptions? Tr0llis (talk) 01:32, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Because exceptions have been made in the past to those who have admitted using sockpuppets before for reasons other than cheating the system. Also, because this is my first blocking of an account (two, actually) and I don't want to overdo it my first time.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 01:33, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Actually, no.

Sockpuppeting is not always a permabannable offense, even according to wikia, who, following from that, will only conduct IP checks if it can be shown that the person in question used it to their advantage- Owen, Rat, etc, who used it to get around a ban, or others who used it in map games or votes, etc, to get their way.

The the case of "backups", generally, only the backup is banned, as was shown in the case when Enc made a backup- "EnterpriseCaptain", I believe it was called.

In conclusion, sockpuppeting isn't always a permabannable offense- however, because of the reasons that people make them, they generally are.

For another example, it's perfectly legal to use different accounts for different wikis.

20:12, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

What wikia says is irrelevant. They do not set policies for member wikis, beyond their little restrictions on checks.

Sockpuppeting is permanent, barring accounts being made to try and go around blocks for other offenses (in which case, the second account blocked forever and the other one has the block extended)

With Enc, his original intent was to change accounts. He did not, however, decide to do so in the end. That alone means the second one, as has been the case with such an event with past users, means it gets permanently blocked. That he mused about it being a backup is irrelevant.

That being said, not sure about this one. Both accounts are active, so it is not a question of a backup. Not trying to cheat or anything, either. Yet, we have that confession (note - would not have meant much without the note saying what happened afterwards) and their behavior generally being similar.

So, permaban in order, though with less justification than usual.

Lordganon (talk) 08:29, June 7, 2014 (UTC)


 * Just letting you all know that Josiah.cervo/AmericaLoove appears to have returned. This time as CasoNuevos. I went ahead and permanently blocked this account. -- 05:32, June 29, 2014 (UTC)

BridgittLaura has arrived again, this time with the name LauraBridgitMendez. She begin's making similar edits and both have same personal information as BridgittLaura did. This is as well completely multiple accounts and Lordganon, feel free to permanently block this account.

Eric von Schweetz, You Young and Sweet Boy!

We Should move this discussion to The Section bridgitLauras's Sockpuppet at the Bottom of the page.Likercat (talk) 10:41, July 8, 2014 (UTC)

MattyMG13
I've recently got a message from this user here. Apparently, Yankovic270 and some others on chat went to jump the gun thinking he was Ratc and thus led him to be banned from chat. Me, thinking he was actually a Ratc sockpuppet (seeing as Yank banned him), I went to ban him for 1000 Years.

However with that message he really doesn't seem to be Ratc at all. What should I do? Should I unban him? What do you all think? -Seiga  2014 May 29, 00:28 (CET)

We need actual evidence to confirm if he is Ratc or not. Lately people have been harassing every new user in chat and I don't think that is a good policy. Innocent until proven guilty, not witch hunts on chat. I would propose an IP check normally, but this user seems distinctly not Ratc. Usually when we catch Ratc we at least have evidence (such as a manual IP check), but here it looks like Yank just shot first and asked questions later. For now I'd say unban him until we have some sort of actual evidence. Mscoree (talk) 22:42, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

From now on, i suggest that we should greet each new user, and make sure that we know who they are. Spartian300 (talk) 22:45, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

Why'd Yank ban him in the first place?

I say unban him, but run an IP check just to be safe.

22:52, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

Not a fan of the new harassment policy. Tr0llis (talk) 22:55, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

Matty is actually a user on several other wikis. And he can spell and use English properly, something that Ratc could never seem to manage. Cour *talk* 23:31, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

According to the general concensus he is not Ratc, thus I have unblocked him. It is ok Seiga, accidents happen. Hope the issue is closed. Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:09, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

Ninjasvswarriors
The user Ninjawarrior has confessed to being a sockpuppet.



I believe this confirms my earlier appeal here. Mscoree (talk) 00:41, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

Right so, Ninjas told me his IP;

114.43.147.247.

He wants the TSPTF to know that he has been only using this account ever since his ban (Don't ask me about the details, that's the message I got on the talk page)

He also wants to tell that Flyingninjapanda is an older sockpuppet

Now I don't know how he behaved as Alexlee, but he seems to have improved his ability to control his sinocentrism (if I recall correctly, that was one of his identifiable traits) and his English. Of course I do agree that he should be blocked for creating sockpuppets, but maybe, just maybe, not permanently blocked.

That would be all, sincerely, Sky Green 24 13:44, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

His behaviour has greatly improved if this is the case and is actually not a bad guy to talk to. I think him admitting it but not continuing to use them for his own gain for any reason should disqualify a ban. Hes really a pretty nice guy all around and i have no personal issue to the fact hes openly admiting he has used the before and personally told me he felt bad about it. I think the fact he hasnt used them since the fact is a good sign his behaviour has since changed for the better which is what we should be advocating on this site.

The precedent for something like this would be the blocking of all sockpuppet accounts along with a month-long ban (or two) to get the message across of not sockpuppeting. I agree he has improved, but letting him off the hook so easy would set a bad example. I am in favour of a month-long ban for Ninja. Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:05, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

He though has confessed, so though I still believe in a ban, I believe it should be shortened slightly. ~Bfox

I would think 1 month would be a reasonable length of time, although perhaps I could look to block him for two weeks. What is the general concensus? Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:11, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

I hope that Ninja isn't permanently banned, but considering that this is supposed to be an automatic permanent ban, I fear that Lordganon will simply go that route. After all he won best ban last year, and basically circumvented a ban for a year or so. I wish of the best of luck Ninja. Tr0llis (talk) 23:13, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

You realize if we do this Ratc could use this against us? I don't want ninja berma banned, but thought it was important to bring up. Saturn (Talk) 23:32, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

Did wikia have to destroy a whole bunch of usernames all linked with Ninja? Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:55, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

Saturn, you can't compare Ninja and Ratc. Ninja got his act together and improved his behaivor. Ratc is still immature and isn't trying to change. Two wrongs may not make a right, '' but it makes me feel a lot better in the end! '' 00:11, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

Like i said his improvement is obvious and hes been the source of many a good times and laughs on chat and has not been seen with sockpuppets since i believe. I Believe that a short 2 week ban would suffice since i dont believe he can get out of this in any way shape or form. Im not TSPTF so its not up to me but 2 weeks definitely seems reasonable.

I am OK with a 2 week-1 month ban, but please give me prior notice. I have to ask someone to post for me in PMIII. Thank you. Ninjasvswarriors (talk)

^This alone only proves that he's changed. I say no ban at all given that Ninja has proven that he can change, while Ratc has proven that he cannot, given that he has already gone through four, I believe five sockpuppets now? Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 05:37, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

If Ninja receives a chance, rat should receive one in 6 months or something if he doesn't do more socks to see if he has changed. OCT MARIUS, HAIL HIM

Please don't perma ban me to stop Ratc from coming back to the wiki. Ninjasvswarriors (talk)

Let us not forget you had a chance to come clean a year ago, but neglected to do so. --NFSreloaded (talk)

I woul12:33, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

I would really recommend not to ban Ninjasvswarriors. He loves this wiki, and he give great contributions here at Althistory and I am a friend of him in real life and he is an expert in history and makes great recommendations. In fact, he constantly recommends his classmates (Captainjohnrex, Pacific Communist, and theMarxist) not to commit acts of ASBness and also has forced theMarxist not to vandalize LG and Seiga Miyako's page many times.)

Rcchang (talk) 13:28, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

I'm sorry NFS, but I didn't saw that a year ago. I'm really sorry. Ninjasvswarriors (talk)

1 month then? Imp (Say Hi?!) 15:13, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

How about 3 weeks? Bfoxius (talk)

I really don't see a reason to ban him. Him getting a chance a year ago and him getting one today are two entirely different things. It is entire unfair to ban something simply because they got a chance a year ago to change. A lot changes in a year, and if we follow the logic of some of the users here to punish someone for an action in the distant past, none of you would be here. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 22:37, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

2 weeks I think is good.

23:15, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

For the record, Ninja, if someone posts for you while you're banned, that's an automatic ban extension for you and a possible ban or warning for them.

24.90.246.100 23:46, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

You meaning someone posting for me in PMIII while I'm banned? Ninjasvswarriors (talk)

the rule is that if someone is banned, they can not have someone else post for them,however suddenly invading because you have been banned is considered meta and your nation will most likly be preserved, look at MS's Austria. Two wrongs may not make a right, '' but it makes me feel a lot better in the end! '' 03:38, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

I'd like to weigh in and say that Ninja has definitely improved and is actually a pretty decent editor. That being said, sockpuppeting is a permabannable offense. I think it's important to remember that, while we really don't want to ban him, rules are rules. That being said, I will not be the one to drop the banhammer. Actually, I'd like to commend him for making it this long with out getting caught. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 06:19, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

Punishment is clear - and there is only one. Permanent block to account.

Much better behaved now though. Shame he didn't have the sense to not confess.

As for that posting bit, posting for someone who is blocked is at a minimum a warning. Depends on person and context.

Lordganon (talk) 06:54, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

I don't think it should be considered sockpuppeting. He made the account after he stopped (was forced to stop) using the Ninjavswarriors account. Aind LG, Ninjas is quite a popular and great guy, and he always has great behavior and also has several great timelines and map games, it would be a shame to block him. Would you be able to make an exception? He has matured a lot since his sockpuppetting days.

Rcchang (talk) 07:05, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

Hello People of Althistory Wiki:

Ninjavswarriors has been notified that he has been permabaned. Therefore he has given a final speech about what he will do in the future, which is posted on the Map Game wiki. He will continue to contribute there.

http://mapgame.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Ninjasvswarriors/Permaban

Please read it, and I wish him best of luck.

Rcchang (talk)

Sigh...

You get permanently blocked for something, then any other account you make gets the same punishment. It's called trying to get around a block.

Could care less about his behavior or popularity.

Lordganon (talk) 08:38, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

* sobbing*

I just felt so bad for Ninja. :(

FirstStooge (talk) 10:32, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

Stuff
Six Kingdoms of New England is just an imitation of A Song of Ice and Fire (Game of Thrones). Should it be deleted? I think it counts as derivative work.

02:38, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Even though it is very similar, the setting and houses are different, leading me to believe it should stay. Bfoxius (talk)

The only thing really similar is the concept. It has completely different content so I think it's fine. Mscoree (talk) 17:31, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

No, it's more or less the same story with OTL people and places.

People of the Dawn - Children of the Forest

Yankees - Andals/First Men

Colonisation - Andal landings

John of House Adams - Aegon I of House Targaryen

Succession of House Lodge - Dance of the Dragon or Blackfyre dispute

Green Rebellion - Robert's Rebellion

Brahmin Uprising - Greyjoy Rebellion

Scrimshaw Throne - Iron Throne

Castle Rock - Casterly Rock

Williams' Landing - King's Landing

Foxwoods - Lannisters

Green Mountain people - Northmen

Downeast - Dorne

17:43, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Who cares. You could say that about basically anything on this site. PM3: Spain = Spain, France = France, Albion = England, etc. Tr0llis (talk) 17:51, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

That's based on real life. This is based on fiction. We have rules about that.

18:25, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Exactly. Marked for deletion. Lordganon (talk) 02:56, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

Wiki Chat
As many of you know, I spend more time on the wiki chat than I should. The chat effectively is a form of "frontier justice", where the chat mods hold all the power and use it as they please because they are respected amongst the community. However, many of the mods (myself included) have been neglecting their responsiblities and instead "joke-kicking" people from chat frequently. Since many of the more respected members of the community (LG, NukeVac) don't go on the chat, most of the active chat mods are Constables and some LTs. The TSPTF page was created before the chat was put into place on this wiki, and thus I don't believe it's updated for it. Therefore I propose that either we put a "chat patroller" section in the "duties" section of the TSPTF page, for TSPTF members who want to be active chat mods (because I know there are TSPTF members that don't like to use their chat mod status, and there are some that use it more often). Another suggestion I have is that we put into place a system of guidelines for when chat mods should kick/ban, as we all have our own personal policies, and I've personally seen trolls exploit them on chat. Any thoughts? Bfoxius (talk)

Sounds like a good idea, as the job of patrolling the chat is already an unofficial responsibility anyway. Hopefully this cuts back on the squirrel problems and other nonsensical aspects of chat culture. Mscoree (talk) 17:34, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Chat is supposed to be the place where we do everything and nothing.

17:38, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Nope. Nope.

You're actually just illegalizing squirrels. That's it. The joke-kicks will continue, the language and irreverence will continue, the chadmins won't change, but you'll make squirrels illegal.

Besides, the point of chat is to be an irreverent idea-generator. Every map game and a sizable amount of proper TL work is hammered out on chat; most of the ideas from community TLs, for instance (DD included; Feddy, Impo, and I have had many a fruitful conversation there on the future of various nations). The only things that shouldn't be allowed there are spam and other such unacceptable activity.

This is the wiki version of SOPA and PIPA.

Forth the Squirrevolution!

20:43, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

I support the Squirrels. I'm forming the Squirrel Party. Our mascot shall be a squirrel. Cour *talk* 23:45, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Dammit, Cour. Dammit. I start the Squirrevolution, I fight alone against invincible odds, I suffer, and now, as we begin to force the Chadmins to allow squirrels, you come in and claim credit?

Nah, I'm joking.

Call it the Squirrevolution, though.

00:10, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

Guideline may not be the worst idea.

However...

Really, a lot of the problem is the chat mods either not blocking inappropriate behavior, or even worse, only using blocks for a quick moment to get their attention. That needs to stop. The number of them that I see immediately revoked after being blocked is just wrong.

Lordganon (talk) 03:02, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

Guns, I think you are missing my point. I'm by no means trying to restrict what you say, just restrict the chat mods a bit and put forth a guideline so we don't have mods kicking/banning for different things. Bfoxius (talk)

Edboy
It recently seems, that on chat, a topic about Edboy popped up. We were talking about Ratc, and about his stocks when we realized that he should've been unbanned on the wiki by now. Now if you look Here It was shows that he was a "Ratc Stockpuppet". Whereas here it says. That he wasn't a Ratc stock. I'm testifying this because I feel that he was wrongly banned, and should be unblocked. He was given a 3 month ban, and was originally supposed to be unblocked sometime ago (I guess). Saturn (Talk) 00:39, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

3 month ban means that at the end of three months, he automatically comes back.

However, when he left, he announced that he would NOT be coming back.

00:45, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

...Did you even read why he got the block extended beyond the original month he received for being offensive, insulting, and the like?

He made an account to get around it, and continue to insult us. So, it got extended.

Simple.

Lordganon (talk) 02:52, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

What Saturn is trying to say is that Ed isn't Midwest or Ratc. It was confirmed by Wikia that Ratc = Midwest (see wall of shame or last archive). It was then confirmed that Ed =/= Ratc, therefore that user who vandalized was not Ed. You extended his ban anyway because of that but it was confirmed to be false. Tr0llis (talk) 10:45, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

May want to, you know, read those archives. Nothing like that was said about Ed and MWC. Only thing said about that was that he denied it. But the evidence is extremely clear. Ed uploads an image as part of an offensive tirade, and gets blocked, with the image deleted almost immediately. Minutes later, MWC uploads the same image.

They are the same individual. Simple.

End.

Lordganon (talk) 02:39, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Why is this even an issue? He basically committed wikicide after leaving his retirement notice. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:13, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Couldn't Midwest just download the image after Ed posted it and reupload it as spam? Also Wikia did an IP check of them and confirmed that Ratc was a certain number of sockpuppets. Ed was not included in that. Tr0llis (talk) 10:39, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Time-wise, and being realistic, no.

Rat is irrelevant when it comes to Ed's block.

Lordganon (talk) 12:04, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

AnnihilationOfWorlds
So I don't mean to jump on the witch hunt train, but there are some very similar aspects between Ratc333 and AnnihilationOfWorlds. They have very similar intrests and when asked questions about things like location or something along the lines, he is very dodgy. Now I was going to wait and see how he posted in map game, but I know Saturn and Sine both agree with my theory. Could an IP Check be requested? Two wrongs may not make a right, '' but it makes me feel a lot better in the end! '' 02:03, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I second this Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk) 04:17, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

We talked about this. I've seen how Ratc communicates and I've seen how AOW communicates. They're two totally different people. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:50, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I'm just paranoid that there is another rat stock, and there's nothing else to do. From now on I will stop witch hunting Ratc and his friggin puppets only if I have proof. Saturn (Talk) 05:53, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I just have a hunch he's someone's sockpuppet. Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk) 06:08, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

True. He has similar interests as Ratc, and has seemed using frequent terms Ratc has. Only if i have further proof I will continue on this. Saturn (Talk) 06:15, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Same here. Further more he just asked me if i liked games about civilizations (Which i do to some extent) and that if i wanted to start one which kinda leads into the fact that ratc's previous sockpuppet had been pushing me to restart the CTD in the mapgame wiki and also the fact that he also tended to go on the Interstellar themes Ratc did. although this time in a more civilized and less implausible manner. Anyway that's what causes my doubts about if he's or not Ratc's new sockpuppet. Sine dei gloriem &#34;Ex Initio Terrae&#34; (talk) 21:46, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Actually I talked to him on chat and his grammar has improved. He has joined a few map games, and was quite plausible. Maybe observe for a while before jumping to conclusions? Rcchang (talk) 23:33, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Paranoia
I'm getting pretty upset at the number of people falsely accusing others of being trolls or Ratc sockpuppets. We're not only scaring off potentially valuable editors, but we're also making fools of ourselves. People, especially those in the TSPTF, need to be capable of making a confident decision when it comes to big matters, and accusing someone of sockpuppetry is a big matter.

In the future, gather information. Be sure that the person being accused of sockpuppetry is guilty. I'm going to start sending out warnings to people who play the sockpuppetry card without investigating. It's getting ridiculous. Slander is bad, kids.

CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:47, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I agree. There are already multiple cases of this.

Rcchang (talk) 05:32, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

He has never returned, I think we beat him at last!Whipsnade (talk) 22:20, October 26, 2014 (UTC)

Plagiarizing?
I was looking around the wiki for something to do and I've seen dramatic writing styles in the America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire timeline. I'm starting to wonder if this is plagiarizing, as Scrooge once saw that the Italy page had been copied to this page. Saturn (Talk) 14:08, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Last year something was reported here for being directly plagarized from Wikipedia and Lordganon said it was fine. Therefore I believe it's allowed. Mscoree (talk) 14:37, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia is alright because they freely state that anything on that site can be used elsewhere without need of citation.

21:36, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

...What I said was that it was fine so long as it was not excessive.

That timeline, imo, needs a lot of rewriting.

Took the content on the Italy pages off of the one that copied it from the other.

Guns is correct.

Lordganon (talk) 12:11, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

Britdgitlaura reverted the info LG removed from the Italy Page. She also stole some parts from This Other page on the wiki as well as some from this page. Saturn (Talk) 15:03, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

Guns sockpuppets
Ok, so I just overheard Guns admitting that Scraw and Crim are sockpuppets. All belonging to guns, saying he used the trick of keeping 2 browsers open. Now can somebody please ban those two if it's true? Or are they just joking?AnnihilationOfWorlds (talk) 22:42, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

He is screwing with you. No sockpuppets there.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 22:47, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Actually, I said three; Chrome, Safari, and Firefox.

Just being factual.

22:49, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Old joke.

22:53, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Lol!

Ok, and I'll come out with my reason for screwing with Anni.

Yes, it was hilarious, but on top of that, how would this brand new user know Scraw and Crim so well? I'm just saying, he appears both here and on chat to be extremely well informed about the wiki.

23:33, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

And he only has 4 edits... Saturn (Talk) 23:36, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I'm not saying he is Ratc, and I personally think we're close to reaching witch hunt levels with that. Owen part two, anyone?

But regardless of that, at this point I think there is a reasonable threat.

23:38, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

So you tricked a new user into reporting you so that you could use it as evidence against him in some sort of sockpuppet trial. If he actually was well informed on the wiki he would know that you can't be trusted at all, and would know that Crim and Scraw are completely different people. Are we seriously going to harass/troll him too? Tr0llis (talk) 23:40, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

No, it was guns idea not mine to prank him. I just commented on what he said. Saturn (Talk) 23:45, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

False, Tr0ll. Seeing that he acted in such a familiar way with the wiki, I decided to see how he would react to such a joke. Someone new would have believed other members of chat when they reassured him it was a joke (and the members of chat present there can testify that it was done in a very joking way, and that several other members did state that it was a joke). Someone old would have realized that I'm not to be trusted at all.

Rat, however, would see this as a perfect opportunity to get some form of revenge.

23:47, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Actually, he has 23 edits on the map game wiki.

Permaban
Ninjas wanted to ask you guys is there anyway a permaban can be lifted or does he has to pass it as a family heirloom? He says he will do whatever he can, as long as it doesn't involve fighting wild animals, breaking into the Pentagon or taking over the known world.

Ahh, damn, whaddya know. The way to be forgiven involves breaking into the Pentagon. Too bad.

01:41, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

No, Nada, Zip, Nothing, etc. Lordganon (talk) 12:12, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

I've Been Thinking...
Hello, TSPTF and active members of the Wiki Community,

First, I'd like to thank you for your time. Second, I would like to bring up an important issue that I've been thinking about over the past two weeks - my ban.

So, as an overview of what took place, I was banned for 2 weeks because I had uploaded (over the course of over 1 year) 3 duplicate images. Nuke, the Lt. who banned me, also pointed to the fact that I delete one of his warnings, which, while true, was viewed out of context since I deleted 3/4 of my talk page with the warning and had not been told to keep the warning on my talk page.

To see the entirety of the problem (at least from my perspective), please see here: LG's talk page on another wiki.

The key facts are, though, that I was banned for 2 weeks (the same amount of time I was banned for harshly insulting and berating the faith of a fellow Wikian, FS) for 0.036% of all of my edits being bad, or 0.78% of my file edits. Additionally, while I have my issues, I have been active in reporting vandals, Ratc's return(s), and working on categorizing.

So, here is why I come before you today - not to cry out about the ban I have already dealt with, but rather to make a proposal to prevent this from taking place again. Now, I feel that some users, esp. those with over 2,500 edits, should have to be banned with the consent of the whole TSPTF unless in the case of vandalism, sockpuppetry, flame-baiting or other larger crimes.

This would give people a chance to defend themselves. I feel that most Wikians would be upset by the length of the ban for such a minor infraction which I committed over the course of 1+ years. If 2.5k is too few, perhaps 4k, but I think the principle is what must be considered. Thoughts? LG/Imp? Lts and Constables? 09:13, June 6, 2014 (UTC)

Still on about that? Sheesh. Nuke's warnings were clearly labeled as such. Your help is more or less irrelevant as to the block.

As for the idea, no way in hell.

Lordganon (talk) 09:45, June 6, 2014 (UTC)

LG, yes his warnings were clear, but they were spread out over the course of 1+ year, leading me to believe that I would not be banned for an over-the-top amount of time, like the amount of time I was banned for viciously attacking FS.

By pointing out my help, my purpose was to let everyone know that I made a couple of administrative errors, not a vital flaw that comprimised the wiki or was overtly offensive.

Please also note that I made a provision for supposed "felonies," but I think misdemeanors more often than not can be explained to some extent. I am not complaining about my ban - it is over for me. I just don't want this happen to others.

Please explain why not, LG? 17:42, June 6, 2014 (UTC)

Vandal
Look here for a vandal, someone block him. Saturn (Talk) 11:13, June 6, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc Strikes Again


Here is a snippet of a conversation I had with AnnihilationOfWorlds. The rest is left out for containing possible personal information. Tr0llis (talk) 23:59, June 7, 2014 (UTC)

Why don't you all just LEAVE ME ALONE!!!!!! You know I hate having a bad reputation!AnnihilationOfWorlds (talk) 00:03, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

DFTT?

It is too late Ratc, you commited a crime, and you must be punish, even if that punishment is unfair, it is what it is, and you choosed your path very well, you must deal with your actions for one moment, Man up and suck it up. Continue this and you will only be seen as a bugger. Prove yourself better and bring a better reputation from another place and perhaps you will be allowed once again into this wiki. And even that its a long shot Sine dei gloriem &#34;Ex Initio Terrae&#34; (talk) 00:06, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

Troll baiting?

Prehaps he has changed?

Are you enjoying hunting him down?

A which hunt?

Will he be alowed to prove he is less porfaine?Whipsnade (talk) 00:26, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

It's a shame - AnnihilationofWorlds (or Ratc) has actually shown improvement. However, rules are rules Anni - and there's a lot of evidence suggesting that you're Ratc. Rcchang (talk) 00:36, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

I am not Ratc.Whipsnade (talk) 00:49, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

I don't think anyone said you were. Tr0llis (talk) 00:51, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

OK.Whipsnade (talk) 00:53, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

Considering he admitted it to Trollis, and Sine (who im not sure took a screenshot) i believe its quite obvious what the option it. Lets be honest i dont want to sound mean, but i dont enjoy having to doubt every single new person that comes on thinking its Ratc. So lets end this once and for all

He also confessed a few lines up. Mscoree (talk) 17:09, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

If he is really Ratc, even if he improved, the rules are clear, He may have to be blockedALLONS-Y!!,Basically, RUN!! 17:27, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

Told you so.

17:45, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

rat agan? i knew anni was rat. -Sat (i was checking the wiki from summer camp, and i saw this DOWN WITH RATC)

Ratc has arrived again, this time with the name CaptainSmasher. Mscoree (talk) 21:17, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

He said he's continuing to come back again and again. We need to take action, or he'll turn into Owen 2.0. Bfoxius (talk)

If this happens again, I'm reporting all known usernames and IPs of Ratc to wikia. They blocked his Ratc account already for harassing me on other wikis as a warning. This is not only a waste of everyone's time, but it's putting everyone on edge, which I will not stand for.

CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 18:34, June 9, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc returned as LieutenantMario, and I've went to block it permanently. Just letting everyone know. -Seiga  2014 June 11, 05:25 (CET)

Continued Vandalism on New Union Articles
Several IPs have been making minor (though annoying) edits to several articles on New Union. Regardless of whether I block the IP or revert their edits, they simply revert them.

The IPs include:


 * 95.236.184.20
 * 95.244.185.120
 * 79.45.174.224

I've went ahead and protected several articles on the timeline to curve these edits and have contacted the recent IP address to cease these edits. After blocking one of the articles, the IP then commented on the talk page (which means he intended to continue vandalizing the article).

I have no doubt these are the same individual, which means there no real way to block them (since they can change their IPs [SonnyPatton all over again]). Not sure what to do beyond what I've already did, so I'll bring this up so it can be known. -- 17:04, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

Here is an anon vandal of this page -- List of Presidents of Chile (Central World). Edits reverted, just need a ban. Thanks, 09:16, June 10, 2014 (UTC)
 * Special:Contributions/14.2.44.77

I have another problem, this time with my timeline (6-2-5 Upheaval). So, I started writing some elections pages and accidentally made the page US Presidential Election of 1960 when I intended to make the page US Presidential Election of 1956. I moved the page to 1956, and I figured that'd be the end of my worries. That was a while back. Now, when I went to make the page for the election in 1960, I couldn't because I relocated the 1960 page and somehow I left a redirect when I renamed the page.

Can someone fix this problem for me? Thank You, 10:30, June 10, 2014 (UTC)

Here you go. All I had to do was remove the redirect. Mscoree (talk) 10:34, June 10, 2014 (UTC)

Thank you, Ms. Sometimes I just cannot figure some basic stuff out. 23:59, June 10, 2014 (UTC)

Linq
User Linq seems like to spam "Nice blog!" over some blogposts on this wiki. He also vandalizing 1983: Doomsday and making such nonsense editing on his own map game, Great Advance Restarted (Map Game).

FirstStooge (talk) 05:29, June 12, 2014 (UTC)

Looks like someone trying to get badges easily rather than a malicious user. Gave him a warning. Will follow up with a block if he doesn't stop. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:52, June 12, 2014 (UTC)

Hi,

Linq is my friend at school. He spams because he thinks that if he has a lot of edits and badges, everyone will respect him. However, he uses the school computers, and as a result, I could not use the school computers to make any edits, and CaptainJohnRex and a few other users from my school couldn't either since the IP was banned.

Rcchang (talk) 22:58, June 13, 2014 (UTC)

Chat Abuse
I am sorry to bring up something that may be controversial, but these are the kinds of discussions that I feel need to be had, comfortable or not. As you all may (or may not) be aware, today is the day of the Political Elections.

Mostly a whimsical event taken too seriously by people like me, these are supposed to be fun ways to bring the community closer together. However, in chat today, things got quite serious.

A bit of background first. Chat has never really been too controlled. As Bfox put it once, it is a sort of "Wild West" with sherrifs brandishing their pistols in the air. There is one main dispute that rages on... the Squirrevolution. The main opponents are Guns and Fed. Guns sees the ban on squirrels (as imposed by Fed) to be tyrannical, as does much of the wiki.

Today, Fed was on the chat, along with Ms, Guns, Tr0llis, Andrew, myself, and a few others. Engaging in fun political banter, it became clear that the TSPTF were acting a bit authoritarian. (What can you expect from "Communists"?) They kicked Guns, then Sine, then Tr0llis, then banned Guns, and finally (without a kick as a warning or any other direct warning to me) I was banned. I cannot relate any of the story from there, as I was banned.

I asked Fed to unban me, or else this wiki would have this discussion. Well, now we are having this discussion.

According to Fed (and Crim, who I do not think [not sure, but definitely was not speaking] was on chat at the time), I was banned for ad hominem attacks on Andrew. The only comments I made were directed at either Comrade Bear (your stereotypical Communist, who Fed seems to personify) and Chairman Meow (the avatar which Andrew uses). None of the attacks were on Fed or Andrew directly but on their abuse of mod powers and Communist propaganda.

Additionally, I was banned for "spamming," although spamming is defined as "send[ing] the same message indiscriminately to (large numbers of recipients) on the Internet." I varied my message, but generally speaking all of my comments were aimed at the same idea, but not once did I repeatedly copy/paste the same message, as "spamming" would imply.

That was one incident, but not the only incident. Twice, when in an argument over the plausibility of Viva's African Vivimpire, Oyo/Najiria, he has kicked me when I have only argued about his nation and nothing else. Generally speaking, authoritarian modding practices are frowned upon by all other users in chat, but at the same time the mod will not notice/pay attention.

As I told Fed, unban me or this is going to Ganon. Enough really is enough, and mod abuse on chat has reached a tipping point. I am not sure what needs to be done to correct this issue for the long term (that is why we elect TSPTF members, no?) but something has to change. 03:37, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Those attacks at "comrade bear" and "comrade meow" were obviously meant at us two. You don't have to refer directly to a person so that that person knows that attack is directed towards him.

As for the spam, the wording may have been marginally different every time you posted it, but the message remained the same. The definition applies. Fed (talk) 03:42, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

I never abused my mod powers against you Rex, you are cherry picking events here. I kicked troll for spamming not for political attacks, actually on chat I was very friendly toward political debate constantly saying everyone is allowed to voice my opinion. This is silly and there is no need to waste the TSPTF's time.ALLONS-Y!!,Basically, RUN!! 03:44, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Fed, I attacked Comrade Bear and *Chairman* Meow precisely because I was attacking the hypocrisy of the purported beliefs of the Communist party, and those characters represent you in the Communist Party. Not once did I personally insult either of you - it was all directed at the ongoing political simulator elections. Andrew, I am not trying to say you did anything wrong. I don't really believe that Fed should get any reprimand for how he reacted. I just feel that this is a discussion that must be had - Chat.

I think that this is most definitely not a waste of the TSPTF's time, since we have an issue, and nothing can be resolved by day-long bans and resulting bad feelings. Since I cannot go onto chat to discuss this problem, we have to speak about it in a public forum, and this is the most appropriate public forum available.

I do not think I called you out for being overly authoritarian towards me, Andrew. You were not, and if that is the impression you got from what I passionately typed, I apologize.

Now, Fed, you make it sound like I just spammed messages like "Stop the Commies!" over and over. That is not true. I did indeed change what I was saying, and it was not intended to clutter the chat. While I did have a number of cliche (and perhaps in your mind overused by the world population as a whole) responses, I never truly spammed chat.

Furthermore, even if I did insult either of you on a personal level (which I did not, but you may have had different perceptives), there is a certain expectation to be had for the TSPTF, or the officers of the wiki. IRL, should an angry mob verbally attack police officers, they cannot do anything about it. I believe that as members of the TSPTF, you ought to act similarly. Perhaps I am a bit too romantic towards the reality which is the TSPTF, maybe I am a bit too romantic towards the expectations I have for Chat Moderation. 04:33, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

"I don't really believe that Fed should get any reprimand for how he reacted."

Is that why you blackmailed me saying 'unban me now or I go to Ganon' and why this post is titled 'mod abuse'? Fed (talk) 04:58, June 14, 2014 (UTC) Chat Abuse, but same difference, no? I seriously do not want you to get into any kind of trouble, but I think that what happened needs to be brought before the TSPTF and Lordganon. Fed, once you are done findng any ways in which I can be turned into the "bad one," I'd appreciate it if you could talk to the points which I made? 05:33, June 14, 2014 (UTC)
 * I'll get the popcorn. Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk)

Here is what I remember: What I don't understand is, we asked Fed permission to talk about the simulation (hold a "march"), he then said the attached picture. Also, no one is being blackmailed. IF anything Rex is holding his government accountable.
 * I quoted the Blues Brothers and said the line about "Orange Whips". I said orange whips the amount of times in the quote (about three lines overall) and Fed kicked me for spamming. That I can understand at least.
 * I then started talking about the government simulation and politics differing from Fed's beliefs. I was then banned.

Tr0llis (talk) 12:58, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Firstly, I would like to point one thing out; I was most certainly not spamming. At no point did I even repeat the same sentence (well, except for a few celebrations about the Netherland's 5-1 smashing of spain- #ORANJE2014).

Secondly, the Squirrevolution is not nonsensical. It's satirical. There IS a difference.

13:11, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Can someone remind me what's going on? Bfoxius (talk)

Apperently, Rex said something stupid, ticked off Fed, and got banned. Or at least that's what I'm reading. With Guns and Tr0llis, I can understand the kicking. They do a lot of stuff in chat that gets them kicked a lot (like spamming squirrel smilies). With Sine, it was probably for laughs for for something justifiable by the mods. With Rex, he says a host of stupid and unneccessary things, such as harassing a user over their actions in a map game (such as myself). So there is probably more to his ban than we know. Just a shame I didn't see that conversation go down myself. And Rex, I kicked your during the argument because you becoming annoying, disrespectful, and insulting my actions and my intelligence because I refused to conform to your views of ATL. Saying a kicked you for no reason is pushing it. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 13:58, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Really not buying any of this, Rex. I know enough of how you lot act in that chat to know better. Same reason for kicking as always.

Guys, if they do stuff like this in the chat and don't listen, just block them from the wiki. Seems to not learn from chat blocks.

Any more of this garbage about those "parties" and "politics" leading a to a fight, I'll probably just put tags on it.

Lordganon (talk) 14:35, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

How do you plan to put tags (I assume you mean categories) on my user page, and how is that in any way a punishment? Mscoree (talk) 14:56, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Firstly, I have never spammed squirrels. I want to point out that I have, occasionally, posted one or two, and those are kickable offenses. For god knows what reason.

Secondly, in this case, I think I was banned because Feddy supports Spain and I support the Dutch.

Not cool, Feddy.

Ms, deletion tags, I believe.

22:45, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Also, I just want to say that I agree with LG about the political parties. They're a joke, guys. You all take them WAY too seriously.

Now the world cup, that IS serious.

22:57, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Guns, not everyone cares about the World Cup, and we don't take the political sim that serious. When the election's all said and done, we'll forget about it for another six months.

It's funny, when this issue's all said and done, Rex and everybody else will be unbanned from chat.

Bfoxius (talk)

Feddy banned half a dozen people yesterday over it. People thought I was part of that, too, because I may have been rubbing in the fact that the Dutch smashed the Spanish 5-1 (ORANJE WOOHOO). Feddy cares, I care, people I respect care, end of story.

23:05, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

I did not write this post so that I can try and appeal my chat ban. It really does not bother me, being away from chat for one day. I wrote it so that we can discuss chat guidelines. We had general consensus that they were needed back at the start of this month.

Nothing has happened, and that is the main reason that I am trying to get real discussion going about this. Ignore what happened... "It doesn't matter; it's in the past." But let's learn from this. Let's improve the wiki. Let's do what we agreed was needed. We need to actually discuss this issue, or it will keep popping up. 00:21, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Correct - deletion tags. Had I meant categories, I would have said that. Nor did I say a word about your user page.

Realistically, we do have guidelines - just need to actually be enforced.

As for the squirrel bit, do know you guys have spammed them.

Lordganon (talk) 14:23, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Please don't put deletion tags on my user page. This problem represents something among a few, not all of us. Mscoree (talk) 14:28, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

I've never typed a squirrel once. Secondly, on this chat even if you post one in your entire lifetime you get kicked. It's not about spamming (despite what the admins may document it as), it's about the simple act of using a squirrel. I believe Fed once said something along the lines of, "they're vermin and not allowed at all." If they weren't allowed at all I'd think the brass would just remove them. Tr0llis (talk) 14:30, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Tr0ll, you have not typed a squrrel once - and I've never kicked you for squirreling once. The two people who I've most kicked for squirrel abuse are ratc, who did it only when I said I was not allowing them,  and Guns, who spams shamelessly. The "vermin" thing is called a joke; I know apparently you don't get any of my jokes, since you also posted a joke as explicit permision, but it was a joke nonetheless.

I have placed a non-tolerance policy on squirrels because I know that otherwise they're abused horrendously; for instance, once, while discussing PM3 policy in another wiki chat I had no admin powers (Ms was banned at the time, and we needed his opinion), after the facts somebody copy-pasted as many squirrels as chat box allows onto chat non-stop for about fifteen minutes.

As for Guns, I could not care any less about whether you support the Netherlands or not; the reason why I banned you is the fact that you filled Ms' PM chock-full of squirrels, and then started hammering on about "squirrevolution" in chat, at which point i was so irritated by your, Tr0ll's and Rex's nonsensical screams about dictatorship that I enforced a two-hour (should've been more) ban from chat because of spam, something I'm entirely entitled to. And don't exaggerate things; I didn't ban "half a dozen people", I banned three people.

Before you go out spouting "political oppression" think about it. Bfox, Ms and Viva all opposed the Communists vehemently, both IRL and in the government simulation; had I tried to oppress them, I would've banned them as well, don't you think? Fed (talk) 17:16, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

WOAH WOAH WOAH!

That's a blatant LIE, Feddy. I filled his PM YESTERDAY, and NOT when I was banned for it, and only because the general opinion on chat- including that of Ms- was that it would help the situation.

I talked about the Squirrevolution... twice. I actually just asked around "Who's in in the Squirrevolution?", and then I held a rally for the Squirrevolutionaries.

Also, Feddy, I have NEVER spammed squirrels. If you banned squirrels because someone spammed them once, then you should ban all emoticons, all english words, and all links, because people spam them too. Your idea of spam is "woah I see a squirrel". You know what? For now on, everytime you kick someone for posting a squirrel, I'll screenshot it and post it on my userpage; after 100 kicks, let's see if even ONE of them has more than one squirrel.

I VERY much doubt it.

18:20, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Is all this bickering really necessary? Lg has provided his opinion, fed has defended himself. Let's just stop the silly bickering. Ok, as far as I'm concerned fed was right. And it has nothing to do with politics, if it did everyone that didn't agree would have been kicked or banned. Please, just chill.ALLONS-Y!!,Basically, RUN!! 18:44, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

^ I agree.

18:48, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Andrew is right, but that does not mean that this discussion should be over. We just need to stop the bickering, but we can carry on talking about the need for better (or more enforced) chat guidelines.

LG, you stated that there are guidelines for chat. Could you link them, and then perhaps go over them so all Chat Mods know the instructions and how to follow them?

I also agree with Guns' statement about Squirrels and spamming. Much like the Prohibition, the ban does not prevent squirrels and only makes them more popular and likely to be spammed, which is clearly what Fed is trying to prevent. 20:49, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Are you kidding? You've been on chat long enough to know what's expected of you. You aren't a toddler, Rex. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 21:09, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

I know what is expected of me, yes. I would like to make sure the mods know what is expected of them. I think that reviewing our Wiki's Policy is of vital importance. We must be an organized community with specific rules and regulations, rule of law, rather than what someone with a star by their name and a badge on their user pages says, autocratic rule.

Crim, you make it sound like my request is outlandish, but I just want to make sure that we go over things like this. I am pretty sure that nowhere in the rules of chat are squirrels prohibited, for instance. 00:49, June 16, 2014 (UTC)

Guidelines = same as wiki ones, more or less. Not hard to figure out.

Know full well you guys spam those things.

Spamming is prohibited. You guys spam squirrels. Simple. And your response to both that and warnings/blocks is to do it more.

Problem is that the warning and blocks are, realistically, empty threats - often taken back right away, or the only consequences. Needs to be wiki blocks if it persists after warnings.

Lordganon (talk) 10:00, June 16, 2014 (UTC)

Actually, we don't.

Here's a PERFECT example. I had been absent from chat for quite some time, and when I came back, Sat posted a squirrel, in response to which I posted ONE squirrel.

Here's the result: ONE squirrel is a ban, and then they claim it was spam? I have witnesses to the fact that I was absent from chat for quite some time, as I was playing an online card game with some of them: as Will, Feud, Fed, Toby, Crim himself, Ms, and someone who claimed to be LG, though I do doubt that. 01:06, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

Here is another example of the "spamming":

In picture one above I posted (for the first time in quite some time and definitely the first one all day) a single squirrel. You can even see Fed in the picture saying it is not a bannable offense (maybe a kickable one then). In picture two we see Fed threatening to delete the evidence I posted on the wiki (and I believe he later did). I hope that shows that posting squirrels is a kickable offense currently, spam or not. Thanks, Tr0llis (talk) 01:20, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

Squirrels is a kickable offence indeed at first thing.

As for deleting the influence, "I believe he later did", he says, POSTING THE FILE I THREATENED TO DELETE. Are you kidding me?? Fed (talk) 01:22, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

If a squirrel is a kickable offense (pray tell why) then why was I chatbanned for posting a SINGLE squirrel? Note, I had not posted ANY squirrels prior to that.

01:23, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

I was not responsible for banning you because of the squirrels, and it's a kickable offence because you've overdone it and no more squirrels are acceptable. Fed (talk) 01:25, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

When making this post it looked like the image was removed. It has just come to my attention that the file was vandalized not by Fed, but by Blocky. I had to reupload it to make this post. Tr0llis (talk) 01:29, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

First off, ONE user- some flashie- spammed squirrels a LONG time ago. Since then, they have been banned, and users who even protested the silliness of the ban were kicked. This is stupid, and should be changed- we'd ALL shut up about squirrels if you'd stop banning them.

Secondly, Feddy, if so, then most of your chadmins don't know that, cuz this isn't the first time such a ban has occurred for a single squirrel.

Can we turn chat off?

01:31, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

This is so childish its ridiculous. for the love of god people how hard it is to not act like an idiot and not spam.

Fed its a squirrel, GET OVER IT, 1 or 2 every little bit isnt the end of the world as long as they are not superspammed.

Squirrel People. Stop throwing up such a big fuss over a squirrel Smilie. Its a smilie on a chatbox on a website you frequent that has rules about spamming. FOLLOW THE RULES PEOPLE

Chadmins, for the love of god show some restraint. No more joke banning and kicks need to be reserved for when the situation calls for it and Bans need to be legitimate and not over personal opinion. I take a grand total of two or three of you seriously because i cant trust any of you to NOT abuse your Chadmin powers over absolutely Frivolous or ridiculous crap. Honestly nobody takes you guys seriously anymore because when people are banned now its a joke, or for a personal reasons, such as dislike for a particular member.

That is where i disapprove. Bans and kicks cause you dislike someone rather than them acting up and causing issues are two different things. When you are acting as an Chadmin, your bans and kicks can not and should not reflect your personal reasoning and dislike for a certain member of the wiki, and trust me it happens alot more than certain people would care to admit. CUT IT OUT and grow up. Me and Viva had a big blowout the other day. Still went and apologized for my stubborn and outwardly rude behavior towards him. Please i know you all can grow up and be a little less ridiculous towards eachother.

So for my final words im just putting it out there that pretty much everyone needs an attitude adjustment (including myself in some cases) We need to be more civil to eachother in chat, big blowouts need to be stopped (with kicks as appropriate) and Chadmins need to stop acting on personal dislike and bias against someone. If it doesnt stop ill contact higher ups to take action who im absolutely sure at this point are probably absolutely done with all this nonsense and foolishness. What stops LG from just removing chat alltogether and making this a non issue. To be honest i actually enjoy chat and when people are civil its a pretty fun and nice place to be. But when a new user walks into a total storm where a single smilie or ridiculous stuff happens causes kicks and bans it makes our wikia look awful and has probably stifled our new user base by a ridiculous amount. We are one of the first venues that new users visit and while some people try to act civil, nice, and open to new users, walking into a total storm of a chat with ridiculousness floating around and bans and kicks flying left and right... yeah that immediately turns me off as a fequent user.. imagine a new user. Well thats all i have to say

...

Really guys? You are doing squirrels like that? And complaining? Sheesh.

Quite frankly, given the overall context, a lot of the ones you guys used in those images, I'd have kicked you too. Not a question of spam, but... Well, I'd call it, for lack of a better way, "Poking the Bear." It's kind of like saying "I won't listen to your rules."

As noted before, no rules against squirrels. But the "why" of you posting those ones? I would say that needs to stop.

Troll, you need to learn to read sarcasm. Kind of obvious that that is what Fed did there.

Yeah, I have just about had it with this. Almost regret turning the "chat" feature on, actually. Concept of turning it off grows more appealing.

That card thing - definitely not me.

Lordganon (talk) 09:53, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

Removing chat is a very risky move. I see a lot of people leaving if we make that move. I've seen sites make this move and it spelled disaster for them. People will just post links to other wiki chats and frequent ours less and less. Over time, we'll lose traffic to competitor wikis. Worse, what wiki will everyone go to for chat? Likely, the Map Game Wiki. We can't lose traffic to the Map Game Wiki of all places. I'd rather lose traffic to the Man/Boy Love Association Wiki than the Map Game Wiki. I'm not sure if that's a big deal for any of the other head admins, but it's a pretty big deal for competitive people like me.

I think, rather than deleting chat, the chat mods need to take their jobs seriously. It would definitely help if people like Tr0llis weren't constantly trying to start arguments about stupid things. The fact that an argument over whether or not people should be allowed to spam squirrels is the hottest debate of the month is pretty pathetic, don't you guys think? Can't we at least argue about something not involving squirrels?

CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 13:10, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

No intention of removing it, rest assured.

Taking their jobs seriously - and, my beef, actually instituting punishments and not immediately reversing them - would do wonders.

Pretty pathetic, true enough.

Lordganon (talk) 13:40, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

On another note - going to try and keep the chat up more often. Though, bet money on me not paying any attention to it. Lordganon (talk) 13:41, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

I think the issue is more so the right to have squirrels at all, not to spam them. If the administration decides they should be banned just remove them. As for Lordganon's entry, I'm sure his presence is very much welcome. Mscoree (talk) 14:03, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

I feel like just having LG on chat- regardless of whether he is paying attention- will solve 90% of the chat's issues.

15:22, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

Not even that, probably the threat of it solves 90% of the issues

BridgittLaura's Own Althistory Wiki
While BridgittLaura has been blocked by Lordganon, she is goanna strike again. This time, BridgittLaura has founded an another wiki called Alternate-Histories Wiki and she is founder. It liberally means admin of this newly wiki and steals copying one of America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire articles. For example, they copying from United States (America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire) to United States (Americana Unionismo). BridgittLaura also stealing copyrighting and copy from Alternative History:Templates to Alternate-Histories:Templates This is not okay and you should report Community Central if Wikia deleted this wiki. Thanks you!

Regards ArsenaliaFIRE (talk) 12:39, July 19, 2014 (UTC)

See at:http://alternatehistories.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:2225ArsenaliaFIRE (talk) 12:39, July 19, 2014 (UTC)

For Tagalog: http://alternatehistories.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:2230ArsenaliaFIRE (talk) 12:39, July 19, 2014 (UTC)

DannyCity Circumventing His Block?
I recently blocked DannyCity for duplication. Recently a new user by the name DannyGuySonic22 began uploading similar files as DannyCity.

This is clearly DannyCity circumventing his block (which was only for a week). Not completely sure what to do. I will block this new account as well. LG, feel free to permanently block either or both accounts upon reading this. -- 23:31, June 18, 2014 (UTC)

Just getting around to this. Yeah, hunting around shows him admitting to it on another wiki, made for just this purpose. Perm blocks added. Lordganon (talk) 15:32, June 20, 2014 (UTC)


 * Lol, didn't realize you perm blocked him (the squirrel debate made me miss that one). Anyway, I just got a message from an IP claiming to be DannyCity and He requests that his first account be unblocked. I went ahead and banned the IP. However, I would request that we do remove the block on him. While no doubt he made a bonehead move by creating a new account to get by his first block, I genuinely believe he's learned (in the hardest way possible) that both these things were wrong. Combined with the fact that he's pulling a SunnyPatton by manipulating multiple IPs, I suggest we unblock him. But if he does anything like this afterwards, than I'll shut up. -- 21:35, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

Zero tolerance policy, and he has, by my findings, tried similar things elsewhere. Not going to undo this one. Lordganon (talk) 15:11, June 25, 2014 (UTC)


 * Do forgive me. I wasn't aware of the zero tolerance policy (don't have to deal with that many on my end). -- 15:36, June 25, 2014 (UTC)

The End of Squirrels
I've made a long overdue MediaWiki page for emoticons. As you will all notice, I added some cool, new ones. Among others, we have the (tardis) emoticon and the shark emoticon. You'll all notice fairly quickly, though, that squirrels are no longer an emote on this wiki since some users can't handle having them. No, they will not be coming back, no matter how much you people ask. If we see another incident like the squirrel incident, all emoticons are going to be going away for a very long time.

CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 01:54, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

I have been trying to tell people for ages that if they don't like squirrels they can be removed. I'm glad this is finally over. Mscoree (talk) 01:57, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

OMFG. Literally an hour after the whole issue gets resolved, Crim opens it up again. GODDAMMIT. Good job, Crim.

01:59, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

The iron fist of the TSPTF has smashed the squirrevolution down and pulled it up by its roots! No way!

At the request of users, I have added... *sigh* Elsa and Polandball emotes. I have no idea why I enable you people... CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 02:55, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Elsa =/= A Squirrel. 06:57, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Oh god you actually made chat worse. ELSA?

I hated that movie. It was ridiculously generic and anti-climatic, and the plot made no sense.

Wait, so let me get this straight. After the whole "squirrevolution" business is over, after no one else on chat or on the wiki are actually paying attention it, when everyone has forgotten about it, you decide "Hey, let's open up the whole argument  all over again", you ban squirrels, and then you complain about US being "enabled"?

Crim, just, I mean... smh.

10:43, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

And so they've come to an end. About time. Thank you Crim. That is all. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 11:03, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Although I do enjoy elsa and the tardis, we still need thumbleweed.

On a more serious topic, won't the squirrevolution find a new emoticon? Sky Green 24 - Join the party  14:25, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

The squirrel revolution had little to do with actual squirrels. It was just about have clear and fair guidelines for chat really. I'd imagine now Guns will continue toward that goal, and maybe pursue the return of the squirrel emoticon. Mscoree (talk) 14:46, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Guns, you know that the revolution business was not over and people continued posting squirrels. If you had forgotten about it, you must have the memory of a goldfish. If anything like the squirrel business starts again, emotes are gone. Period. Squirrels are not coming back either. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 17:49, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

I think what he meant was, the squirrel revolution was getting so much exposure that Fed no longer was kicking per squirrel. Spamming of course was still not allowed, but we were finally getting to a point where you could post a single squirrel in a non spam-like manner and not be punished for it. Sounds like that essentially made the matter settled, but just as things were cooling down, squirrels were completely removed. That's how I understand it anyway. Mscoree (talk) 18:34, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Ms is pretty right on. The fact that you removed squirrels when a VAST MAJORITY of the entire wiki community wants them is by definition tyrannical. Just because you can access MediaWiki stuff and we cannot doesn't mean that you can abuse it.

Furthermore, this should at a minimum, have been brought before the entirety of the TSPTF. LG and Imp, our two active Brass, did not sign off on this (AFAIK) and if they did, they did not do so publicly. In fact, LG said he was considering it, but made no further move to do anything.

This is just ridiculous, in my opinion. One person cannot hijack chat. Wikia is quite clear, admins are for doing stuff for the community, not for themselves. 19:12, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

...

Crim, Rcc, posted a single squirrel because he didn't believe me when I told him that the Squirrevolution had won.

Ms, yeah, basically.

Good job, Crim. You managed to cause a resolved problem to become a big one AGAIN. Like, actually? Everyone except you is happy with the settlement, so you just go and screw eveything up? Isn't the TSPTF meant to RESOLVE disputes?

19:15, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

I'm not an avid squirrel supported but someone give these people their squirrels back Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk)

Hold on a second.

This is so wrong.

Why were squirrels banned? Common premises include:

So, why exactly were they taken away? If they were used responsibly, and not as spam, I don't see a sensible reason that they should have been removed. As you can see, several users have changed their icons to squirrels in protest. I have had mine changed for a while, but I still echo the same sentiment - the squirrels were taken unjustly and should be restored immediately.
 * 1) The frequent spamming of the squirrel icon - This was highly popularized by Ratc. However, taking the emoticon away from the entire wiki is a nuclear solution. Just because one person can't handle something doesn't mean we should all loose our privileges. When everyone else uses it, the icon is used merely once or twice, not as spam. Let me say - spam is not permitted. However, one could just as easily spam the new (tardis) and (elsa) icons. What would happen then, would those be taken away as well?
 * 2) Prejudices by mods - I didn't really see the problem here. I know Fed wasn't a fan of the squirrel, and would ban people for using it once. However, he got over this and allowed it in normal conversation. Other than him, I didn't see any other mods banning the emoticon when it was used normally.
 * 3) The Squirrevolution - Honestly, this argument isn't even about squirrels at all. This stands for the freedom of speech, the press, and so on. You know what? If I want to post a Squirrel icon on chat, I will. But now I can't, because it's been taken away. I know in the US, there are multitudes of court cases dealing with our freedoms - for example, Texas v. Johnson  and Tinker v. Des Moines . These rights are protected.

Cour *talk* 20:09, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

1. ...yes. If someone spammed the (tardis) or (elsa) icons, they would be taken aay.

2. Crim, Imp and other mods have all kicked because use of the squirrel. It's preventive policy.

3. THe Squirrevolution is ridiculous. Firstly, there's no place in this wiki's policy that guarantees freedom of speech, and the removal of an ICON won't take away your freedoms or whatever. Fed (talk) 21:38, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

The problem seems to be the methods used to moderate chat. Simply taking away an icon will not limit a user's spam, only change it. However, it will prevent the rest of the population from using it. I believe that this is not a effective method. Cour *talk* 21:42, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Seriously? I remember a time when wikians acted like civilized humans and didn't whine and war on the TSPTF talk page over one emoticon. Bfoxius (talk)

I remember a time before the admins would have abused their power to ban it in the first place.

21:51, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

How is removing an emoticon abusing of power? Fed (talk) 21:54, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Look, it's not the emote, it's the principle of the thing. This wiki is quite proudly a democracy; we represent every member equally, or at least hope to.

When almost every user on chat- including several TSPTF members- think that a rule is stupid and should be struck down, and then two admins refuse to strike it down (when they, it should be noted, installed it) for personal reasons, I don't think we can call that anything else.

Furthermore, that rule was voted against on the TSPTF page, I believe, and yet is still enforced.

AFAIK, the issue has once again been resolved, and so I recommend we all forget about this as soon as possible.

22:02, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

I liked the emoticon and kicking, it was great kinda like a inside joke with everyone. And cour don't blame rat for everything he never did a squirrel once, it was guns who awesomely spammed it out of existence. <font color=Purple face="Algerian">OCT MARIUS, HAIL HIM

I never had a problem with squirrel. My problem was with spam. And Guns and others just used the emote in the hundreds repeatedly. It became annoying and stopped being funny after the first three days.

00:52, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

No longer works... 04:47, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

Yes. Because people abused it.

04:50, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

Good god seriously? this is extremely off the wall. Removing it really just pisses alot of people off and turns this Squirrelvolution thing into a legitimate issue about TSPTF members being able to responsibly handle power. In my eyes, yes thats an abuse of power, no you do not have the right to revoke an emoticon just cause it bugs you, maybe if you enforced legitimate bans for spam THIS WOULDNT BE AN ISSUE

I for one would like to see it restored just for the principle of it. Spam or not, enforcing legitimate chat bans over overuse of it should be standard rather than removing it. Now youve just honestly pissed alot of people off when the issue was already solved. At least changing the Squirrel to the Ban me thing was actually kind of funny given the irony. Completely removing it is a tad over the top and honestly is not exactly the best way to handle this situation.

I honestly realize that some people cannot be mature when using the emoticons but your pretty much punishing everyone for the actions of a few people. Thats not how this works. If Ratc sat there and got banned for vandalism this is essentially tantamount to the TSPTF banning every standard user for Vandalism. Thats the standard issue i see with this. Ill agree about it being overused and pretty much been killed by Guns and friends, but that shouldnt constitute in the removal of the emoticon for use by the responsible users.

LG said himself that you guys need to take your jobs seriously and actually enforce your punishments. If that was the case none of this would be an issue in the first place.

You guys warn and warn and warn and then do a 10 second ban. How does that allow for anytime to think about the fact your being a jerk off on chat and shouldnt be. enforcing the few hour bans and at most 1 day bans for spamming would probably make this whole thing dry up in less than 2 weeks just because people know their ban wont be lifted less than a minute after its brought down they come back and do the same exact thing. I see it on average 3 or 4 times a week when im on chat. So can we please be a bit more responsible with the Chadmin powers?? If its an issue of being seen as the bad guy for banning people over spam... get over it.

Please restore the squirrel and please for the love of god start enforcing legitimate chat bans for these issues instead of letting it get to the TSPTF or letting it turn in a wiki dividing issue.

Expanding upon what Feud said (and I think it is a very valid point), I believe that the TSPTF should be somewhat separated from the Chat Moderator powers. Not all Constables use chat, and not all of them are the best people to be Chat Mods. This does not mean they should not be in the TSPTF, they just should not be Chat Mods.

Not everyone can control people on chat. I know I can't when I am on any wiki I have Chat Mod powers on, I just am not good (or experienced enough) at it.

Now, how will we do this? This will probably only apply to future constables and shouldn't be applied retroactively unless someone is proven to be abusive with the powers. I think a good way to implement this plan is to have a person, when nominated for User Rights, to be nominated for Constable with or without Chat Mod Powers.

Some people who do not use chat as much but have still done great services for the wiki (think LG or Nuke as Constable nominations), will opt to not have Chat Mod powers, while others would prefer them.

Separating the Chat Mod and Constable powers, in my opinion, is a good idea and is worth some consideration.

Thanks, 07:24, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

From what Feud has stated, I find I must agree with him. My only issue with the stupid icon was spam. But going so far as to remove the squirrel icon borders on ludicrous. I seriously find the action excessive, and given that this is what the Constables are moving on instead of serious chat violations disturbs me to no end. I'm also concerned with the fact that this was done without the support of the rest of the TSPTF, and was done unilaterally without TSPTF or community concensus. The stupid squirrels should be returned to chat, but spamming of them severely punished. For Christ's sake, the administration shouldn't be going around removing bits of code from the wiki because its members are personally annoyed by their functions. It should be focused on combatting serious issues, such as Ratc puppets and vadalism. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 07:38, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

Hey look, I made a post on this topic. &#34;SO SAYETH THE EAGLE&#34; - Fascist Eagle ಠ_ಠ (talk) 05:17, June 25, 2014 (UTC)

What is this "Squirrevolution" that the icon belongs to? "I have never heard of a "Squirrevolution" free smile icon site before.Whipsnade (talk) 00:00, June 29, 2014 (UTC)

79.7.145.50 probably Ratc
Messaged LG with "I'm not violating the rules do you understand that? Why I don't receive any messages from you ?stop blocking my pages. For example I edited the Caribbean countries on the 1983:Doomsday page of the World Country Profiles to include the RTFA and the United States Atlantic Remnant. Why there weren't on the list, eh? Put them on the list? Oh but you're not going to do it. Anyway now I'm going to do it and remember I AM NOT INSERTING FALSE INFORMATION AND I'M NOT VIOLATING THE RULES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Not certain, but fits with Ratc's tendency to get crazily annoyed about things and post a ridiculous number of Exclamation Marks.

I assume the TSPTF is already aware, given the messages are on LG's talk page, but I thought it should go on the TSPTF page anyway. Local Mafia Boss (Talk) (Blog)

79.0.180.173 is not Ract 333 since it's from Padova, Veneto, Italy. He uses Telecom Italia.Whipsnade (talk) 00:30, July 2, 2014 (UTC)

I think over-use of exclamation points is not proof for someone being Ratc. Can we please stop the witchhunting? Fed (talk) 00:44, July 2, 2014 (UTC)

Guy has nothing to do with rat. As Fed noted, stop witchhunting. Lordganon (talk) 10:05, July 2, 2014 (UTC)

Potential Vandal (Very Minor)
As I was creeping around the wiki's recent activity, I've found that a wiki contributer, who's IP is: 129.96.82.240 editted the page Flood Basalt Eruption, to include his own contributions.

While this is relatively minor, adding several "g's" to the end of the word "throughout", I believed it should nonetheless be brought to the attention of the TSPTF in order for an eye to be kept on said IP incase either more vandalisms erupt, or to welcome a new user who simply made a mistake.

Either way, the ball is in your court, enjoy. &#34;SO SAYETH THE EAGLE&#34; - Fascist Eagle ಠ_ಠ (talk) 06:05, July 1, 2014 (UTC)

Dealt with. Though, in the future, this is the kind of thing you really don't need to report - someone will find it. Lordganon (talk) 10:04, July 2, 2014 (UTC)

BridgittLaura's Sockpuppeting
She returning. Another Josiah.cervo/AmericaLoove/BridgittLaura/CasoNuevos' sockpuppet:

LauraBridgitMendez.

FirstStooge (talk) 09:44, July 8, 2014 (UTC)

It Is Her, She Just Changed To LauraBridgitMendez. she has gone to far.Likercat (talk) 10:03, July 8, 2014 (UTC)

Don't think that they could be less obvious than that. Blocked. Lordganon (talk) 09:26, July 10, 2014 (UTC)

I Do Not Never Want to they understand. sockpuppet is a offense which violation, Please do not sockpuppet again ha. Or else. ArsenaliaFIRE (talk) 01:54, July 20, 2014 (UTC)

Daxus Inferno
I banned Dax for a week for openly attacking users, including me. I also added LG's grievances with Dax to the ban. Went on a nice little hissy fit. Seems to have a grudge against me after I doubted his claims to being on acid a few weeks ago. I think he's also fishing for reasons to get people on the TSPTF that he doesn't like impeached, so it'll be fun when he brings that list up. At any rate, I thought it would be wise to tell you guys why he was banned. LG, you are more than welcome to add to the ban as you see fit. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 19:39, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I was watching the entire thing Crim, you banned him because he stated that the mods were terrible. He indirectly called the moderators (not you, Fed, or Ms) "retarded monkeys", yet you claim the attack was directed at you. You use the term "octard" (i.e. "retard") all the time when referring to others, yet you now expect Dax to not do what you do yourself? You just banned me from chat because I called you and the PMIII moderators out for your ludicrious and implausible behavior. How can you expect any of the users to respect you if you don't respect the very rules you break all the time? The only time you tolerate any actions is when they are not directed against you or the other moderators. Your in a position of authority, and you hang it over every one of us, and threaten us with bans when your pride has been hurt. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 19:47, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Not true. Dax insulted Crim heavily; other users, such as Rex, even asked me to kick him because he was getting out of order. Fed (talk) 19:49, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

It seems like both Daxus and Crim were very insulting. For example when I came on chat I said "Hello" and before I even knew what was going on Crim made a comment about my apparent lack of intelligence. As a bystander I'm not sure why the admins were directing insults at me, but again I think everyone was just in an insulting mood. Tr0llis (talk) 19:51, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Which users were these Fed? Because I only saw Rex say anything at all. Eip, Sky, Scar, and myself said nothing at all. If this was PM, then I would like to know which users requested Dax's banning. Vivaporius:  "I don't need a slogan"  19:52, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Good lord people, this is an online chatroom not a highschool. Calm down and stop with the hostility, im trying to actively tone down my hostility but there seriously is a limit. I literally got on about 15-20 minutes ago and watched Viva do Ad Hominem attacks against admins and PMIII mods THE ENTIRE TIME. I realize this is about dax but seriously, Why are the Chadmins tolerating this. Its open and shut that if your being harassed your allowed to ban/kick or request one from an admin

Watching and paying attention are two totally different things, Viva. If you're unable or unwilling to see what exactly he did wrong, don't bring this nonsense to the TSPTF. On a very similar note, I banned you on chat for nonstop harassing the moderators in PMIII. I have been getting numerous complaints about you over the last few days and it's driving me up a wall. You should not be acting like this any you know it. To add to that, I don't care if you don't like us. I care that you don't openly attack people, mods or not.CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 19:58, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Feud, none of my arguements against the moderators were ad hominem. When I made a post, everything was relevent to the subject. The same applied to Dax. Everything he said was correct and to the point. Crim and Fed are terrible mods, and trying to protect them from the reality of that is foolish. And Crim, I honestly don't care what you think of me either, so the feeling is mututal. The only complaints you've gotten are from other mods. I have yet to see any of the players say anything about me because they all said the same thing. I was right. Watching you ignore reality drives me up a wall to because you in a position of authority, and you routinely abuse it. If I see something wrong, I don't care if your feelings get hurt. I'm bringing it to light, and if it doesn't get fixed, I'm going to keep talking about it. Dax did the same, and banning him for telling the truth about your actions is childish. You openly attacked Dax. You openly attacked Trollis. You openly attack Oct all the time. You openly attacked me. You openly attacked, Imp and his actions. And you openly attacked Ratc. He was annoying, but the fact that you say what you say about him is hypocritical. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:03, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Rex complained about you. So did Eip and Nk a few days ago. Are all of those mods? You are not right, you just refuse to accept you are wrong for some reason. Don't worry, you calling us terrible mods because we banned you is absolutely unrelated to any issue. Fed (talk) 20:04, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Fed, Rex has been complaining about me since the dawn of time. Nothing is new about that. Eip complaining to you is new, but until I see some proof, I'm discounting that. And Nk was in on a lot of mod-backed actions in PMIII, and frequently consorts with all of your schemes against other players. He practically is a mod. And me calling you terrible mods is indeed unrelated to my ban. I've been calling you terrible mods before that, and I will keeping calling you terrible mdos until you change and learn to be plausible and unbiased. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:08, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

You can discount whatever you want and call out against the Gods about our evil conspiracy to make you suffer. I would not go as far as to lie about someone complaining about someone else misbehaving. As for the rest of your argument, you're free to do that, but you could learn one or two things about plausibility and bias yourself. Fed (talk) 20:12, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Considering you blatantly lied to me in Chat about Australia i really do have legitimate right to discount EVERYTHING you say. You Entitlement and really hostile attitude is really not helpful ever and you cause issues nuff said. At least im semi personable in a good mood and can hold a decent conversation. The Gist of your attitude is "im Right now deal with it"

We're deviating from the point here. Why Viva is gwumpy is not why we're here. The subject is why Dax was banned. Viva, if you think you were wrongly banned from PM, please post it elsewhere. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 20:16, July 11, 2014 (UTC)


 * This isn't about my ban from PMIII and never was. I don't see why it is now. Flag of the Hurian Federation.png Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:26, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I don't understand anything in the first part of your post. As for the latter, unlike yourself, I look up what I can and cannot do, and then I give everyone my source to back my actions. You and the mods just disregard it since it means you have to accept the fact that I'm correct. I gave you a source on the size of Oyo's army, and you disregarded it. I gave you a source on the size of Oyo's cities and its population, and you disregarded it. I gave you a source on the Maori being able to build sailed vessels, and not only did you disregard it, but Callum, a mod who actually does his job, had to say I was right and prove you wrong. And I haven't been bias. I don't create events to punish players that are advancing and turning into a threat, or implausibly clog massive canals with weather that doesn't exist in the region, or start a rebellion in a country because the people just "felt" like rebelling or anything. So no, I'm not implausible or biased. You might learn something by watching me in fact.

And to Feud, I didn't lie about Australia. Sine, Ms, and and Andrew were all in chat when I mentioned it. I asked Sine, and he said he didn't see why not, though he cautioned me to wait. I asked Andrew, and all he said was "Mhmm...". And when I spoke to Ms, he said I should focus on Australia since he wanted Polynesia. So you can let go of it and accept that I didn't lie. You lie all the time. You lied about the rules, you lied about your expansion, and you lied about your sources. I will continue to criticize your actions because you are a liar. Period. You act as if you own everything and know everything because you do more than "Google s***", and you punish other players who dare confront you about your actions in PMIII. So you have no right to say anything.

Also, Crim makes a good point. This isn't about me, so don't make it about me. Dax's ban was unjust. Plain and simple. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:24, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

The fellow Daxus was banned for a reason mates. He regularly exhibits his neo-nazistic, anti-semitic, germanophillic and sometimes generally racist opinions and throws insults at others often. Calling Crimson here a retard, insulting others aswell. He does deserve a punishment. <font color="#00AAE4">Sky Green <font color="A00000">24 - Join the party  20:20, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Keep in mind that this all started because I didn't think he was on acid as he claimed to be... CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 20:21, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I was there for the whole of the conversation with Daxus. He not only was rude to Crim, he cursed an ungodly amount, something which also makes him deserving of his ban. I did ask Fed to kick him on a couple of occaisons because of the huge fight he was causing/instigating.

Some of the many insults Dax has said: Fed would go on to list all of the people who voted for Crim, and the people who Dax insulted. This list includes: The shear level of insults Dax continued to spit out, even after being told the sheer number of people who he was insulting, did not stop there.
 * To Crim - "you inbred"
 * To Crim - " Crim, which monkeys with extra chromosomes though that you should be in any position of power on this wiki wahtsoever?"
 * Continuing from the other comment - " Because those monkeys need to think on their sins"
 * Pita
 * MP
 * Kath
 * Kogasa
 * Imp
 * Yank
 * Fed
 * Lurker
 * Cour
 * First
 * Me (Rex)
 * Scraw
 * LMB
 * UT
 * Insulting all people listed - " and I can't independently verify the amount of chromosomes they have/but I am sure they have some extras"
 * Insulting Crim by impersonation - " ' I'm Crim, I'm an asshole, I can't possibly allow this kid to talk on the chat about fucking short-wave radio frequences' "
 * Insulting Crim and Fed - "Crim and a lackey or so/being malignant assholes"
 * After Crim was talking about volunteering to help some people with Autism, Dax retorted - "It rubbed off on you"
 * "Crim is just a chimp"
 * @Crim - "Noone cares about your unfortunate childhood"
 * Descending into NCNC - " Crim, I once went to a school dominated by Pentecostle fucking cutlists/ with almost no thinking abilities/absolutely indoctrinated/ There is a kid who went there that reminds me of you/ a real aggressive drone he was"

He was finally banned by Fed at 12:27 after a solid half-an-hour of hateful insult-spewing, which started at 11:57.



In addition to today, he has insulted me on many occaisons, mostly during discussions.

His hatred carries over to Ms, as well. As soon as Ms got on, he was "welcomed" by Dax, insulting his second greatest project (the first being NOTLAH).

I can go on, but I have two things I want to close with. That is all. Sorry about all this having to come up to you, but Fed and Crim wanted to make sure they were justified. Personally, I am all in favor of a 1-2 month ban as a minimum. He contributes practically nothing to the wiki.
 * 1) Sorry for all the cursing I have had to post. I hate it as much as anyone here, but I want to get his direct quotes.
 * 2) Knew_it.pngr is Ratc.

20:22, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

This is my contribution here. &#34;SO SAYETH THE EAGLE&#34; - Fascist Eagle ಠ_ಠ (talk) 20:24, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

After seeing all that, I modify my 1-2 month proposal and say a permaban/1 year/6 month ban is called for. Clearly this wiki is hated by Dax, and that hatred is both uncalled for and will only create more problems. 20:27, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

In the first picture, that isn't a direct insult. In fact, it can be assumed Dax is speaking of the school teachers, not Crim. In the second, Dax calls Crim "aggressive" not "retarded". The two are not related, nor is one magically more insulting than the other. I've been called aggressive multiple times. Am I now entitled to ban those who say that? Dax's antisemitism is an ad hominem, since it has nothing to do with the argument. As for the final one, Dax can say whatever he wants about a person when they are not present. If he can, then we better hire some thought police while we're at it. Also, Dax doesn't hate the wiki, nor has he ever stated anything of the sort. That is an unfounded accusation that has no backing by any known sources. Finally, Rex, you aren't a member of TSPTF, so I don't know why your suggesting any sort of prolonged ban, or a ban at all. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:31, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I'd ban him for a very long time, how dare he insult those with mental handicaps. I am autistic. Dax is an uncouth, rude, inconsiderate individual that has long expressed desires OPENLY on chat to and I quote " exterminate Israel" as well as constantly attacking those of Jewish desent and spewing truly venemous words, plenty that I would assume is not allowed by wikia period. Everyone has a right to speech true, but he has been belligerent and absolutely unacceptable attacking others, fed, ms, crim, me, sine, and numerous others have been a target of his hate. It isn't right.FOR THE GLORY OF THE PARTY! 20:40, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

What's right and what's allowed are two different things. People "exterminate North Korea" and "exterminate Iran" all the time, but I have yet to see one person step forward and say that it is wrong. What makes what Dax said about Israel any different? Fed expressed his hatred of ISIS, as did Feud and Crim. Shall we now call them Islamophobics for their well known hatreds? Dax can say whatever he wants because the rules here allow them. Dax has every right to say he doesn't like something. We can't punish him because he hates what some users like. Some users love Nazis. Shall we ban those who say they hate Nazis because they insult the views of the other users? Banning Dax for personal reasons will only lead to people being banned for small or trivial infractions. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:45, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Let me put this into text: So, let me understand you correctly. You wish to put forth the idea, that after insulting Crimson and Fedelede's intelligence, their ability to mod, and their game actions, that Daxus suddenly decided to bring into context, the teachers of some school, just to call Crimson an aggressive drone?
 * Dax: "Crim, I once went to a school dominated by Pentecostle Fucking Cutlists"  (I'm assuming Cultists)
 * Dax: "With almost no thinking abilities"
 * Dax: "There is a kid who went there that reminds me of you"
 * Dax: "A real aggressive drone he was"

See, the reason for me posting what Daxus says about people when they are not present, is to show his insultive behavior, that continues to exist outside of the realm of a current argument, to destroy any possiblity of anyone saying that it was a heat of the moment, or a one time thing. It further more points out that Daxus seems to favor insulting Crimson.

Also, let us understand what Drone is: Since that is the accepted definition of Drone, let's take your theory that Daxus was merely speaking of the "Pentecostle Fucking Cutlists", to then call Crimson an "Aggressive Drone". Since a Drone lives off the labor of others, what labor of others would this Drone have to live off of? It couldn't be Happy Unicorns and Rainbows, because they were not mentioned as a source of education for this student, nor could it Well-Taught and Engaging Teachers, because they were not mentioned as a source of education. Therefore, the only labor of others that said Drone could live off of, would be that of " Pentecostle Fucking Cutlists", thereby making him a product of " Pentecostle Fucking Cutlists", and meaning that with this Drone's inability to define it's own personality, it's own labor, it's own worth, it must "Parasiticly" attach itself to others. Doing that, it would mean that " Pentecostle Fucking Cutlists" is the only personality, labor, and worth that it can derive from its environment.
 * <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">a <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">person <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">who <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">lives <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">on <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">the <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">labor <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">of <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">others; <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">parasitic <span style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">  <span class="hwc" id="hotword" name="hotword" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana;font-size:small;line-height:normal;">loafer.

Basically, no matter what theory or context, Daxus insulted Crimson by directly/indirectly with knowledge of, calling him a  "Pentecostle Fucking Cutlists" &#34;SO SAYETH THE EAGLE&#34; - Fascist Eagle ಠ_ಠ (talk) 20:52, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Then I have said all I can, and I shall say no more. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:55, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I haven't read everything here, but I'd just like to point out that Viva is completely slandering me. I never once gave him permission to colonize Australia, especially not now, nor I am not trying to get Polynesia. Secondly I haven't even been on the wiki in weeks and I'm not entirely sure what he's talking about. I said several weeks ago that Viva could possibly reach Australia, but I was talking about hundreds of years from now, following the unification of New Zealand (truthfully I didn't think he'd ever get to that point). Mscoree (talk) 20:59, July 11, 2014 (UTC)


 * It's only slander if it isn't the truth. I would suggest you look up the definition of "slander", since I said nothing negative about you, only that you greenlighted my plan to colonize Australia. I stated my desire to colonize Australia, and I even asked you directly, is it safe for me to go and colonize the continent. You stated "I see no reason why you cannot". Then we spoke of Polynesia, but you stated that you wanted Australia to have it, despite the fact I said I was going for the Polynesian Triangle when I started to have second thoughts about Australia. But you said "No, go for Australia", and I said okay. You and I were discussing the topic early in the morning too, and we spoke on the subject of the plausibility of my actions by 1600.You, me, Andrew, MP, and Sky I believe, were all in chat at the time.


 * Andrew was absent, as was Sky. I got through talking to MP about it, the first mod I asked, and he said it was okay. I spoke in public chat about the action, and you said nothing condemning it, but encouraged me to go ahead and colonize Australia. You were the second mod I spoke to about the colonization. I later asked Sine, followed by Andrew, and that's when I told Feud that I had the backing of four mods for colonization, afterwhich he retorted he had four mods (himself included) who were against it. And on the subject of unification, how would that have taken hundreds of years? Groups of people with far, far less have done the same with more land in a fraction of the time. As for transportation, the Maori had been going long distances for centuries. How would Australia be any different? Flag of the Hurian Federation.png Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 21:45, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Ok i think both Crim and Dax have done wrong here, although not being there i dont have every fact to base off of

First Dax. Yes he has expressed his political beliefs. so have I. we've had our arguments. has he ever said anything offensive. yeah. Have I ever been offended by it? no. Dax says things. its who dax is. so it wouldnt surprise me if he said something to crim.

That being said. Crim has been known to overreact. especially those he deems "cronies". Athough again, i dont have all the knowlede of what happened here. Crim banning someonen too soon is nto unlikely either

One judgement i can make is that both of you need to start acting like adults. WHY seriously why???!!! 21:11, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I was there, and I feel that Crim was acting in a quite adult manner. He did not ban Dax on the first, second, or even fifth time. Quite simply, he gave Dax more than enough time to stop, but Dax refused. The solution is not to feed trolls, and Dax today acted like a troll with more than enough flamebait. 21:35, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Bait only works when someone takes the bait. Crim overreacted, and rather than get over it, and ignore Dax, Crim took the easy way out, and gave Dax what he wanted, a confrontation. Crim lacked self-control in this case, and because of it, Dax was banned from the wiki. Therefore, while neither party is in the right, Crim's overraction to Dax's insults, caused more trouble that it was worth. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 22:10, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Are you honest to god claiming that trolling is okay as long as someone doesn't take offence to it? Because wiki guidelines claim the way to treat a troll is "revert, block, ignore": A block is certainly in order in this point. Admit it Viva, Dax is an insulting person who is mostly just insulting people for the lolz. That form of trolling is punishable with a ban. I acutally think a week-long ban is way too little. Fed (talk) 23:07, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I never said that Dax wasn't insulting. But considering the way the administrators themselves behave on chat (as I already mentioned), I see no difference in behavior. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 23:45, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Here we go everyone the man himself:

I feel that this would be best deal with if I broke it up addressing points in a more organized fashion: About the Screenshots So in conclusion: Perhaps My Last Signature: Kurt Cobain's Haircut (talk) 23:11, July 11, 2014 (UTC)
 * Crim, you block me for openly attacking people, and here I call you a hypocrite. The event you refer to in which I was in chat and under influence I mentioned it as a side note (because people may want to know that about who they are conversing with). You, with the help of Feud, managed to succesfully bully me of the chat (not something easily done, I commend you) when I mentioned it though me whole intent from before entering the chat was to talk about these Cold War-era Shortwave Radio Stations and in the time was offering it as a subject to converse over. Instead of either taking me up on the subject or just simply ignoring me, instead I was harassed by a duo who was intent on not believing the side-note I had mentioned earlier instead of anything else. Like, shit, I wanted to talk about radio stations and Crim and Feud harassed and attacked me tenaciously enough that I actually left the chat for that very reason. This attack against me is the reason for the screenshot in which I call Feud a "religulous faget" and I say that you're name is a just a niggerdly one to me (by the way, niggerdly is not racist to say). I will admit that I may have been unreasonable aggressive to the chat to those who may not have deserved it. If you recall correctly, I even wrote a sort of apology to Fed, and though I never expressed it I do regret having needlessly attack Mscoree right out of the gate. Perhaps my criticisms were more like down-right offenses than they should have been. You, though, attacking you is completely justified. I also can't help but notice a screenshot of me calling you one of the Pentecostle Drones, but I don't see one of you comparing me to the group of retards that you knew in the Cub Scouts.
 * Sky, wtf are you talking about? I'm not anti-Semetic, I'm anti-Zionist, big difference. You say I'm Germaniphilic, well I'm part German so pardon that, but I'm also Persianiphilic, Azeriphilic, Burmaphilic, Amerindianphilic, Zoroastrianphilic etc. etc. I don't see what your point is. I don't know where you heard I was anti-Semetic, but I'm not, and I'm saddened to see you in opposition to me.
 * Andrew, when did I attack you? Also, I'm sorry if my use of the word "autism" or "autist" in that manner offends you. I was unaware of your mental handicapp, and perhaps if somone ever aksed me to not say that stuff I would stop. I have never recieved a complaint for abusing the word in a negative aspect, sorry for offending. You list the people I "target with my hate" as fed, ms, crim, me, sine," I only hate Crim, who I have legitamate qualms with and with Fed and Mscorree, both of which I consider myself to be at least on friendlier tersm with, and you I'm rather indiffirent upon. Any attacks then were in regard to moderator abilities in PM3.
 * Rex, you're just so... I called Crim a great many a thing, yes I did. He called me a great many of thing in return and some what he said, hehad less legitamate basis and fewer legitamate qualms than I had. My greivances with him is that he managed to become a bully-with-a-badge. Also, Crim never "volunteered" to work with the austists, last time I checked I said that about the retards he knew in Cub Scouts that he was comparing me to. Also, I was not refering to NotLAH when I was talking about his "shitty game" I was referring to PMIII for the reason that I find the moderators for that game to be far more disorganized than I would like. Honestly, I consider Ms to be one of the people around here I have a stronger preference for, others include Imp, Kogasa, Toby, you (formerly, until you said you're OK with Agent Orange and just some of the other shit you say), Viva, Sky (formerly, until I read that he thinks I'm a neo-Nazi), Sine, Fed, the list could go on. I'm getting a lot of flack for attacking people, which perhaps I did to too great of extent, but honestly I barely through insults at almost anyone in this chat aside from Ms. Also, I really can't believe you made that list of people I'm "insulting." Like, shit, because I said some unflattering things about the people who elcted Crim to be part of the TSPTF (which I think he has demonstrated he should not be), and I really can't believe you're trying to make it seem like I was insulting them each and individually. Most of the people on that list I have respect for, and was more their deicison than their selves.
 * Eiplec + Rex, holy crap, are you guys the NSA? Why are there so many damn screenshots? A man should be able to say what he likes in the chat like so many do without the fear of people taking screenshots of it. Honestly, really? Like, really? If I took a screenshot everytime said something ban-worthy this whole website would have more banned users than unbanned.
 * Yeah, I "attacked" Mscorree, my friend, for a breif period, sorry. I was referring to PM3
 * I brought up the Pentecostal Drones because he brought up the Retarded Cub Scouts.
 * Sky, wtf?
 * Those insults about Crim and Feud were about the time they bullied me off the chat, saying I couldn't be on acid because I could type (which is silly). They bullied me off the chat and I was pissed about it, sorry for talking shit about them when they left.
 * Yes, I did attack people. I'm sorry to those that don't deserve it, being Mscoree and Fed who I threw more at than I should have. For the rest my "attack" was pretty much fully concentrated on Crim who responded in a likewise manner, after he himself has attacked me in the past needlessly. If I am going to be banned for this incident of attack I must say that if the same standard is used on others Crim himself should also be banned.
 * I'm not anti-Semetic. The girl I like is part Jewish.
 * Sorry, for making fun of austists. No one ever seemed offended to an extent when I would make such jokes, and would have stopped had it been requested.
 * Rex totally exaggerated the amount of people I was attacking and the severity of the attack. Honestly, this was mostly between Crim and I with the unfortunate collateral-kinda-on-purpose-damage that hit Fed and Mscorree.
 * This is really not something that should be banned over. Honestly, LG, if you are reading this then you are probably wasting your time, but may still ban me anyway.
 * I'm disappointed. Several of the people who posted against me are people who I would have staunchly defended if under threat of ban. I expected a smaller lynch mob, I can't be suprised though.
 * Thanks, Viva.

Copy Posted for Dax by me: Stephanus rex (talk) 00:11, July 12, 2014 (UTC)

God, how did this become so long? Why was it an issue in a first place? Dax was dicking around and he got banned. Not something to argue about for 13 pages.

00:51, July 12, 2014 (UTC)

I agree Scraw. And your welcome Dax. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 01:16, July 12, 2014 (UTC)

Good lord. What on earth has happened. Looks like all reason seems to have been chucked out of the window. Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:38, July 14, 2014 (UTC)

Reason?

... THIS. IS. ALTHIST-WIKI!!

<kicks Impo off ledge>

23:51, July 14, 2014 (UTC)

Josiah.cervo Again?
I think Josiah.cervo has returned for the fourth time, now as JohnCanadiens. This user is using the exact same avatar and is editing articles by LauraBridgitMendez (a sockpuppet of BridgittLaura). -- 15:23, July 12, 2014 (UTC)

Then he should just be banned again, and his IP blocked permanently. I forsee Ratc Syndrome. He who cannot help but make countless sockpuppets to work on the wiki. Yeah, we'll call it that. Ratc Syndrome. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 16:48, July 12, 2014 (UTC)

Chat Problems
Recently on Chat SwankyJ Attacked Me Calling me "Ratc", I Asked Him To Stop But he didn't Stop and Called me "Nice Try Ratc" or Just "Ratc", While i Have No Snapshots (I Don't Know how to make snapshots) it was Still offensive to me since I Am A Swede not Puerto Rican, Can you tell him to Stop?.Likercat (talk) 10:29, July 15, 2014 (UTC)

This witchunt has gone on for months. If your that suspicious about a user get someone to do an IP check. Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

Im Not Suspicious

SwankJ Is

And Lastely, I Didn't Know Who Ratc Was Till May, 2 Months After i Joined, I Also Don't Like This "Witchhunt" as Many Innocent Users are Banned Because Someone Thinks they are Ratc.Likercat (talk) 10:47, July 15, 2014 (UTC)

I meant everyone in general being suspicious Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

You Guys can Make An IP Check on me, or Simply Tell SwankyJ To Stop Calling Me "Ratc", But Still, What i Said Above.Likercat (talk) 11:08, July 15, 2014 (UTC)

Well, this is such an issue. I can gurrantee you that this Ratc has probably moved on from this Wikia and I can 100% gurantee you that Likecat is not Ratc. He is a nice guy just trying to enjoy his time on this wikia and wishes not to bring any harm to it. :) The SkyWing Rights Activist 11:37, July 15, 2014 (UTC)

Chat
It appears chat has been invaded by about 7 new users. Many of them cant spell, spam, and have insulted some users. Im not saying all of them has, as some of the users have actually been helpful. what should we do about this? Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

Perhaps we simply guide them, be patient, let them "develop" into completely respectable users with good grammar, spelling, less spam, etc. We were all new once, no need to attempt to scare them off because they're new. I mean, if they get out of hand with outright personal insults, excessive spam, or vandalism, yes, action should be taken. &#34;SO SAYETH THE EAGLE&#34; - Fascist Eagle ಠ_ಠ (talk)

Vandal
Just a basic vandal. I already undid the edit in question, but here he is for his ban: Here is the edit he made -- http://althistory.wikia.com/index.php?title=Outbreak_%28Live_History%29&diff=1027324&oldid=715178
 * Special:Contributions/2.26.2.156

Thanks, 22:10, July 18, 2014 (UTC)

Taken care of

CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 22:20, July 18, 2014 (UTC)

ArsenaliaFIRE
The User ArsenaliaFIRE Is Josiah.Cervo, He Wrote this on his User Page "Hello We Are Arsenalia Football Guy I am ArsenaliaFIRE or Josiah Cervo to Introduce to Love and Beautiful to and I Want My Charecters From My Countryballs, We Love Characters." Josiah.cervo has Once again Returned, what shall we do?.Likercat (talk) 12:19, July 19, 2014 (UTC)

Guy sure is giving Ratc a run for his money... Stirlings may be tight if this continues, but at least he never is on chat to torment us. I think the best idea may be to thoroughly explain what it means to sockpuppet. I don't think he gets it. 15:49, July 19, 2014 (UTC)

Spoke to soon in light of the RiseofMan revealation. 06:47, July 20, 2014 (UTC)


 * He even wrote his real name to be Josiah Cervo, uploaded a file I previously told him not to, and worked on the same pages. Really getting on my last nerves. Permanently blocked him.


 * I would also consider blocking his articles for a while. Giving him less incentive to keep creating new accounts. -- 14:54, July 22, 2014 (UTC)

RiseofMan2344
This user is Ratc. The other day he clicked a Google doc link, which automatically emailed me asking for access rights. The email address was Ratc's, one I am all too familiar with. He has since confessed. Mscoree (talk) 21:54, July 19, 2014 (UTC)

Cyberbullying
Recently on Chat RexImpero Called Me "Retarded" Without a Reason, as i am suffering from Mental Diseaes (Autism)  so i have found this very offensive, and has been saying i am "ratc" and "lol ratc" when i am telling him to stop, even if i say stop, so please someone do something.Likercat (talk) 15:58, July 26, 2014 (UTC)

Not without a reason, you annoyed me so much that I was forced to call you retarded. Then you said you were suffering from Autism which I had no prior information of. When I said I apologize, you said you won't accept any apology so I called you retarded again. As for calling you Ratc, everyone knows you're not Ratc but knowing well that you would be annoyed when called Ratc; I decided to call you Ratc. RexImperio (talk) 16:20, July 26, 2014 (UTC)

For the love of God--Why is this on the TSPTF? You people should deal with this one your own, we don't need chadmins on 24/7 to tell you people when you are acting like childern? Rimp, you are at fault here, but Liker you could have X'ed out of chat   <font color="#191970"> I am on the edge...   The EdgeofNight   16:35, July 26, 2014 (UTC)

Edge is completely right here. Not everything is worthy of complaining to the TSPTF, and this least of all. Liker, please, if you feel offended by smoeone saying something bring it up to him. If he does not stop, then leave the chat.

As for Rimp, this is completely uncalled for.You don't call people "retards" because they're offended at you, and, frankly, you're in the wrong here. Don't ever let me catch you insulting people like that, especially given that you admitted that you purposefully trolled Liker, knowing he'd be annoyed when you called him Ratc.

And please, everyone, the fact that Ratc was an annoying nuisance on chat does NOT make it okay for you to use his name as an insult, start witchhunts towards every new user, and doing every piece of conduct you've been doing since he was banned. At this point, the ratc-bashing is more irritating than Ratc ever was. Fed (talk) 16:52, July 26, 2014 (UTC)

Rimp, FFS, you're newer than Liker. Shut up.

04:08, July 27, 2014 (UTC)


 * "Don't ever let me catch you insulting people like that..."

Whoa, is this Fed or LG?

Also, this isn't cyberbullying. It's just first-level twattery. Such basic twattery should be handled on the down low.

Okay, I Apologize, I Didn't Know Where To Bring This Up as there were no chadmins and i didn't know i should x'ed out of chat Immediatly, Just for me, Calling Someone "Retard" or "Ratc" is offensive, according to me.Likercat (talk) 14:26, July 27, 2014 (UTC)

Just cause LG ain't here does not mean the TSPTF ain't gonna be mean. We are all serious about stuff like this, and I concur with Fed. Seriously guys. Imp (Say Hi?!) 13:25, July 27, 2014 (UTC)

Personal Vandalism
Hello everyone. I would just like to let everyone know that, in light of my "reporting" Ms to LG, as per his request, I am currently undergoing a bunch of vandalism.

The vandalism is targetting my User Page (which I have left untouched for an Admin to Rollback). The primary culprit is: I have reason to believe that this person is Ed, as he came onto the IRC Chat at the same time this anon was vandalizing my page. I used an IP check on the IRC client, and the IPs match that of Ed (who I kicked from the IRC earlier) and the anon.
 * Special:Contributions/98.202.227.181

I ask that the page be protected after you ban this user (and the real person who was doing it) at least for the time being. 21:58, August 2, 2014 (UTC)

I did not make any edits on your talk page plus thats not my IP I'll sign out and put down a signature of my current IP. Toţi în unu; Nihil Sine Deo

This is my IP --> 68.37.133.176

You may have been using some client then. The IP of the person I kicked from chat who signed in as Edboy452, and the IP of the various times you logged back in under other aliases, were the same. 23:24, August 2, 2014 (UTC)

Wait what, I actually wasn't able to get back on. I was attempting to get back on with the same username after you've banned me, but that was not me. Toţi în unu; Nihil Sine Deo

No offence to either party here, but can't this be worked out somewhere else and brouht to the TSTPF later when you know for sure it is (or isn't Ed). In other words, why is chat compeltly broken for me? <font color="#191970"> I am on the edge...  The EdgeofNight   23:50, August 2, 2014 (UTC)


 * Chat is working again. I am just bringing it to the TSPTF's attention and requesting a rollback to my most recent edit. 11:19, August 3, 2014 (UTC)

Agreed, not to mention if anything happens on another website is non applicable here these guys dont have the jurisdiction. so using the IRC client as evidence here you might as well throw that out. I think ed signing off and posting his IP was well enough to prove he didnt do it. Considering when i did the reverse IP check with the first one you posted its in friken UTAH. Checking the other IP Ed gave us shows New Jersey. Changing your IP in state isnt that hard, go to a coffee shop or something, but getting an IP address out in Utah? what? Im pretty computer savvy and i have no idea how to pull that off

Feud, its called Tor, or any variety of IP masking programs. Really not to hard to do, just a simple download from what I've read.

Anyhow, the vandalism is most definitely targetted at me as it began right after I banned Ed and Fritz from the IRC. It also was during the period when I was being constantly harrassed about the Ms report thing, so that furthers my suspicion  to the ultimate amount. 11:19, August 3, 2014 (UTC)

I'd still like my page to be rolled back to the last time I personally editted it, as there are still some signs of vandalism on the page. 05:44, August 4, 2014 (UTC)

It's not possible to do a rollback when multiple people have edited it. Instead I did a manual one, since no TSPTF appeared to be available. Mscoree (talk) 19:16, August 6, 2014 (UTC)

Alright, thank you Ms. 03:04, August 7, 2014 (UTC)

Vandal
This User (173.67.1.89) recently vandalized India (Think Before You Act). 18:47, August 6, 2014 (UTC)

Additional Info: He was also blocked for 3 days on July 20, by Seiga, after vandalizing Funnier History (Map Game). 18:54, August 6, 2014 (UTC)

This user is vandalizing several pages and saying "EAT SHIT" in the description. Mscoree (talk) 17:50, August 13, 2014 (UTC)

Maanster810 is back as Mondstern810. Please hurry. Cour *talk* 18:52, August 13, 2014 (UTC)

He's also attempted to remove this notice from the talk page. Cour *talk* 19:21, August 13, 2014 (UTC)

He's Removing EVERYTHING, He's Vandalizing The TSPTF, Making Stupid Edits, Creating Mocking Page's even blanking out other Page's and Talk Page's, i think that reverting everything he does will not help,Likercat (talk) 19:52, August 13, 2014 (UTC)

The troll has been slain, brethren. -CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 21:10, August 13, 2014 (UTC)

Bless you sir. Bless you.

Just by the way, I'm pretty sure he has socks on other wikis.

Cour *talk* 22:34, August 13, 2014 (UTC)

FYI, some socks revealed:

http://camphalfblood.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/Moonstar810 http://camphalfblood.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/Maanster810 http://camphalfblood.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/Mondstern810

81.210.42.195 05:24, August 14, 2014 (UTC)

Blocked the other ones too.

Guys, if you see someone doing that, don't bother posting on their pages. Just encourages them.

Lordganon (talk) 09:21, August 14, 2014 (UTC)

Vandalism
This guy removed stuff from pages so I gave him a three day block.

23:01, August 19, 2014 (UTC)

Potential Vandalism
Anon 81.210.42.195

I found he already did some vandalism about a week ago.

FirstStooge (talk) 07:04, August 22, 2014 (UTC)

Blocked. Sad part is the guy thinks he is helping. Lordganon (talk) 22:42, August 22, 2014 (UTC)

Lingwistyka
The user Lingwistyka has vandalized the TSPTF talk page, First Stooge's user page, and many other althistory pages. Not only has he vandalized many pages, but he filled the edit summaries with insulting phrases (ie "really f*** off admin d*** eater" with no asterisks in his Republics of the Soviet Union (Alternative 2014) edit summary  I suspect he is the Anon 81.210.42.195 [[User:UglyTurtle|This is UglyTurtle, Signing off.] 10:54, August 23, 2014 (UTC)]

Judging from the fact he is also from the camp half blood wiki suspect he is that Maanster810 Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

Above is confirmed: http://camphalfblood.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/Lingwistyka 83.22.86.33 16:46, August 23, 2014 (UTC)

What is allowed and what is barred
If for example I want to improve articles here, what I must do to not being facing edit deletions. 83.22.87.166 16:33, August 23, 2014 (UTC)

As I said in my message on your talk page, anonymous edits are allowed, but I advise you make an account. In general you can find the rules here. If you have any other questions feel free to ask me. Mscoree (talk) 18:44, August 23, 2014 (UTC)

JaggerButtermilk
Some don't get the point. Extended the block on the user to a month and blocked the IP for the same length of time. Hopefully that should give him the message. Imp (Say Hi?!) 17:49, August 24, 2014 (UTC)

Possible Spam
The user Lsriharithegreat1492000 seems to be making articles with nonsensical titles, such as Dfzghbfxgxfgfx and Dsds. I was hesitant to put a deletion template on all of them, but I thought I'd bring it up here so everyone is aware. Thanks, Mscoree (talk) 14:22, August 25, 2014 (UTC)

This user also appears to be editing articles that he does not own. I undid his edits for now, but this may require a ban if he continues. I think the main problem is just that he doesn't understand the rules of the wiki. Mscoree (talk) 16:37, August 25, 2014 (UTC)

Just put the template on, Ms, just put it on, if you ever found an article with a nonsense title. He is suspicious enough to be a vandal for me. I already put the one on one of his articles ---> BHARAT.

...and I also found he uploaded new versions of the files that already uploaded by other users. You can check it on his user contributions.

FirstStooge (talk) 20:04, August 26, 2014 (UTC)

Les Gold 4
This user recently came on chat and starting talking about a "landmower" and "who,s the manager here", i dont belive blocking him, he is also saying that "i am a dog" and "ignore him dog", just can someone tell me what  does he mean  18:43, September 4, 2014 (UTC)

Dog is a common English slang term for "friend". He's also only being random, there has been a lot worse on chat during massive arguments. This is definately not worth going to the TSPTF for, especially sense he's not insulting anyone. Please use better judgement when reporting to the TSPTF. Thanks. This is UglyTurtle, Signing off. 18:46, September 4, 2014 (UTC)

There's no rule against being random or nonesensical on chat. As long as he isn't spamming or overly offensive, I see no reason to report him to the TSPTF. Mscoree (talk) 19:07, September 4, 2014 (UTC)

Lingwistyka again
Dear people off the TSPTF

Lingwistyka has once again returned under the name 70.53.65.220, i am 100% sure he is Lingwistyka, because he allways when his "vandalism train" begun he said stuff in summaries like "i want my edits back", so i am sure this user is lingwistyka, however firstly i think we should make a IP Check, if it will be where Lingwistyka was (krakow i think) then he is surely lingwistyka

Best regards  19:55, September 5, 2014 (UTC)

Editing the same articles, posting the same comments, undoing my undos of his things... Has to be him. Blocked.

The IPs he used before come from many locations. Means nothing.

Lordganon (talk) 01:54, September 7, 2014 (UTC)

Content-removing vandal
The IP  208.185.61.66 has been removing all content from pages, i reverted his edits, but i just wanted to bring it so somebody would block/warn him. User:Likercat (talk) 15:25, September 18, 2014 (UTC)

Spar's Sexual Harassment Intensifies
Not really sure what to make of this, but on chat Spar started cybering Ms. He claimed he wanted to blow him and then bite off his dick, to add to his collection, as well as eat/have sex with other members of the wiki. I managed to get picks of some of it:

NonEuclidean ツ (Talk)

Added a little snippet of my PMs from when I had last refreshed. Mscoree (talk) 23:33, September 20, 2014 (UTC)

I banned him for three days, because honestly... what the hell?!. If someone else in the TSPTF thinks he should be banned for longer, they have my full support. Fed (talk) 23:44, September 20, 2014 (UTC)
 * Seriously, this guy should be banned for a longer time. Not only was be being harassing people, but he was also being sexist. I, as well as mostly everyone here, knows that any form of discrimination to fellow contributors based on their sex, as we'll as other physical, psychological and biological features or political, religious, moral and ethical philosophies. This is, and should be a discrimination-free community and we make sure our contributors are comfortable. Ismael Perez  Ψ  (talk • contribs • blog) 00:56, September 21, 2014 (UTC)
 * That's just creepy.  03:21, September 21, 2014 (UTC)
 * While I'm not TSPTF, I think he should be banned for at least one weak. Spar has had horrid behavior before but I have no words for this.

Guns, this tops our homoerotic shtick by far.

On a serious note, while chat is known for getting jokingly homoerotic, there really is a difference between joshing around and actually cybering someone on main chat. Oh my god.

I guess I have to say this, but if someone asks you to stop, stop. Crim de la Crème 07:22, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

I wasn't there on that moment, but i am absolutly horrified what spar said to MS because i belive in a safe wiki where contributors should not be sexually harrased, seriously oh my god, i belive blocking spar a month from chat and from the wiki (or some weeks), this wiki does not tolerate this. User:Likercat (talk) 08:37, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

I can't believe I missed this... Life is so unfair. On a serious note, I am quite surprised that Spar behaved in such a way. He truly was well-known for cursing, but cybering people? I think he deserves more than 3 days. <font color="#50E0F0">Sky <font color="#50FF60">Green <font color="A00000">24 (Party,quotes) 08:42, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

i agree with every word of yours, sky, he should be banned longer. User:Likercat (talk) 08:57, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

Agreed. Changed it to a month. Ever see this again, we're talking a year plus. That is just disgusting. Lordganon (talk) 14:13, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

Thank you LG This is UglyTurtle, Signing off. 17:19, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

Also, Crim, the homoerotic schtick was consensual.

18:59, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

^ That statement alone topped said schtick. Just saying.

19:01, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

I think that the above consequences are to petty for his actions. I think he should be ban for a whole year or two. Ismael Perez  Ψ  (talk • contribs • blog) 22:49, September 22, 2014 (UTC)

Unbans from Chat
Hello, it's your old contributor. I have been away from the SpecualtiveWikis for its narcissistic admins, strict policies and exaggeration. I have changed. See, I've stopped from being the egoist I was, to the tolerant, amateur philosopher and psychologist. I promise that in chat I will be the most tolerant to people's diet as possible. But I'm still vegan, of course. Ismael Perez  Ψ  (talk • contribs • blog) 01:46, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

No thanks. Your userpage doesn't help your case.

03:47, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

I'm a firm believer in second chances as long as an effort to improve one's behavior is clear and evident. That said, you claim that narcissistic admins recently 'chased you out of a wiki'. It doesn't look to me like you've matured one bit. The ruling stands. If anybody else wants to remove the ban, I won't stand in their way, but my vote is no.

Crim de la Crème 18:40, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

I approve of second chances like my fellow compatriots here, but your comment up there about " narcissistic" admins, proves to me that you are still childish. We did not chase you off without cause, you were billigerent and generally unpleasant. Unban denied.FOR THE GLORY OF THE PARTY! 19:48, September 21, 2014 (UTC)

Ahem *belligerent*.

-- Guns, being generally unpleasant.

<span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:xx-large;line-height:normal;">bel·lig·er·ent bəˈlijərənt/adjective #1.hostile and aggressive."a bull-necked, belligerent old man hostile, aggressive, threatening, antagonistic, warlike, warmongering,hawkish, pugnacious, bellicose, truculent, confrontational, contentious,militant, combative;

By "narcissistic" as in only caring less about the community. I am, myself an admin on multiple wikis and I treat my fellow contributors with protection. An admin's duty is to protect the wiki. Ismael Perez  Ψ  (talk • contribs • blog) 22:53, September 22, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah but the people we protect from are trolls and vandals. However I am open to trying probationary unban for approximately one week to see how you can handle conversing with others. What do the other admins say?

01:33, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

I would be supportive of a grace period to see how Ismael has changed, pending other admin approval.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 01:36, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

I personally also like to see the other admins give Ismael another chance on this wiki, hope to see if he become a better person than before. If he do not, I believe the ban will be more severe and harsher... FirstStooge (talk) 12:13, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

... Holy Crap, I'm going to try to guilt trip you guys into making me Brass now.

GUYS I'VE CHANGED! I went on a quest, slew a dragon, and found a ring that gave me +10 to maturity!

23:09, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

I disagree with the grace period proposal. Not only is Ismael showing no proof to us that he has gone better (even indirectly calling us "narcissistic" in this very post), but also it sets a precedent. If Ismael gets a grace period, what would stop other people, like Owen or Catherine, from getting one either? I think as long as he doesn't prove that he has gotten MUCH better than what he was when he was banned, he shouldn't get any type of grace period. Fed (talk) 00:21, September 24, 2014 (UTC)

^ Seriously, guys, he actually told all of you that you were narcissitic tyrants in this very discussion. He didn't even use nicer words. He just straight up said you guys don't give a crap about the community.

I only know one admin who doesn't give a fig what the community thinks, and he's the best one we have.

01:32, September 24, 2014 (UTC)

I think one chance if LG agress, but i think one mention of Narcasstic or Veganism = Second Chance ruined, just my opinion. User:Likercat (talk) 10:33, September 24, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, the way he "asked" (not that he really did anything more than stating it) kind of kills any sympathy I could have had for him. That, combined with no evidence of improvement, and especially that his user page still says all of that trash, equals... no way. Lordganon (talk) 10:50, September 24, 2014 (UTC)

Agreed. User:Likercat (talk) 11:06, September 24, 2014 (UTC)

NonEuclidean
Yesterday NonEuc made two posters attacking Rex during the whole angry election simulation yesterday. I told Non to not make posters of people on the wiki without their permission, and deleted them. As of today, he reuploaded similar posters attacking Rex again, so I have deleted the posters and banned Euc for three days.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 17:27, September 28, 2014 (UTC)

Non also, during the previous elections, made propaganda that compared me to Stalin, which I did find insulting and distasteful, yet nobody else seemed to have reacted on it. Just adding that on top of the things Non is guilty of pile. <font color="#50E0F0">Sky <font color="#50FF60">Green <font color="A00000">24 (Party,quotes) 19:41, September 28, 2014 (UTC)

I had not known that he had done such a thing, and I am glad you brought it to our attention. Who is supportive of a longer ban for such a thing?

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 19:46, September 28, 2014 (UTC)

I am in support of a longer ban for such a thing. This is UglyTurtle, Signing off. 19:47, September 28, 2014 (UTC)

He made those posters without Rex's consent, or permission. This deserves a longer ban. I'm also wondering if the government simulation is breaking NCNC rule. This deserves a longer ban. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 20:00, September 28, 2014 (UTC)


 * The simulation doesn't break the NCNC rule, as it's fictional politics. —Bfoxius (talk)

Okay, this "election" thing has gotten out of hand. What started as a fun time-waster has degenerated into a pointless argument-inducer. —Bfoxius (talk)

I agree Bfo. This is UglyTurtle, Signing off. 21:14, September 28, 2014 (UTC)

I am in favor of a block. Also I think the government simulation should be shut down.

21:36, September 28, 2014 (UTC)

I am definitely in favour of a block, not only because of the election, but because he is massively rude to everyone in chat. He often flamebaits, trollbaits and treats everyone quite rudely.

As for the government, I'm apathetic towards it, but I don't think that arguments caused over it should warrant it being shut down. Otherwise map games (especially PM3) should've been banned long ago. Fed (talk) 22:35, September 28, 2014 (UTC)

To give my honest opinion, I couldn't give two shits about the posters (unless they were racist or massively offensive). Nobody here is a child. Ignoring mod ruling is a big no-no, which is why I support the ban, but regarding the posters, I think people just need to grow up :/

Then again, I've been told that I'm almost never offended over anything, so it's probably just me. PitaKang- My Life for Aiur! En Taro Tassadar 22:38, September 28, 2014 (UTC)

To be honest I have to agree with Pita. Having seen the posters I can say that they weren't really offensive at all. The final poster was just a screenshot of chat. According to MP screenshots without permission are bannable (which I don't really get considering there's screenshots on this very page), while according to other admins I've heard from there is no such rule. I personally don't see how a screenshot of chat is offensive, but maybe that's just me. As for disobeying an admin, I agree that can have consequences. Technically in this case he didn't reupload the same pictures, he uploaded a similar picture that wasn't really a "poster" anymore. But if you're going to ban him for anything let it be for that, not for being offensive.

The government simulation I believe should be up to the users. I mean if we forcefully shut down every institution on this wiki that made people argue, PM3 would have been shut down within a turn or two. The TSPTF itself could be shut down, I mean even that has caused arguments. Nothing in the rules says pages that make people argumentative will be deleted, and if they're not trollish or spam I don't see the problem. Ban people once they break the rules, don't just premptively ban an entire category of things on the wiki because of some people fighting.

@Sky You already compare yourself to Stalin, or at least indirectly associate with him, by calling yourself the Communist Party. That's like complaining that people associate you with Obama because you call yourself the Democrats; I would expect that. Also he didn't compare you personally to Stalin, or any of his ideals or values. All he did was take a historical political poster and write your name on it. I was under the impression that was all in good fun. Not to mention, and for me this changes everything, but before this event even occured you were asking Non if he was making more posters. If you were so deeply offended maybe you shouldn't have encouraged him to make more, right?

Anyway those are some of my thoughts on the matter. Tr0llis (talk) 20:08, September 29, 2014 (UTC)

Tr0ll, that's nothing short of offensive. Is someone who is Christian associating themselves with Hitler (who, yes, was Lutheran). Do clowns associate themselves with Gacy? Do doctors associate themselves with Crippen? Stalin WAS a Communist, yes. He was also, barely, a human. This does not make you guilty for his actions. That's not an excuse to compare Sky to a monster and a mass-murderer. That's not OK, and you need to apologize to him and all the Communists and Socialists on this site.

Also, yeah, kill the election simulator. It was a stupid kind of fun when it started, and now the fun is gone.

23:52, September 29, 2014 (UTC)

"Is someone who is Christian associating themselves with Hitler", Yes. About as much as Non compared Sky to Stalin. "monster and a mass-murderer.", notice where I said "he didn't compare you personally to Stalin, or any of his ideals or values". Stalin was a Communist, Sky was a Communist. That's where the comparison ends. I'm not going to apologize for not thinking a cartoonishly drawn Stalin-like historical image isn't advocating for mass murder. Lastly, Sky advocated for the creation of more political posters in the first place. If he was so heartbroken by seeing a crudely drawn OTL Communist symbol converted to a joke Communist symbol then why did he ask for more? Tr0llis (talk) 10:29, September 30, 2014 (UTC)

"You already compare yourself to Stalin, or at least indirectly associate with him, by calling yourself the Communist Party"

The BS I am calling on that would fill 20,000 swimming pools!

22:38, September 30, 2014 (UTC)

To associate just means to make a connection in one's mind. For example you associate with me, in the sense that we are both wiki users. There may be bad users and good users, but we're all connected by the fact that we're users. There might be good and bad members of a party, but they are all linked by that party, or in this case, its name. I don't think you understand what this means.

Regardless, it was a cartoon drawing of a guy with a mustache...

Are you that heartbroken, over come with emotions, that you require an apology? Tr0llis (talk) 22:47, September 30, 2014 (UTC)

No. That's one meaning of the word. However, in English, words often have slightly different- or sometimes VERY different meanings in different circumstances. In this case, to associate oneself carries the clear meaning of supporting said point of view. If that's not what you meant, I recommend a crash course in idiomatic English, but it IS what you meant, as you also used the word compare.

WRONG. The Communists do NOT support ANYTHING Stalin did, and I mean the real life parties, across the world. In most of those places, they disawow Mao too, including China. Hitler was a Catholic. By your logic, whenever we think of the Catholic Church, we should think of Hitler, and anyone who claims to be Catholic associates themselves with Hitler.

I have no issue with the cartoon drawing. What I take offense to is your comment that anyone who is a Communist or Socialist compares themselves with one of the worst mass-murdering monsters of history.

Sky does not COMPARE himself to Stalin. He does not ASSOCIATE himself with Stalin either. You're damn right I want an apology to Sky. This is the kind of behaviour the wiki expects from trolls and vandals. You make me sick.

00:18, October 1, 2014 (UTC)

"Hitler (who, yes, was Lutheran)" and "Hitler was a Catholic", make up your mind. Also what is going on at this point? It looks like Guns, a non TSPTF, is sentencing Tr0llis on behalf of the TSPTF for saying that if you call yourself a Communist people like think you are similar to Communists. Can you move your pissing contest somewhere else? This really isn't worth it. Harvenard2 (talk) 01:09, October 1, 2014 (UTC)

"This is the kind of behaviour the wiki expects from trolls and vandals. You make me sick." Nice try troll master Guns. Harvenard2 (talk) 01:11, October 1, 2014 (UTC)

You defend a Communist Party on the wiki and denounce Stalin, but using your logic, a fascist party (which is almost universally decried by the developed world) is okay, as Hitler was only one man and there are good and bad fascists. I doubt a fascist party in the govsim would pass anyways. Just a thought. —Bfoxius (talk)

Both of you can it. This is not the place. If you don't, you will have one very angry admin on this page. PitaKang- My Life for Aiur! En Taro Tassadar 02:43, October 1, 2014 (UTC)

Pita I didn't even know you were an admin. Congrats

20:59, October 1, 2014 (UTC)

@Bfox

The first fascist government on Earth was Julius Caesar's run as dictator before his death. In fact, facism gets it name from Caesar seizing the fasces, the symbol of power in Rome.

So, yeah, I have nothing against fascism apart from disagreeing with their ideas. I DO have something against the NAZIS, because the Nazis do support Hitler's actions or take said ideas further. The Communists actively disavow Stalin and Mao, so I have nothing against them.

Pita, that was a history lesson.

21:35, October 1, 2014 (UTC)

Ah, I see Guns. Forgive me for my ignorance. —Bfoxius (talk)

Fed, you ever see him doing that in chat again, block him.

Troll, that was offensive.

Guns, the first fascist group was Mussolini's bunch. Caesar using the symbol was that - a symbol. If that is your logic, then anyone who used the swastika before Hitler is a Nazi as well.

As for the overall thing, no more of these "posters."

Lordganon (talk) 09:39, October 2, 2014 (UTC)

Mussolini's bunch were the first to CALL themselves fascist. But there's a reason they did so- Mussolini openly drew his influences from Caesar's government. Much of his appeal lay in his promise to be the "next Caesar".

Hitler wasn't the first Nazi...

00:16, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Briggitlaura Strikes Again
Ok, so after I was looking through wikias wikis. I found a wikia founded by Briggitlaura, and yes, it althistory. Take a look if you want, because this should be reported to wikia. http://relatablealternatehistory.wikia.com/wiki/Special:WikiActivity Saturn (Talk/Blog) 22:58, October 1, 2014 (UTC)

It's not within our jurisdiction, as the TSPTF only has control over this wiki. —Bfoxius (talk)

Only way anything can be done about it is if they copy anything. That nut has not, and even went as far as to add a disclaimer about that sort of thing. Nothing to do about it. Lordganon (talk) 09:30, October 2, 2014 (UTC)

Advertising/Potential Stockpuppeting?
http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Mgilles52/Foam_Insulation

This morning, when I woke up, I saw a blog about spray foam, which has nothing to do about althistory or history in general. This also is consided advertising, and I've seen the exact same blog under a different wikia user, so this shall be deleted and I think blocked. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 10:57, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Deleted, and blocked. PitaKang- My Life for Aiur! En Taro Tassadar 22:15, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Kingtrevor

 * http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/User_talk:Eric4e?diff=1066678&oldid=1061935
 * http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/User_talk:Yan_Hoek?diff=1066660&oldid=1059845
 * http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/User_talk:Scarlet_Outlaw?diff=1066652&oldid=1065972
 * http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:Edoha_of_Aniyunwiya_(The_Kalmar_Union)
 * http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:List_of_Stream_eShop_Games_in_North_America_(Ohga_Shrugs)
 * http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/King_Trevor_the_first_of_wales_(the_old_boar_stuffered)
 * http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:1983:_Doomsday?diff=1067762&oldid=1066554
 * http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:Assassination_of_Barack_Obama?diff=1067853&oldid=797872
 * http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/User_talk:Saturn120?diff=1067871&oldid=1057297

As you can see, there are a few "minor" infractions that Kingtrevor hasn't paid attention to. He's spammed on users talk pages, he's been harassing users on chat, and he's even been banned on the MGW for a month. And IICR he was warned by pita and then spammed the message "nazi" on my talkpage. This offends me mostly because my best friends great uncle, died in the holocoust. Even worse, he blamed spartan for it. Though he my claim he's "kidding". He's done this a number of times, so I recommend we warrant him a ban. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 23:10, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, he's gone for a week. PitaKang- My Life for Aiur! En Taro Tassadar 23:13, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Lennythegreat
Looks like we have another troll, :-/ http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:158270

http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/The_Second_American_War_(Articles_of_America)?diff=1068933&oldid=209711

Block him ASAP, he's gotten a lot of pages. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 19:43, October 6, 2014 (UTC)

And he has also spammed chat as well. Upon the request of the VSTF as well as his already numerous crimes on this wiki, I have blocked him.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 19:57, October 6, 2014 (UTC)

Viperfrank45
I suspecting Viperfrank45 as Kingtrevor's sockpuppet as he used an image that previously uploaded by Trevor. FirstStooge (talk) 14:56, October 7, 2014 (UTC)

I agree. He said similar quotes and even quoted about a user "he's worse than king". Later he said "who's kingtrevor?" He even said the same quote "Beeer" as him. I suspect he is a stock. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 15:00, October 7, 2014 (UTC)



Indeed he is, he gave me proof. He needs to be fully banned, Sockpuppeting isn't tolerated period.FOR THE GLORY OF THE PARTY! 19:08, October 7, 2014 (UTC)

Ban performed.

Carry on people, nothing to see here.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 21:47, October 7, 2014 (UTC)

Jackgo23
This user Jackgo23 is Trevor and becomes third sockpuppet of Kingtrevor11. He is created for 1 day ago and its mission is to play Diplomacy: The Future Map Game on Future Wiki, but he fails trough a comment. Then joined the wiki Map Games Wiki and plays both recent games: Shattered Stars and Stripes and Almost 2. But after Likercat posted on Edge's wall about Trevor's third sockpuppet, this user Jackgo23 got blocked by Edge and finally he joined Alternate History with its first edit Manifest Destroyed. What shall we do about Trevor's sockpuppet?

Permabanned. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 5)

Note this!
Latest news- I called up wikia and got a e-mail from Semanticdrifter on Oct 15:


 * Jackgo23
 * Viperfrank45
 * Kingtrevor11

They are the same IP, thus sock or joint use the same computer. I'm blocking him on my wikis to. Whipsnade (talk) 14:04, October 15, 2014 (UTC)

Request for user rights gag nomination
Although some members of the TSPTF noticed what Tr0llis did, I think it should be officially brought to the TSPTF's attention. <font color="#50E0F0">Sky <font color="#50FF60">Green <font color="A00000">24 (Party,quotes) 21:12, October 12, 2014 (UTC)

Just so we're clear this is a sincere nomination, that Rex approved of. Rex sanctioned that picture and asked me to upload it for him. In fact when I uploaded it he said it wasn't good enough. I actually do want to nominate him, but when I consulted with him he said this is the appropriate way for me to do so. Tr0llis (talk) 21:14, October 12, 2014 (UTC)

*sigh*

I've already said this twice, but if you ever upload anything like that again (with or without consent) you're gone for a week. Consider this your only warning. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 4)

Just to confirm, the person spewing hate speech in chat isn't punished, but the person taking picture of said hate speech as evidence is banned for one week? Harvenard2 (talk) 21:19, October 12, 2014 (UTC)

What Rex said is not even close to hate speech. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 4)

So "America should stone gays" isnt hate speech? Or maybe i suddenly became dyslexic. on the flip side, i would have liked to see evidence that rex actually told you to post that. (for next  time i advise posting these things here instead of  a fake nomination) Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

Saying that Islam is a religion of hate that kills innocent Americans and corrupts the correct way of life isn't hate speech? Tr0llis (talk) 21:24, October 12, 2014 (UTC)

@Toby It's not a fake nomination! I actually wanted to nominate Rex, and he told me that if I am this is the way that he preferred to do it. I was trying to honor his request and correctly nominate him in his eyes. Tr0llis (talk) 21:33, October 12, 2014 (UTC)

Regardless of whatever Rex said, Tr0ll's gag nomination was not sanctioned by Rex himself (I personally spoke to him on this matter) and was definately not in good humor and directed as a jab at him. —Bfoxius (talk)

So let's get this straight.

Tr0ll screenshots several things that Rex said that are either ridiculously old or ridiculously out of context, and posts them- NOT ON THE TSPTF TALKPAGE but on the NOMINATIONS page. Even IF everything else was justified- and its not- that alone proves that this was NOT some attempt to "report" Rex.

Then he LIES ABOUT WHY HE POSTED THEM, claiming that Rex told him to, when Rex says he said no such thing, and I cannot see any reason why he WOULD.

Then he claims it was some attempt to nominate Rex- DESPITE making it CLEAR that it was a joke, and one in terrible taste, too.

Finally, of course, Rex has had both a ban and a failed nom in the past six months and so is not eligible for nomination anyway, which Tr0ll should have known if he, y'know, ever looked at the rules.

And this fails to merit a ban... why?

22:34, October 12, 2014 (UTC)

I agree that Tr0llis definitely acted out of order in regards to that, and although what he wrote was as disgusting in context as out of it, I do agree that  it warrants a ban. Same with Harv's inflammatory behaviour both in chat and out of it.

As for Rex, that was definitely hate speech, to be honest. And he did say he should be nominated on chat, I distinctly remember that.

I believe both parties to the conflict should be banned for a week. Anyone have an objection? Fed (talk) 23:55, October 12, 2014 (UTC)

I disagree that Rex's statements are deserving of a ban. I haven't really seen much of Harv besides him being an annoying prick, so I'm not going to say anything about that.

If Tr0llis posted without Rex's consent, he's definitely off the Wiki for three days to a week. I shall contact the parties involved and let's see how this plays out. EDIT: Another matter is that if Rex told Tr0llis to, I don't think he should be banned. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 4)

Ok, so I am going to weigh in on this issue finally, primarily beccause it is potentially possible that I will be banned as a result of some stupid actions taken by Tr0llis. This really seems to be a continuation of the Nonicide (Sat's phrase, not mine), at least in the minds of Tr0llis. He admitted so just a few minutes ago on chat, but I don't take obsessive screenshots, so whatever.

Well, as for the NonEuc instance, they attempt to make it out that MP and I killed a person. This is, in my opinion, largely an attempt at a smear campaign. And why? I really cannot tell you. I mean, I am not a Constable of the TSPTF, or a PM3 Mod, or anything of any real significance. But somehow (mostly because I call out the unfair nature of the Mscovites), I have become the main target for Ms', Harv's, and Tr0llis' attacks.

May I remind everyone when similar attacks went on against LMB (during the NotLAH days) when he was the staunch anti-Mscovite. Well, it appears they make a habit of this, but that is a whole different discussion.

Back on track, however. Not, all those images you see above this wall of text come from various periods in time. They are taken wildly out of context. Furthermore, I believe that they are often quite editted, but as I don't screenshot my own word, I cannot prove that. Some of that dates to over 1 year ago. Wow. Almost 3/4 of it dates at least a month ago. The rest was all asked for by Tr0llis last night.

After chatting for quite some time, it appears that I will get off with a warning, to not be "inflammatory" in chat in the future, and therefore I ask that Ms and co. all not act to egg me on, as has been their modus operandi in recent days. Thanks, 02:30, October 13, 2014 (UTC)

About half of these images seem to be taken out of context. Anywho, Rex decided to be better in chat, so I'd say no ban. —Bfoxius (talk)

Well first of all, let's get one thing straight. Rex says nonsense like that all the time and no one really cares. I can't tell if he's serious or not; it's the internet, you can't translate emotion. That said, Rex, you're not exactly the friendliest bloke on the block.

On the other hand, this nomination stunt was in poor taste and a terrible attempt at mockery and public shaming. Really Tr0llis, if you're going to be an asshole, at least do it right.

There is no innocent party here. Let's stop pretending like there is.

03:09, October 13, 2014 (UTC)

Tr0llis is banned for 3 days. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 5)

The user right's page is a wiki page and should be taken seriously. Joke nominations are not welcome under any circumstances. There are PLENTY of other places to joke around, so this should be a pretty easy rule to follow. The ban and the length seem justified.

Now to talk about chat. I know that chat is a place where we can all relax, hang out, debate, talk about timelines, etc. I really don't like censoring chat, but behavior from both Tr0llis and Rex has gotten atrocious. Only reason Tr0llis' block isn't getting extended right now is because he didn't post a freaking swastika on chat. We'll be seeing Rex in three days. Sorry I didn't get to this sooner.

I have completely lost my patience with some of the behavior I've been seeing on chat. It's embarrassing and insulting to be honest. Tr0llis, Rex, assorted company, shape up or ship out. Crim de la Crème 04:40, October 13, 2014 (UTC)

I said I wouldn't do this, but I feel like I need to clear up some things. When I first read what was on this page it made me very annoyed, and I wasn't sure where to even begin. First, in regards to NonEuclidean, I wanted to keep this quiet, but constant messages about it have made it necessary that I finally answer the questions. Two weeks ago NonEuclidean took his own life. He was obviously disgruntled with things on the wiki and things in his real life, as there were a number of factors. I wish I could have been there, but in his mind no one listened to him, and now he's gone. Little did I know what had happened. Rex had harassed Non constantly for weeks leading up to the event, his logic being that Non "wasn't real" and therefore did not have feelings. As it turns out he did, and in the end he couldn't take it anymore. From what I understand there were multiple mediums of communication, and messages that arrived everyday.

Afterword Rex started saying that Non "deserved it", and that it was the "death of a character". Rex, this isn't some game, it's my life. My friend is dead, and will never come back, all because of some stupid stuff. Then I started to get the messages too. Rex private messaging me how I had done this, how it was all a sockpuppeting conspiracy. Many got these messages, and so far a few other users have told me about this. I tried to go to the TSPTF users, but I was afraid to post here, and embarassed really. I felt incredibly guilty, and like no one cared. Everyone pretended to understand, but then as soon as I left went back to shitstorming, went back to discussing the scokpuppet conspiracy. I told a few people, who eventually became the only reason I'd go on chat anymore. It became a place where I didn't feel welcome, another collection of messages poking fun.

Then I saw Rex going on another rant. From approximately 10 PM to 12 AM EST on 11/12 October, he discussed sockpuppetry, religion, government, and it seemed to go on and on. He said that gays should be stoned, and that such punishment should be legalized (albeit he said he personally wasn't in to stoning, other people should do it for him), and he even told a gay user of this. This user was obviously in a rough part of his life, and came on chat to hear more insulting comments. The rant went on however. I took a total of twenty seven screenshots. Twenty seven. That night alone I managed to take that many screenshots, so when Rex says 75% of the screenshots are old, that is completely false. Yes the surrounding conversation is cut, but no they are not edited. As anyone in the chat can attest, Rex actually said these things, supported these ideals.

At approximately 12:15 AM EST the rant had died down. Many had left chat or were AFK. It is at this point that Rex told Tr0llis he should nominate him. Tr0llis, who appeared to actually want to nominate him legitimately, started asking in chat if he should actually do this. Josh and Rex both replied he should (Rex even made a hashtag; #RexConstable2014 or something like that). Rex apparently was the one who didn't take this seriously, or maybe he was purposely trying to get Tr0llis banned. Whatever his intentions, Rex told him to make this nomination like this, he told him to try and make "all the negatives look positive, like a Hitler speech". Tr0llis made the screenshot, and then linked it in chat. Rex not only sanctioned the screenshot, but then said it wasn't enough. Rex wanted it to sound more dictator-ish, and even said some more rant type stuff as material. Whatever the case, checking once more first, Tr0llis made the nomination. Was Tr0llis extremely dumb for making the image and nomination? Yes. But as Josh, Harv, Eip, Fed, Sine, myself, and some others can attest, those of us who saw it or at least parts, Rex clearly told him to do this as a serious nomination.

To quote what Tr0llis said in his defense:

Okay maybe deep down inside I felt angry at Rex. That "Best of" was way out line, I know I know. I was dumb when I uploaded that file. Maybe if I had just uploaded the striaght up screenshot we wouldn't be here, but maybe deep down I wanted to make a point. I didn't even know Non really, but what happened was wrong. I knew it was wrong, and I knew that there was no justice. I thought that was cruel, what Rex did, and maybe there was a part of me that just wanted to do good by him. I couldn't stand what was essentially bullying, and I had to say something, stand up, draw a line somewhere. Maybe I'll be banned, but maybe someone somewhere will see it and finally say something; this wiki needs to change. For months we have subjected ourselves to countless arguments. We have lost friends and peers to stupid things. I just want to change it, and maybe the only way is to remove fuck asses like myself. So if that is true, I accept my ban, for the good of all this wiki. And that is the truth or so help me God.

He was banned. Rex was not.

And that's when I started to realize; no one gave a single fuck. There would never be justice, never been some sort of satisfaction for what happened. Non was dead, and no one cared at all. I couldn't even look at this page without feeling digusted, because it was all made into a mockery. I realized that it would never stop. The many messages, emails, PMs, etc would never stop until I confessed. It's what he wanted. So last night I was on the verge of "turning myself in". I couldn't take it anymore, and I thought if I get perma banned for making up that I sockpuppet, at least I won't have the urge to ever look at this place again, or do something worse. This has been a train wreck, and I just want to stop being treated like a criminal. For the longest time I thought if I died then the wiki would "win", as in they wouldn't have to deal with my shit anymore. Now I realize that you can win on the inefficiency of the system, what with this crony garbage. How much longer are we going to do this? Except I already know the answer;

As said on chat, "one down, three to go".

It's not about crimes or punishments, it's just about making me go. I mean I've come to accept that I ruined map games by introducing octards and general hooligans, PM3, perhaps the wiki, and perhaps the only way to make it stop would be to remove myself from the picture. That's why I wish Non and I had switched places. He could have been strong, tried to change something. Instead until I collapse I will have to bear the guilt of all this, for taking those screenshots, introducing Non to the wiki, etc, and all for what? So he could spend his whole life being ridiculed as a "crony"? Maybe it seems harmless, but to him it mattered. And he mattered a lot to me.

I just wanted to speak my mind here, don't expect an argument, I will not reply. I just finally worked up the courage to say this, and I'm not sure what will happen of it. Maybe I'll be banned, who knows, but hopefully the message gets across. Sorry to rant and make a long thing of it, I just wrote what was on my mind. Thanks, Mscoree (talk) 13:41, October 13, 2014 (UTC)

Why were you taking screenshots to being with? Once upon a long long time ago people went to chat and pulled crap out of their ass and said because no one took chat seriously. Chat was like an off-the-books place. Now people are taking pictures left and right to file complaints because "X said offensive statement Y to user Z" and "user A mocked user B with sarcastic misinterpreted comment C". The real problem here is that people care too much about what other people are saying.

17:33, October 13, 2014 (UTC)

Everyone, drop the damn issue. Both Rex and Tr0llis were acting like pricks, so now both are enjoying their TSPTF-approved nonrefundable free vacations. End of story. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Actually Rex wasn't blocked originally, and after a temporary block by CrimsonAssassin, is unblocked. Mscoree (talk) 18:53, October 13, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, no. Its #Rexmod2024, not #RexConstable2014. Furthermore, #Rexmod2024 dates back a couple of days to when I defeated Fed and Pita in a contest to see who should become the next Brass.

Thanks for letting me clarify. Other than that, I am done with this issue. Oh, and Ms said he wouldn't reply so he's lying now and as we found out last night, that was almost enough reason to ban Tr0llis.

19:08, October 13, 2014 (UTC)

I think we're at the point where a little bit of profanity is called for.

What the fuck is wrong with you people?

Tr0ll decides to make an offensive and stupid post on a serious wiki page. That deserved, at most, a 24 hour block, but then he lied about it to the TSPTF and started a firestorm, so 3 days probably was understandable.

Rex went on a rant on chat about how gays should be stoned. That merits a chatban, without any further explanation.

Now Tr0llis posting something stupid is all because Non killed himself- and Non killed himself because of Rex?

Now Rex thinks he's a Brass?

Stop acting like children. Rex, shut up. Your opinions are your opinions, and while some of them are fine, I think we can all tell you EXACTLY which ones we don't want to hear. Any comments you have about gays, Islam, or killing Obama, you should feel free to not make. I expected better of you. Even if those were out of context, you shouldn't have said shit like that, and there is no excuse for it.

Scraw, there's a difference between Crim and I doing our schtick and a hate rant.

Ms, ffs, please, stop involving yourself in this. I understand, Tr0ll is your friend. It's a fricking 3 day ban. He deserved it. Get over it. If Non died, that's tragic, and I'm sure everyone here- Rex included- feels for your loss. I fail to see ANY connection with this. "1 down, 3 to go"? IT'S A THREE DAY BAN. Calm yourself, dammit. Anyone who thinks that is an idiot. The only thing this could affect is his becoming a constable, and let's be honest- that's not happening.

As for Tr0ll's "defense"- *ahem* THREE. DAY. BAN. By the time you idiots are done arguing about it, he'll have been back for a week.

You want to know what ruined PM3, and the wiki? You want to know why I barely post anymore, why I've quit map games? You want to know why Imp is never on the wiki anymore? You're curious as to why Feddy and the other admins have gotten so irritable?

IT'S YOU GUYS AND YOUR GOD DAMN ARGUING!

EVERYWHERE there's a community, there's some sort of edit war between Ms and his groupies on one side, and the Ms-bashers on the other. I'm tired of it. The wiki is tired of it. You act like juveniles and then come running to the community EVERY TIME. If you can't get along, can you at least SHUT THE FUCK UP?

02:11, October 14, 2014 (UTC)

... I apologize if any of the sane members of this community was offended by the above passage, but it needs to be said.

02:13, October 14, 2014 (UTC)

Guns while I agree with you, I believe the reason why Ms posted here at all is because this was at the conclusion of a long conversation, in which there were a lot of things that needed to be cleared up. Things needed to be debunked so to speak.

"1 down, 3 to go" isn't about Tr0llis' ban. They are talking about Non, as in "One user dead, three more to go". That is understandably kind of in bad taste. Fritzmet (talk) 02:28, October 14, 2014 (UTC)

Plot twist; People keep arguing even after the quite obvious statements above.

Oh, no, wait, nevermind. That was expected.

02:30, October 14, 2014 (UTC)

Groan.Whipsnade (talk) 20:45, October 15, 2014 (UTC)

Next person to edit this section gets a 3-day ban. Stop talking about it, it's over. Don't make me increase my killscore. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

The number of people you've banned isn't something to brag about. Crim de la Crème 15:11, October 16, 2014 (UTC)

Tomkamushkin
This particular user seems to be creating the same page (of what appears to be most likely himself). Me and and NFSreloaded have been deleting the pages every time, but every night it seems to come back. I also see that he's been perma-blocked on other wikis, and I think that should be a factor we should use here as well. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 04:57, October 16, 2014 (UTC)


 * And I was the one who was deleting that page for you guys every time. I also saw his threat to you, Saturn, and apologize for that. I want ahead and deleted that page again and protected it so it will not be recreated again. I also blocked this user for only a week, but I would favor a perma-block if needed. Aside from "Angry Grandpa" (seriously, that guy has his own wiki?), can you give me any more sites he's been perma-blocked from? -- 15:05, October 16, 2014 (UTC)

I am not in favor of a permaban, since he hasn't done anything too bad on our wiki. Yet. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

IzzyLowkey
Minor troll/vandal. Vandalized as you can see by his contributions (Special:Contributions/IzzyLowkey), he has changed Isto's profile page as well as a turn I wrote a while back for Alternate Nations 3.

I reverted the edits, but wanted to bring it up here. 18:00, October 16, 2014 (UTC)

Just seems like a n00b who doesn't know the rules. Gave him a little heads up. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Hi
Hello, if you are aware i have created another account, it is because Likercat, my previous account, i didn't want it, and i wanted to restart all over, so could an admin please perma ban my previous account Likercat? and i have seen this happen to users like Toby2 and Scarlet Outlaw, so please perma ban my previous account Likercat, and i want the previous account perma banned since i am not going to use it, so it will be useless, thank you. ~IrishPatriot

If we block your old account your new one will probably be locked out because of IP conflict. Why didn't you just change the name of your old account?

18:14, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

Account blocked as per regulations.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 18:16, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

Scar, Toby, War, etc; all changed their names.

13:20, October 19, 2014 (UTC)

Wiki Redesign
I've been thinking about this for a long time, and I finally decided that we should redesign the wiki. The current scheme of green and white is quite old and it's high time for something new. I propose that we start the process of changing the look of the wiki, ie the colors, styles, and other things.

Now, this is just my opinion, so I think it's only fair if everyone has a say in what happens. So please write below if you think we should change the look of the wiki or keep it the same.

18:18, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

I'd support it. As long as the page color is still white then I am fine with anything. <font color="#191970"> I am on the edge...  The EdgeofNight ╚╩o.o╩╝ 

I am all for it. im tired of looking at green also lol Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

The only green on this wiki should be me... So yeah, I support this. <font color="#50E0F0">Sky <font color="#50FF60">Green <font color="A00000">24 (Party,quotes) 18:33, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

I don't mind the green, but I wouldn't be opposed to a change in color, as long as the color isn't painful for the eyes.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 18:34, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

No. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

I'm in agreement with all the others. I think a color scheme would be nice, but definitely not something that hurts the eyes. Cookiedamage (talk) 18:51, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

The colors would be decied by voting anyway, so there should be no worries about painful or loud colors.

18:57, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

No. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Might I inquire as to why you are so vehemently objected?

20:34, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

I absolutely concur with a redesign. On a side note, is it possible to have the website more ipad friendly? Attempting to do everything via source is tiresome. FOR THE GLORY OF THE PARTY! 20:40, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

No. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Would you care to elaborate instead of a curt "No"? FOR THE GLORY OF THE PARTY! 20:51, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

No. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

I vote we by and large exclude Pita from these proceedings from now on, since he does not appear to be bringing anything meaningful to the table with his monotone objections. If that changes, then we can welcome him back.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 21:20, October 18, 2014 (UTC)

This is purely an opinion-based question, thus no reasoning is necessary. And again, no. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

I agree we change the color scheme. Though, not the black backround - hurts my eyes.


 * Ooh... I'm staying out of this one! -- 02:37, October 19, 2014 (UTC)

Hells, NO. Green is the wiki color! Have some sense of patriotism! WE ARE ALTHIST!

Do you not remember our founding history, when the great and mighty Nik stood against George III  some people, and with his fellow Founding Fathers declared our independence from Il Bethisad and Concourse Wiki? Recall ye not the brutal years of the Brony Wars, when hundreds of thousands (read; a dozen at the most) fled from AH.com, and found refuge here? Have you no sense of pride in the regal reigns of Sikulu, of Louis, of Ben, of Mitro? How can you forget our ancestors and their brave struggle against the endless legions of trolls? Our crucial role in felling the Owenbeast, a hydra with 100 heads? LG may be inactive, aye- we may have a power vacuum, aye- BUT WE ARE ALTHIST WIKI.

AND WE WILL NEVER SURRENDER!!!!!!!

CAN I GET AN AMEN?

13:31, October 19, 2014 (UTC)


 * Amen. (Lol) Saturn (Talk/Blog) 12:37, October 21, 2014 (UTC)

I agree with Guns. After all, is it really necessary? I mean its green and its fine with everyone for so long (i think this is the first time this is brought up). Like Pita says its a matter of opinion, its just a colour and 1 colour isn't better than another in any measurable way. Its just opinion and someone will always want to have another.

I think this is a bit of a meaningless exercise, efforts should be used over something more useful such as timelines or community togetherness. I mean you don't just change the flag of your country because some people decide its time for a change. Imagine if the UK changed its flag to include Wales? It'd feel odd, seeing the addition of St.Davids cross or the Welsh Dragon or something else.

Green is the brand colour of this wiki. You gotta keep the brand colour there, I mean what would you be like if Coke and Pepsi changed their colours around? So you got blue Coke and Red Pepsi, how you feel about that? It wouldn't feel right to me.

Can someone explain to me why they'd like to change the colour? And like an actual answer rather than a vague answer like its "time for a change".

Surely something like changing the design to be more mobile/tablet friendly is a much better use of time and effort. Accessibility rather than a needless brand identity change. Alt Hist WIki is green and is historically. <font color="#000000">VonGlusenburg (talk to Von!) 13:46, October 19, 2014 (UTC)

I can't help but agree with Von. I personally really like the green, and see no reason fr a redesign. Mscoree (talk) 16:38, October 19, 2014 (UTC)

It is a 'known brand', why change it now.Whipsnade (talk) 17:34, October 19, 2014 (UTC)

The only time I ever even considered changing the design was April Fool's Day (to pink. I was afraid I wouldn't be able to revert it and we'd be stuck with a pink wiki). Seeing as how this is not April Fool's Day, the green shall stay. Crim de la Crème 19:00, October 19, 2014 (UTC)

Jokes aside, it's as Von said.

20:38, October 19, 2014 (UTC)

Yes, we should make this wiki more mobile-friendly, as I (try) to do some wikiing on my phone, and I'm completely indifferent to a redesign. —Bfoxius (talk)

I am much more in favour of simply making it more iPad and mobile friendly. I am away from my laptop 90% of the time these days. FOR THE GLORY OF THE PARTY! 21:18, October 19, 2014 (UTC)

The colors are our "brand."

That it is not "mobile-friendly" has little to do with the design. Wikis are not very good, overall, on such devices. About the only thing we could really do to help with those devices would be to adjust the background image, and that would screw with those on actual computers.

Would be willing to listen to other ideas on making it more friendly to mobiles, mind.

Lordganon (talk) 08:51, October 22, 2014 (UTC)

Sladather
This user seems to have vandalized the Principia Moderni III page.

as you can see here Alas I cannot ban his page, only if he messes with shit on chat.FOR THE GLORY OF THE PARTY! 16:56, October 22, 2014 (UTC)

This was probably accidental, especially considering that he is a regular contributor to the game. Mscoree (talk) 19:00, October 22, 2014 (UTC)

Spar
It seems like spar has once again, broken our wikis policies. he's made this blog, which Is obviously breaking our NCNC policy. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 00:34, October 31, 2014 (UTC)

I know my NCNC rule-following isn't exactly a standard to live up to, but I don't see Spar really getting too out of line here. He just seems to be saying, "The media is contorting the Pope's policy into what they want the populace to view Christians as."

It isn't attacking any political or religious group, I think its harmless. Of course, I am staying away from it as I am expressly prohibited from NCNC violations from now on, but that is my 2 cents. 00:45, October 31, 2014 (UTC)


 * Not that this is meant to offend you rex, but the infamous FS's blog post was just a thing saying "Happy Rhomadon". I'm just saying we should stop it before it starts, because we don't want another shitstorm like that. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 01:09, October 31, 2014 (UTC)


 * Except it was Eid al Fitr, I think. Furthermore, it is not fair to regulate people because some people (like my older self)  may decide to go off at the OP. We need to punish those who, like what I did, violate NCNC in a flame-bait manner, but we should not restirct conversations before they take place just because theym ay create issues.
 * This is kind of like prior restraint of the press, which is anti-Western Culture and anti-Enlightenment. Blackstone would disapprove of censoring posts like that one just because people MAY do something bad in it.
 * We need to promote responsibility of each poster, and not just ban all posts because they could create a problem. Any blog could create a problem, its up to us to control ourselves.
 * I am speaking from experience here, Sat. If we were to have removed FS' post about Eid just because some skinhead (me) may have had a chance of going off at him, then we would be violating his right to expression.
 * Let is be; punish those who use it as an excuse for trolling and flame-baiting. 01:18, October 31, 2014 (UTC)

FirstStooge's blog post wasn't NCNC, the responses to it were. If Spar is saying something similar to FirstStooge it is fine. If someone gets out of hand in response, report them, not the person who merely set up the conversation by saying something harmeless. Mscoree (talk) 01:24, October 31, 2014 (UTC)

+1 @Ms. 01:27, October 31, 2014 (UTC)

This blog is like 25% of the way to NCNC, and the comments take it to 50%. It's pretty borderline right now, because the comments are going into NC1 territory and the post itself is making an ambiguous political statement.

04:44, November 1, 2014 (UTC)

Ahh, for the love of-

NCNC, as stated both on the page and by innumerable former and current brass, is a GUIDELINE, something for USERS to follow. There is FIRMLY no rule on the wiki that prevents peaceful ploitical discussion. Something like what Rex did- since we're clearly bringing that up again- violates not NCNC but wiki laws on flaming and hate speech.

So Scraw is correct, though not in the sense he means. The post itself ain't exactly flamebait, but it's probably inviting some. The comments- especially those by KhanTonto- aren't not hate speech, but if that topic isn't dropped soon, it's on the way.

"The Man Who Would Be Constable If The Brass Were Active More Often" aka  14:05, November 1, 2014 (UTC)

Spar and Scar
There's not much to say, the pictures speak for themselves. Those two have been going at it for far longer, but I was too lazy to take screenshots of the previous insults, which was mostly death threats and the extensive use of the word f*ck, c*nt and retard, and just usual spam. <font color="#50E0F0">Sky <font color="#50FF60">Green <font color="A00000">24 (Party,quotes) 22:36, November 7, 2014 (UTC)

PS. Scar also seems to have vandalized Spar's user page (image 7)

I support a longer ban for both. Both are bleligerent and unlikable on chat.

Reverted Spar's userpage. Spar is taking a 2 week break from chat and one from the wiki, courtesy Crim and myself. Scar actually vandalized, so he's taking 3 months. Will probably extend Spar's chatban. Cheers. 22:59, November 7, 2014 (UTC)

This is disappointing, but I can't say that it is surprising. For vandalism and flaming, I've banned Scar for three months. The only thing that saved Spar from the same fate is that he didn't actually curse like Scar did, nor did he vandalize. His ban is two weeks, though I have an understanding that LG says that the next time will be for a year or more. I'm going to leave that up to LG. Kudos to SkyGreen for handling the situation so well and alerting me on Facebook during this whole ordeal.

Crim de la Crème 22:59, November 7, 2014 (UTC)

Jesus, this place is turning into Big Brother but with more Social Justice. Honestly, I wouldn't ban either of these two to any extent near 2 weeks, but perhaps I'm just too lenient, honestly though I think Sky should just be able to thicken his hide a bit more. It's a chat-room on the Internet, things will alwas get crazy and inappropriate Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk) 17:14, November 10, 2014 (UTC)

The thing is that these two have been quarreling not just this time, but nearly every time they both are on chat at the same time. And you have to admit that Scar vandalizing Spar's user page was out of the line. <font color="#50E0F0">Sky <font color="#50FF60">Green <font color="A00000">24 (Party,quotes) 21:12, November 10, 2014 (UTC)

In my opinion the users should have just been kicked and then banned from chat (it would be nice if bans were not for some trollish reason, and when used appropriately actually carried out). All they did at this point was act up on chat, so punish them on chat. Maybe if one of them is really unruly ban them for a day to calm down. Vandalizing a page, banned for a few days. Again that's my honest opinion, after all there are hardcore anonymous vandals who have destroyed dozens of pages only to get a week or two. Of course it isn't up to me, and by now it's over and done with, so let's just let this go. Tr0llis (talk) 21:23, November 10, 2014 (UTC)

Dax, this isn't anywhere close to social justice. I should hope you understand this, Dax. This isn't about people being sensitive. Spar went on a rant against Scar, only an episode in their series of fights. Scar reacted with personal attacks, flew off the handle, spewed obsenities and racial slurs at Scar, and vandalized his user page. They were both worthy of blockage from the wiki, not just from chat. Case closed. Crim de la Crème 02:31, November 11, 2014 (UTC)

I feel as though someone just called the teacher on someone else and the teacher over reacted Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk) 02:35, November 11, 2014 (UTC)

3 month ban seems excessive. I say we reduce it to one month or even three weeks. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

I think it would be more appropriate for spar to be banned for 3 months rather scar. Spar has been warned before about stuff like this, and he never takes it seriously. Scar also has been raging a lot lately, and well, that's just scar. I support a longer ban for spar. I'm tired of all this, let's just end this now. Saturn (Talk/Blog) 04:03, November 11, 2014 (UTC)

Spar is on the thinnest of ice. The next time he pulls something like this, I imagine he's taking a long vacation- if I'm on chat at the time, at least 2 weeks chatban, plus some wikiban time, most likely.

04:21, November 11, 2014 (UTC)

I seriously think a mistake has been made. Get Spar a three month ban, and get Scar's ban reduced to a month. In every picture I have seen from Sky, it seems to be Spartian doing more of the damage. The fact that Spartian has been warned about this shit just goes to prove a miscalculation has been made. Thus if there is support I will be reducing Scar's ban to one month and increasing Spar's ban to three months. The man goddamn deserves it.

Imp (Say Hi?!) 14:11, November 13, 2014 (UTC)

Spartian has been warned for this way too much, so he does deserve a longer ban than this. Tech (talk) 16:34, November 13, 2014 (UTC)

Maybe I got this wrong, but perhaps Spar got the shorter ban because the insults he posted were copy-paste from some page, so it was more spam than actual insulting, while Scar tripped for real and insulted him well... As he always insults someone when he gets angry. <font color="#50E0F0">Sky <font color="#50FF60">Green <font color="A00000">24 (Party,quotes) 15:13, November 15, 2014 (UTC)

Quite frankly, Scar's been annoying me on community central about letting him play the map games while he is blocked. Obviously a no, but it kinda lends little sympathy in his direction. Lordganon (talk) 12:08, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

User:Ohbobsaggat
This user entered chat and immediately claimed he was the brother of Trevor, a banned user. I have banned him from chat in the meanwhile, but if someone could confirm this through an IP check or such that would be appreciated.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 02:35, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

He edited Nuke's page, adding a section about "super aids." I have blocked him pending resolution of him not being Trevor.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 03:03, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Nlenahrdt/MachoMapper
A user by the name of MachoMapper (no edits at the moment) came into chat being edgy for the sake of being edgy. He later confessed to being a sockpuppet of the user Nlenhardt. He was banned from chat. —Bfoxius (talk)

Since there were no edits to MM, I believe that apart from the chatbans to both accounts, we don't need to actually punish the two.

03:39, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

I do not believe MachoMapper is the sockpuppet of Nlenhardt because, some users on chat yesterday conducted a invasion on another wiki's chat (called TheFutureofEurope Wiki) and Nlenhardt himself was there, so i believe MachoMapper on purpose came on chat here to say he is a sockpuppet of Nlenhardt, maybe a revenge for the users invading their chat?. IrishPatriot (talk) 12:16, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Not that it matters, since Nlen is no longer banned, and MM is permabanned. Since MM made no edits, MP and myself felt it would not qualify as sockpuppetting, and his ban was turned from infinite to 2 hours.

But since Nlen came on only right after MM was banned, I think we can reasonably say that they are one and the same. Furthermore, there is no user by that name on TFOE wiki.

The more serious issue here is said invasion. I believe the culprits deserve more thorough punishment than Bfox and myself were able to administer on chat.

13:54, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

How is the "invasion" a serious matter at all? Harvenard2 (talk) 14:07, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Are you serious? How is members of our wiki vandalizing another wiki and spamming on that chat a serious matter?

I mean it's not that TFOE wiki is a serious wiki, but that doesn't matter.

15:13, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Nlen sent me a message stating that he indeed had Macho as a sockpuppet. Regardless, it doesn't matter as his sock didn't edit and his chatbans wore off. —Bfoxius (talk)

Vandalization, Guns? Really??? The wiki wasn't touched a part from chat being spammed. Furthermore, if you're seriously fretting and driving yourself crazy over a chat spam raid, then you should probably take a break from the wiki. Cookiedamage (talk) 19:24, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

How is being silly on a completely different wiki's chat a serious problem? How is it your responsibility or jurisdiction in the slightest? Tr0llis (talk) 19:27, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Nlen and I play a lot of Paradox games together (EU4 and Victoria 2 mostly) so we know eachother quite well. Yesterday he confessed to me that Macho was a sockpuppet, and tried to get me to let him use me as a scapegoat of sorts. He had some sort of plan in mind of making up a story that it wasn't him and that he needed an alibi and that I would vouch for him. However, I refused. Just thought I would add this in here. Blocky858 (talk) 19:50, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Right, first of all, stockpuppeting is clearly against the rules. The sockpuppet is going to be permabanned, no exceptions. If what Blocky says is true, then Nlen might too deserve a ban for a period of time too.

And let me make it clear - users of this wiki are meant to have a certain class. Such actions such as "invading another wiki" is not an example of this. Going over to another wiki just to have a chat with their users is nothing bad, but causing problems to their chat just for the sake of fun, is. This is the first and only warning. Next time will result in bans. Imp (Say Hi?!) 20:51, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

"Class"???? Um. what.

Am I only one who doesn't care what other people think of this wiki? What the hell is with this huge preocupation with having a "serious" or "classy" wiki? Don't you all have more important things to think about in life, like school, college, family, etc? I mean, no one's IRL identity is really known on this wiki, so I'm kind of baffled to see anyone legitimately embarrassed by this whole ordeal.

Secondly, Guns has more than once insulted me on chat and is taking this entire situation out of hand. He referred to me and others as "culprits", and on chat insulted me similarly. So, basically, if I go and spam another chat I'm basically a gross criminal who needs to be punished. If any of you all actually think that, you are basically delusional.

In fact, this whole obsession with a classy, structured wiki with reverence to laws and a strict hierarchy is kinda delusional in and of itself. It's a damn website. Cookiedamage (talk) 21:09, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

If you don't want to follow standards, then get out. The purpose of this wiki is good timelines, not map games which seem to have come to dominate a lot of pages. We cannot do so if we are a shabby wiki. If it was up to some, then the standards of this wiki would undoubtedly fall - they have fallen anyway.

No, but we would ban you. What is the need for you to go and insult another wiki. Your actions could lead to a consequence which the whole wiki would have to pay for. I would stand behind Guns because he is correct.

For you, maybe. Imp (Say Hi?!) 21:18, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

"Insult" another wiki??? By having fun chat spamming (which I was there, and nobody on that chat seemed to really mind)? People on the TFOE wiki probably don't even remember the spamming last night.

"The purpose of this wiki is good timelines, not map games..." Wow good job on shitting on countless peoples' works and the work they put in to some map games. And you also seem to think wiki standards have already fallen, which kinda contradicts what you have been saying, but okay????

Oh and, you just mentioned on chat that you were dealing with "users being stupid". Who is that in regards to? Me? Hmmm. Blatantly insulting users isn't a very classy, standard thing to do, Imp.

And of course you started your argument with "if you don't like it then get out." ???????

And you ended it with "For you, maybe"? Was that a response to me saying that Althist is just a website. Well, um, sorry to break it to you, but: Althist. Is. A. Website. It's not real life, and if you consider it some big part of your actual life then you need to seriously re-evaluate that life and get your priorities straight.

Cookiedamage (talk) 21:39, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

@Tr0llis: Now that Guns is in the TSPTF he has to appear tough on trolling and spam, even though he is one of the most foolish users. If he doesn't at least appear to crack down on stuff then he loses all credibility. This is a show of force more than anything else. Harvenard2 (talk) 22:07, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

That kind of makes sense. Personally I've seen Guns spam a lot on chat too. He continues to be one of the more trollish users. In fact the other day he was fooling around, and when another user began to fool around he kicked him. In fact, one of the things Guns does a lot is kick/ban someone and then claim he "hit the wrong button". I could maybe believe that at first, but then when it happens every other day, and in some cases followed by a statement saying he did it on purpose, it gets very obvious what he is doing. I'm starting to doubt Guns; ability to be constable, with behavior like this. Going around trying to reclaim your reputation with a show of force doesn't help much. Tr0llis (talk) 22:16, November 16, 2014 (UTC)

Here is the thing, wikia doesnt have any "class". Its a casual website, not a High-End job. Yes you have a bit of a standard, which could be enforced on your respective wiki, but not wiki wide. Really cant ban someone for what they do on another wiki. That is a step away from you banning me for sending someone you dont know a nasty email. THAT BEING SAID there is a difference between acting casual and acting like a child. While i am dissapointed to see our members act like that, its nothing to warrant any punishment Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

Did you read what I said?

"Going over to another wiki just to have a chat with their users is nothing bad, but causing problems to their chat just for the sake of fun, is"

If you were not causing problems, then that is not bad, but if you were it is not. How hard is it to read that?

I meant to add * excessive. I appreciate the effort people put into map games - such as Ms' NotLAH, but for every such game, there are countless others which in the end have to be deleted or end up going defunct anyway. Of course, I could myself in the fall. When I joined there used to be a lot more work on timelines and a lot of users would focus on making their timelines better. Now, most just end up joining the most active map game.

In part, yes. Its chat - how many people are classy on chat. There have always been a different set of tolerances on chat and the wiki - it is known.

Perhaps that was a bit exaggerated, but calling users delusional? Says something, don't it?

I consider it a place where people create. For many of it, it may not be a major part in our lives (no, it is not in mine), but it does hold more meaning than a mere website.

Its Guns. You guys did vote him into the position...

I agree with Toby. Imp (Say Hi?!) 00:17, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

"Going over to another wiki just to have a chat with their users is nothing bad, but causing problems to their chat just for the sake of fun, is" Why/how is that bad? Harvenard2 (talk) 00:20, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

How is causing problems on another chat and trolling other people bad? Seriously, Harv? I expected more from you.

The fact that anyone finds this sort of thing acceptable is pretty alarming. This isn't about being classy. It's about not being a degenerate. Raiding other chats is unacceptable, guys. Plain and simple. Crim de la Crème 16:24, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

Let me rephrase. How is it bad here? Harvenard2 (talk) 16:31, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

It's bad everywhere. No one should do it. I'm not sure what you're asking.

20:11, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

Why is doing something bad there, punishable here. It's like committing a crime in one state and being tried by another. Harvenard2 (talk) 20:15, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

Yep and international law is to make sure that a certain class is maintained in all states. Stop being a degenerate pathetic troll. YOU are in the wrong, stop making out its a problem with the system when you are the one going around causing problems. Sort your act out. <font color="#000000">VonGlusenburg (talk to Von!) 00:23, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

For the record, I clicked the wrong button ONCE. These delusional idiots aren't exactly helping their own point, but I'll just put that out there to disillusion anyone here that the people who went to ANOTHER WIKI and SPAMMED on their chat would do ANYTHING but that here.

Oh, and I should point out that at the time of him writing all that, Harvey had taken a 2 hour chatban- courtesy myself- for HUGE spam, in which he posted hundreds of blank spaces and forced several users to reload chat due to the sheer volume he added.

So let's think about it this way- what's more likely, that I have been viciously misusing my powers, or that Harvey and Cookie, bitter about the bans they're facing for their actions, decided to start making things up in order to distract from themselves?

The mere fact that they don't understand what they did wrong appalls me.

Oh, and for the record- there is a difference between users like Crim and myself joking around, and users like Harvey brutally disrupting chat.

I wonder what VSTF would say if we linked, say, Brandon to this little discussion? Say, that is, beyond global permanent IP bans for all those involved?

01:20, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

@Von, you are assuming I did anything at all, but in reality I never spammed on that wiki. I just heard about it afterword.

@Guns, we were all joking around on chat, and at the end I spammed the chat with white space. I was only one of the people who did this though, I'd say the main person was Saturn. Also how could anyone be bitter about chat bans when they're kind of a joke? I mean you "accidentally" kick Feud and other users, ban ms who just happened to be there at the time, but don't ban Saturn, the person doing the other half of the spamming, besides myself. Harvenard2 (talk) 01:31, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Okay, so I still have to defend myself I guess?

Lemme start by quoting a few things that have been said so far by people going insane over wiki standards and etiquette (or whatever).

"The fact that anyone finds this sort of thing acceptable is pretty alarming." Yeah, I mean going on another wiki chat and spamming is really the worst crime there is :/

"Stop being a degenerate pathetic troll." Thanks, Von :P

"These delusional idiots aren't exactly helping their own point, " Fair enough, because I did use the word delusional, but fight fire with fire right guise :} ???

"Harvey and Cookie, bitter about the bans they're facing for their actions, decided to start making things up in order to distract from themselves?" '''Um what???? kk guns'''

"The mere fact that they don't understand what they did wrong appalls me." OH NO! I'm sorry Master Guns for appalling your delicate, refined, classy wiki standards!

Um, I'm sorry, but wasn't it you Guns who 'spammed the squirrel emoticon so excessively for a long period of time ''that the squirrel emoticon itself had to be banned from chat? '''Pretty sure that was you.

And of course, I call you guys delusional, and you guys call us degenerates, pathetic, liars, etc... Hmmmm very classy. '''I do apologize for using the term delusional. The correct term would be hypocrite. Cookiedamage (talk) 01:54, November 18, 2014 (UTC)'''

I'm going to add something which I think is kinda important:

So, like, where are all the complaints and such arriving from thefutureofeuropes wiki ?? Like, what I mean is, if this is such a huge HUGE problem, why is Guns the only one continuing to peddle conflict??? Click that link and go to that wiki. You will see NO mention of any raid or any anger, a.k.a. people clearly don't care. Cookiedamage (talk) 02:00, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Strangely the "war" left little no lasting impact. On an unrelated note I think I saw Guns trip someone in real life. That clearly warrants a chat ban on this wiki. We can't have degenerate pathetic trolls going unpunished. Harvenard2 (talk) 02:04, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

'''@ Harvey: Did not kick Feud. '''Furthermore, you were the FIRST person to spam whitespace. There's a difference between what we were doing before and what YOU did. That was not funny, and if I gave you 3 days chatban for that, NOBODY would blink an eye. As for the Ms thing, someone- I don't recall who- said that it was Ms spamming. I suspect now that they were referring to you, as a "sockpuppet", though I did not realize that the time. I didn't ban Saturn since MP told me not to, saying that we'd ban for any FURTHER violations. And you're right. There were- and probably won't be- any lasting impact. Now imagine what would happen if VSTF got wind of this? EVERYONE who did it- not just you two- would be given global bans. The whole wiki would get a review, and anything seen as encouraging trolls, like, say, CHAT, would almost certainly be shut off.

@Cookie:


 * No, I'd say sockpuppeting and posting pornography are a little higher.


 * 1) Thanks, Von. Couldn't have put it better.


 * 1) I prefer to fight fire with water. In this case, fighting spam with blocks.


 * Wow, congratulations- you managed to look EVEN MORE idiotic.


 * 1) If you want to be dealt with like a "barbarian", I'm sure one of the El Tees will gladly oblige you with a wikiban.


 * No, actually, it wasn't. The Squirrel was banned after Ratc spammed it. I was the one who argued that we SHOULDN'T ban it due to a single user. I NEVER spammed it on chat. I used it, occasionally, following the ban, which resulted in kicks and bans. Never once did I disrupt chat with spam.


 * 1) Wow! Cookie! It's like you WANT a ban!

Funny- shit, HILARIOUS thing is, that if you had shut up and apologized like the others, you would probably have suffered no punishment. By opening your mouth and proving yourself a fool, you've all but guarenteed yourself a ban.

02:12, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Sadly, Harv, your reservations and opinions on the matter only piss me off more than I already am about this matter. I know some users have already apologized to the wiki that was vandalized (thank you all). For those who haven't apologized to the other wiki, you have until friday or I will treat this as if you did this on our wiki (meaning a ban). I want links to the apologies on my talk page. Crim de la Crème 02:48, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Lol. If you actually expect me to apologize to anyone after the way I've been treated on this page and on chat (a.k.a like shit) then you are mighty mistaken. And I love how you're totally bending de facto wiki rules (like not getting involved with things outside of althist jurisdiction) just so you can throw out a few bans if laughable, Crim.

Crim, I remember, not very long ago, when you were the most hot-headed, meanest, person on chat, who frequently swore and fought (specifically with Ms) so please DO NOT come after me about raiding a wiki chat (which many people were apart of).

Also, the fact that you essentially forgave all the people who insulted me, and the fact that you accused ME of handling the situation poorly is insultive in and of itself. Cookiedamage (talk) 03:41, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

There are SO many things wrong with the above statement, I'm surprised I didn't get an aneurysm just from reading it.

You know what? I've restrained myself on chat and here, but screw it, if you feel like that, then clearly being nice to you isn't going to work.

Cry me a river, Cookie. If you want to behave like a three year old and whine about about the "mean TSPTF" hurting your feelings, go right ahead. I get called worse than that on a routine day on this wiki, mostly from a joking point of view, and if you can't take that, then that's just SAD.

You either apologize to the people of TFOE wiki, or you get banned on this one.

03:48, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Cookie, I expected better from you. This situation has been handled poorly by really almost everyone. This should have been cleared up by now. I'm not doing this to throw out bans. It's kind of disappointing that you'd even think that.

I'm sorry you think I was the meanest person on chat when Ms and several other users purposefully tested my patience. Yes, I could have handled it better. I almost retired completely over it. Don't think I'm without remorse in regards to that.

Crim de la Crème 03:51, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Oh, you expected better of me? Well, I'm sorry to disappoint Master Crim, but I don't exist to meet your weird expectations and honestly I'm so sorry if I brought up memories of you being just as trollish as eeeeverybody else (even though you act like you're some kind of paragon of virtue nowadays). Cookiedamage (talk) 03:55, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

According to witnesses on the other chat at the time, the following was said:

I was on that wiki's chat for a good two hours. That event was the greatest thing that ever happened to them. They're a bunch of twelve years olds and within minutes they had forgotten all about it and actually had a lot of fun. Many of the users even came to this wiki and joined. They said the only turn off were the admins frantically running around trying to "end the war"

And when the actual culprits apologized, half the people on that wiki were like "um okay" and the other half was like "why are you apologizing?"

Most importantly, if you look at that wiki's logs, the administrators of that wiki already appropriately dealt with the situation. At this point this wiki is trying people a second time for something that should have been open and shut. Harvenard2 (talk) 04:15, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

I am disappointed in you guys. First, my report on Nlen is hijacked to become a back-and-forth argument between Guns and company and Cookie's crew over an incident that was solved shortly after it began. Then, you proceed to make a mountain out of a molehill with Cookie and Harv especially going crazy to defend their argument at all costs. After one day, you managed to, in true AH wiki fashion, to make a wall of text on the TSPTF talk page over a little incident.

That being said, have some common decency guys. If you're going to spam another chat, at least apologize. Who in their right mind would think it's okay to barge somewhere else, on the Internet or not, and overrun it for no good reason? I'm starting to figure out why AH.com, the other Althistory site that SHALL NOT BE MENTIONED thinks of us as an underbelly of theirs filled with immature idiots who don't know poop from applesauce. I don't know about you, but I don't like to spend 2+ hours on a day on a website that already has a black eye. This isn't helping. Grow up and have some common courtesy. Imp has a point when he says the wiki standards have gone down and not only us nostalgic farts should take it to heart.

By the way, the guy who runs TFOE wiki agreed to tell me if any one of us was causing problems there, chat or no chat, with the assumption that I will do the same, so watch yo' backs there.

Sorry to go on a giant angry rant on the TSPTF talk partially condemning other giant angry rants on the TSPTF talk.

—Bfoxius (talk)

I believe Bfox is right. Let us just end this here, otherwise it will get to a point where the page will be overrun with rants. Imp (Say Hi?!) 10:09, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure, as per those quotes, that this thing ended a long time ago. For some reason the admins are still trying to get something out of this (an apology) even though those were already given, and at the same time not even deemed necessary. You guys say they are degenerates and a whole other string of insults (which is ironic, what happened to the classiness? If you want people to apologize for being insulting why do you insult them none stop?), but in reality the people did apologize. They just aren't obnoxious and/or using the situation to get political sway or what have you. The main culprits here apologized like a few minutes after the incident, because they aren't actually degenerates; they were doing something that was considered harmless, by both themselves and the actual "victims". So why don't we put this to rest, rather than force people at gunpoint to apologize to the government, or whatever the hell is going on. Tr0llis (talk) 11:31, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

"with Cookie and Harv especially going crazy to defend their argument at all costs" Seriously, Bfox???

I love being labelled as some immature weirdo when I'm the one being shat on with insult after insult and coerced into apologizing.

I'm asking this of Bfox specifically, but do you consider me defending myself against being called an infant, idiot, barbarian, degenerate, pathetic, etc, going crazy? Because it honestly seems like you are labelling me as the bad guy when literally I've been treated like absolute garbage.

Yeah I was a part of a group who spammed a wiki, while Guns, Imp, Von, Crim, and you, Bfox, are apart of the group that either call us degenerates and infants or condone such behaviour.

Cookiedamage (talk) 20:39, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

This chat is still going on. a few people messed around on some other chat. action should take place ON that other chat, not here. While they did act childish, guns, lets not forget all your shit on here, on our chat, etc(like the random kicking, spamming squirrels, and insulting users). when we elected you we were expecting you to be mature, im dissapointed at both parties here. Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

Okay lets cut this here. The is a bit ridiculous and to be fair we dont have a rule against this. Its more of a wikia common courtesy and their wiki has admins to handle people that vandalise and spam the same way we do. The fact of the matter is, that while it was childish and a tad over the top and shouldnt have been done, Some of the people against this are the absolute worst people to be speaking against this chat raid, when 90% of you are guilty of even more childish bullshit in our own chat (regardless of it being our own chat.)

Guns in particular with your stupid squirrel emoticon, it got removed because you were such a childish idiot with it as was everyone else in the stupid Squirrelvolution thing minus one or two people.

Also the fact of the matter is you guys still kick for no reason, and then when asked to kick or ban someone over painfully obvious crap with another user (such as the sarchastic tones and other bullshit that expressly makes insulting digs at various users) none of you can even be bothered to handle this. The fact that me as a non admin can get people to shut up and have some respect towards eachother rather than the actual admins or constables is absolutely ridiculous.

Lets not forget to mention that we have chadmins on chat that essentially dont use the powers when they should, and then go on kicking sprees cause they can. I realize some of you guys are bit younger and dont have the same maturity level as some of the older users, but when i cant even speak edgewise or when people break chat by either fucking around with chathacks or posting spam or white space and you guys cant even be bothered to give a rightfully deserved kick, it seriously pisses me and some other users off as well. I realize that im probably  not one of the the best ones to be telling people to reform behavior right now, but seriously chat is a shitshow on any given day over total Bull most of the time, The only times i really condone any sort of storm is when its heated talk over a timeline or a map game and even then when it gets out of hand the admins either dont knock how to kick or ban properly, or just plain are away from the computer leaving those who either want civil discourse, or another discussion to be put up as dust in the wind pretty much.

Now in order to properly handle this wiki raid thing, heres my proposal. If its organized here, on our chat, blogs, etc etc then we should reserve the right to ban for whatever is deemed appropriate. Its not something against a few users checking out a new wiki, but if it leads to spam or any problems that come back and mess with our wiki, then it needs to be a bannable offense since it seems nobody has any real semblance of maturity anymore. Especially since one of the only way to get through to anyone anymore is to be about as immature as they are.....

What Feud said.

I honestly don't see the big debate here. People spammed that chat, and those people were punished on the chat. Is that not adequate?

Also what about the TPSTF members who were in the "raid". They going to ban themselves? Tr0llis (talk) 22:52, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Jesus Haddockberry Christ...

1. I do not spam squirrels.

2. I have never spammed squirrels.

3. Squirrels were banned because of Rat, not because of me.

4. I just argued that the actions of a banned user should not harm the rest of the wiki.

5. In my arguments in the matter, I WAS kicked by Crim, Impo, Feddy, Punkin etc. That was NOT for spam. That was for POSTING squirrels in protest.

6. Despite every single one of those bans, kicks, and insults, I have never ONCE posted a complaint about a chatban on this page. This is because I realized that the bans and kicks were necessary for the proper function of this wiki, and that the insults weren't a big deal.

7. Cookie, there is literally no one on this wiki who gets insulted more than me. I have never taken any of them as personally as you take the word "degenerate", despite many of them being far worse than that.

8. I have furthermore never been so childish as to refuse an apology because I "still felt hurt".

No, Tr0llis, that is NOT enough. The point is not that they spammed chat, it's that they could have been punished so much more severely.

Harvey, the fact that a bunch of 12 year olds who have never heard of the word "cartographer" thought what you were doing was "fun" is not a comment that leads me or anyone else to believe you were acting maturely.

The point Crim, Von, myself, and the rest of the TSPTF are trying to emphasize here is that what you did could have been SO MUCH WORSE. If they had reported this to VSTF, and I AM NOT JOKING, NONE OF YOU would have been spared from a global permanent IP ban. I have seen it happen before. The TSPTF is here to protect the wiki. If you act like idiots, then the whole wiki suffers.

00:37, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

That is why I think you are degenerates and pathetic. You did something wrong and now act like its not a problem because there is no explicit legal guideline saying not to. If you can only act good under fear of punishment then please go reflect on your ability to reflect on your actions and your moral stance on life. This conversation was resolved a long time ago. Take your head out of your arse please. You are not the victim, you are the offender. <font color="#000000">VonGlusenburg (talk to Von!) 03:34, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

If spamming a wikichat is a problem, calling people pathetic degenerates is also a problem.

Also I found it funny: "You are degenerates and pathetic" then at the end "You are not the victim, you are the offender." .... Okay???????? Cookiedamage (talk) 03:56, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

If you do not want to hear what we say, I might as well send the VSTP a message. They would probably end this mess quite nicely, and finish the problems that seem to be arising from the argument. Both sides would suffer, but I can promise you this issue would be ended. And if they ban you for however long, do not come complaining once it is done.

Seriously, can you not see it is wrong. Especially after what has been brought to light. And everybody seems to have a thing against Guns in this. Sure he has been stupid, but I can bet you he has received the most kicks. In the grand scheme of things - that balances things out.

Although no bans will come from whatever happened on chat, one might come for disrespecting others users - yes there is a criteria for that. So I don't care what else you have left to say. It ends now. Imp (Say Hi?!) 11:41, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

"Seriously, can you not see it is wrong." No, we do see what is wrong. What we don't get is what you guys have to do with it.

"Although no bans will come from whatever happened on chat". Then please stop.

"one might come for disrespecting others users". Please tell that to Von and the people decided to call people insulting names over a vague spam incident on a different website.

"I might as well send the VSTP a message". From what I understand, Cookie beat you to it. Harvenard2 (talk) 13:12, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

All right, this is more than enough. The lot of you, cut it out. Next person to continue it gets a day.

I do not care what the reason is - spamming the chat of another wiki is not right. I ever hear of it happening again, blocks will be done. Chat bans never stick, so are worthless.

Same goes for spamming spaces in our chat. Needs to bloody stop.

Harv, Cookie? Don't act like that again.

Lordganon (talk) 13:08, November 20, 2014 (UTC)

Chat Incident
Where do I begin about tonight?

First, there was Guns, the "normal" argument of this thing. Then, Laptop, who comes on a bit later, is met by the mscovites (excluding their leader ms), telling him hes "gonna get a permaban". So then they freak out, and then start saying "death to the TSPTF" and crap like that, talking about making a new wiki. I was somehow invited to the multi PM-group, and got screenshots of hiw they were talking about "making a new wiki".

And I have the greatest idea ever, how about we just shut off chat for a month? Im tired of all this and all of these problems start on chat to begin with, so why dont we just shut it off and make people get a grip? Who knows, maybe it could come back as a christmas gift to the wiki eventually again... Saturn (Talk/Blog) 04:45, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I was too childish. How can I avoid permaban? I mean, I was away from the wiki for sometimes, then I saw CrimsonAssassin saying I (and others) needed to apologise. Where can I do so?

Anyway, it was Harvenard2 that talked about overthrowing. I merely talked about a new wiki. I did not even said the purpose of the new wiki, and at that point was thinking about names like "Terrible Cuisines" and "LZ wiki" (like wiki about me). So I am sorry if any of you were offende, but I did not intend to overthrow the current wiki administration. Regards, Laptop Zombie 04:54, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

Making a new wiki is no crime. If you want to establish a new wiki and leave, we have no problems. But try to find the two or three previous splitoffs and join them please? I am pretty sure some of them are defunct so you could easily take them over.

Talking about hacking into others' accounts is inappropriate. Please do not do again. And what can I say about Harvenard? He seems to have a knack for pissing off other people. If he does not stop, then a ban will most likely be coming his way.

And the misconception about LG running the wiki. How much have you seen LG on this page recently - that is right - not much. Currently the TSPTF are managing the wiki, and me and Crim and Fed and Scraw (and Pita, when he feels like it) are taking most of the decisions to ban people. So if you have a problem with how the wiki is run, remember who to blame. Don't unecessarily drag LG's name into a conversation where he does not belong.

Imp (Say Hi?!) 11:15, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

Laptop added Saturn to that PM, didn't think he'd screencap private messages. What is illegal about civialy talking in a PM? Is planning an unrelated wiki with your friends in PM really that disruptive? It was Laptop's idea to make a new wiki, and I basically reassured him not to.

As for the last four images, the first are directed at me. I was making a joke about sockpuppets by talking to myself. The next one was about how Feud punches people in the face to stop arguments (I called him a troll, which wasn't really serious, but was probably the only insulting part of the whole thing), and the last image was a quote. "Anyway, it was Harvenard2 that talked about overthrowing". False, that is literally the opposite of what I was trying to say. You can ask anyone who was on the chat, after the joking was aside, I was trying to tell people that we could rally together and get stuff done, not overthrow anything. In fact, Saturn was the one who was like "Why are you overthrowing the TSTPF, you will create chaos". I never said any such thing. Harvenard2 (talk) 11:31, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

What these screenshots fail to capture is the beginning of the night. When I was on chat many people, led by Saturn were chanting things like "DEATH TO THE TSPTF". When Harv joined this was pretty much midway through, he definitely did not start it. Harv basically tried to tell everyone to calm down and be rational, especially in PM, rather than spam chat with shouting (and of course you had your usual "we will rise" type speeches from just about everyone except maybe Cookie). The screenshots also fail to show when Saturn skewed the events of the night and said people were "overthrowing the TSPTF" (apparently by chanting; even though he was the main chanter), and then said that Cookie's argument was "another conspiracy to get ms on top" (or something like that). At the same time he proceeded to insult Harv a bunch, calling him a "fucken liar" when Laptop added Saturn to a PM and he misunderstood who had added him. Then Harv acted trollish at the end for sure, mostly at Feud, but again these screenshots only show a fraction of the night. Mscoree (talk) 11:38, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

Never a dull moment, is there?

If you guys have a problem with how the wiki's being run, there's the door (or close tab button as it were.)

Turning chat off is a terrible idea. The community has sadly become too dependent on it. The wiki would lose a lot of traffic. Turning troublemakers off would be a much better idea. Too bad I was studying for an exam rather than on chat, huh? Crim de la Crème 13:17, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

How is this even an issue? A couple of new users thinking they can do it better. It's like every time they don't get from this wiki what they expect they rant.

And the hateful attitude towards LG isn't very impressing either.

As for Harv, I'm familiar with his personality. I doubt he started this whole thing. Although I do believe he joined in on it later, however I doubt that he actually tried to calm anyone down. I'm not talking any facts, but I do know Harv, and he's more of the type to join in on something and turn it against a specific user. As for Ms protecting him, I get it, they're friends.

Finally, I think it'd be best if we just dropped this because it's just another issue that would have gone by unnoticed has Sat not taken screenshots of it. <font color="#1C4081">Sky <font color="#00FF21">Green <font color="531F72">24 (<font color="A00000">P, Q ) 14:11, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

I don't really mean to protect anyone, I'm just saying what I saw in the chat. The reason I know that Harv didn't start this is they had a whole argument about who started it, in which Saturn kept cursing and insulting Harv, and Laptop was like "actually it was me." I agree, this isn't really an issue. At best the only offense committed here was Harv's trolling. Just kick/ban from chat for like two hours. Mscoree (talk) 15:10, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

Then could this page not be cluttered with complains about chat please? Imp (Say Hi?!) 15:49, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

My apologies for all that happened, be it done by me or not. It was all my fault for everything. Apologies. Regards, Laptop Zombie 16:08, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

Laptop you have nothing to apologize for. None of this should have even gone to the TSPTF. The only thing that was wrong here was Harv's trollish attitude, but that deserves a kick at best, not a report to the TSPTF. Mscoree (talk) 19:58, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

"Death to the TSPTF" is an injoke between Saturn, myself, Edge, and a few others, the joke being that I used to be a fervent anarchist and now I've become "The Man" (both of which are jokes, and both of which are untrue- my political ideology as per this wiki has not changed, merely the amount of crap I'm willing to take from Harvey).

Whichever idiot informed LZ that he was getting a permaban deserves a good talking to. Or a chatban. Yeah, I think a chatban.

It's literally not possible to overthrow the TSPTF. The people you would have to go to are VSTF, who will either laugh you off, or, after the invasion incident, ban you all and chastise us for being too nice.

22:49, November 19, 2014 (UTC)

Harvey, you're on the thinnest of ice, BTW. Next time you do something kickworthy, you're getting a 2 hour ban. We've all had enough of your shenanigans.

22:55, November 19, 2014 (UTC).

...Am around, just really behind on the edit list, and lurking more than usual. Busy.

Guns, he says thing like that again, have someone block him for a few days. Same goes with Saturn.

Lordganon (talk) 12:57, November 20, 2014 (UTC)

In my opinion i should be the one to blame, i linked the wiki in the first place, then the invasion occured whkch probably leaded to this argument. IrishPatriot (talk) 14:16, November 20, 2014 (UTC)

Liker you're mixing up two different events here. Wrong section. Mscoree (talk) 15:07, November 20, 2014 (UTC)