Talk:1983: Doomsday/Former Proposals 3

South Asia
How about some new stuff in the Indian Subcontinent. There have been negligible plots involving the Indian Subcontinent. How about a treaty of arms and economic aid between the Union Interim Parliament and the ANZC and the fall of the breakáway nations like Telangana & Gondwana? User_talk:MC_Prank13:58, 15 August 2009 (UTC)MC Prank

good idea we could do with more stuff --Owen1983 16:28, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, no one is doing anything about India, so please ratify my article in the main page. MC Prank 16:52, September 5, 2009 (UTC)
 * 1, where is the article that you're referring to? A link would be most appreciated.
 * 2, I think there's a fair bit of information that we're still sorting out here, as listed under the movies section, before we can consider ratification. Louisiannan 15:16, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
 * I believe he is reffering to his additions to the under 2009.  Mitro 15:28, September 8, 2009 (UTC)
 * I made some changes to the fighting in India. I made India slightly less successful and also worked in the growing dispute between the SAC and the ANZC.  Unless someone objects I think it could work. Mitro 01:50, September 10, 2009 (UTC)

Yeah it could work well. MC Prank 07:29, September 12, 2009 (UTC)
 * Graduated. Mitro 16:16, September 12, 2009 (UTC)

Virginian Empire (1983: Doomsday)
the virginian empire consists of the Formor US states of Georgia Virginia both Alabama this article is a proposal
 * Wait -- So Virginia, Georgia and Alabama? Do you maybe mean the Carolinas?  And I hate to say this, but after living in the South, I don't know how well/functional they'd be at surviving the years since DD. Louisiannan 20:03, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * According to the article the nation covers West Virginia/Kentucky. I'm not sure what Owen is talking about.  Mitro 20:08, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Owen, are you taking crazy pills again? Louisiannan 22:00, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

I will have to check but if the state capitals were nuked and with the US in anerchy i thing what leadership ther is would have formed ta rudementiry government --Owen1983 12:21, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Does any one bother to check the Nuked Places map anymore? the states of West Virginia and Kentucky are completely unscathed by nuclear impact. Maybe evn a bit of northern Tennessee. --Yankovic270 00:10, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

Who said the map was perfect? Mr.Xeight 00:46, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

I just don't believe that the Soviet Union would waste a perfectly good A-Bomb on every single state capital when there were much much more tantalizing targets. And I didn't say the map was perfect, I basically said it is close enough. When it was adjusted it was only changed to include bases on Cyprus that I didn't know existed on the hit list. It still left the Kentucky/West Virginia area clear. And is this you tying to find anyway to erase my country from the map even before it is included? I'm not trying to imply anything. And Owen? Can you please use something on your computer called SPELLCHECK. --Yankovic270 01:54, 31 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Virginia even today contains a large part of the military installations; Naval, Air, Land, and Coast. Even if the capital were not hit, the resulting chaos would prevent the government from being able to maintain control. Lahbas 00:00, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

does anyone both to read the description anymore? It's WEST Virginia not regular Virginia.Totally devoid of A-bomb Inpact. Sorry 'bout the spellcheck crack.--Yankovic270 04:51, 17 August 2009 (UTC)


 * My mistake, anyway, while there are not major military installations there, the Svoiet Union might try to take out the coal-mining regions within the state, which produced most of the power used throughout that region. Even today we largely depend upon West Virginia for our energy needs, or at least the industry in the Midwest and lower Northeast. At the same time, you have to remember that the Soviet Union had just under 40,000 nuclear weapons at their disposal in 1983. They won't mind hitting some what could be considered minor strategic targets if it could keep the enemy down. If a nuclear strike were made on the coal mines, I can only begin to imagine the enviromental disaster that would result. Lahbas 05:26, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

MIGHT. The key word is MIGHT. It is not a sure target like Washington, New York or London which were certainly much much much higher up on the list than a resource that might have noone alive to use it. If it even made it on The List to begin with. The Nuke map may not be perfect, but it shows that nothing, and I mean NOTHING was targeted within the area of my nation. And can anyone take a look at it. I tried to make it more realistic for its local situation. And my half-assed Neues Deutschland, before it was made obsolete, was stripped of its "Proposal" tag and I am actually starting to work on this one. Keep sending tips on how to improve it and I will try to make these changes reality. I just want the Republic as it is now called (I can't change top title for the life of me) to get into the timeline now that my New Germany went down the tubes. I need more up-to-date advice for it. --Yankovic270 04:51, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

I'm sorry that I was such an *#@hole, but I'd like Virginia to be upgraded to canon. I'd even settle for being an acknowleged proposal. If you still have problems with it then please WRITE ON THE TALKPAGE! There hasen't been a single suggestion for a while. C'mon, I'm the creator of the article. For me its perfect as it is, so I can't see what needs to be done to change that. And please can someone change the article name to the Virginian Republic. I do not know how to do that at all.

Please, just stop. The group cannot agree on approving your article, we're sorry. Perhaps another TL might take the idea, or maybe you could start one based around Virginia. Mr.Xeight 02:09, 29 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I don't see any problems with the article, I don't see why everyone is so opposed to it. It's no larger than most of the other survivor nations in the US. (By the way, Yankovic- to change it to "Republic" click on the move button on the top of the page) --DarthEinstein 18:10, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

I don't see how I can alienate the group anymore but NO. I will NOT stop. This is my brainchild and I will NOT LET IT DIE. If there are any more problems to it then let me know on either the Nation's talkpage or my own. And whats with you Xeight? Did I start a vendetta that I didn't know about? And thanks for sticking up for me Darth Einstein. You seem to be my only fiend in this timeline. This is so frustrating and reading Xeight's conceited and snooty message is like rubbing salt in the wound. Way to kick a guy while he's down. And do you realy speak for everyone or just yourself? And what happened to giving the person in question feedback on the article? --72.45.100.138 00:45, September 2, 2009 (UTC)
 * The problem is Yankovic is that your language and actions have alienated the group to the point where no one is that much interested in reviewing your article. When someone has tried to provide constructive criticism you have reverted to insulting language or simply said (and I am paraphrasing) "well you do it then."  Mr. X, who might have been able to word his response more diplomatically, nevertheless speaks for a lot members who are tired with how you are acting.  Your recent comment ("I will NOT stop. This is my brainchild and I will NOT LET IT DIE.") also tells use you are still not willing to collaborate but instead simply demanding that we do what you say.  Your attempts to garner sympathy also do not do you credit considering how you acted when people tried to help you before.
 * I say this not to antagonize you any further, but to explain that you should change your attitude if you want to get your work added to canon. Be willing to have an intelligent and reserved conversation with people and lay off the caps lock.  With that being said I have reviewed your article and here are some of my comments:


 * 1) Drop the feudal terms, gives the wrong impression. This isn't a world of knights, vassals, kings and peasants.  Thought it may appear from its face similar, we still have centuries of democracy to contend with.  It is rather difficult to change a culture overnight so quickly.
 * 2) General Meyer being able to conquer all the other warlords' territories because they were distracted at a meeting is implausible. Most leaders wouldn't even attend in person but send representatives.  Also there is probably a significant number from the region (it is relatively large) who won't show up at all.  What is the purpose of the meeting anyway?  To discuss the situation?  If all of these survivor states are "barbaric" and dictatorial I don't think they would be all that interested in friendly relations with each other.
 * 3) Why is Meyer's forces the only regular military forces in the area still active? What about other units with bases in the area?  What about National Guard units?  Hell even the heavily armed members of the UMWA could even be a threat.  Meyers established his empire too easily.
 * 4) If Virginia is a dictatorship, why so many competing political parties? Why not just one that supports Meyer?  And why would two political parties that have been dead for over 100 years suddenly be recreated?
 * 5) Reword "OTL Burma/Myanmar." We try to make most of these articles from the POV of someone from the ATL writing them. No one from the world of 1983: Doomsday is going to use "OTL" when comparing one nation to another.
 * 6) Strict limit on the # of trials? Seems odd considering that any justice in Virginia is a joke at best.  More plausible just to have speedy trials where accused have no representation and are immediately sentenced to lashes, hard labor or death.
 * 7) Why would having Fort Knox matter? Virginia is an isolated, rural, post-apocalyptic wasteland.  What are they spending their money on?  They obviously aren't trading with the outside world since the article is silent on when contact happened and, most importantly, they don't have a coast.  Money won't matter for a while, instead food, clothing, medicine and other items would be used in a barter system.
 * 8) CRUSA has just recently (this year, 2009) established a base in the MSP. That is the extent of their presence on the continent.  It takes money and time to set up a chapter or even just to send some explorers.  Furthermore it took them over a decade just to set up a base on the American Pacific coast, how did they get to Atlantic so quickly after having so much trouble on the other side of the hemisphere?
 * That is pretty much my comments on the article. If you are willing to make an honest effort to peacefully collaborate I might be able to work more closely on the article.  However unless these stated concerns I cannot vote to approve this article for canon.  Mitro 01:48, September 2, 2009 (UTC)

Thank you. I have long since dropped the attitude. I am just grateful for a chance to save my one brainchild. I'll try to make it more reasonable for the timeline. I'll implement the changes that you suggested Mitro. And I cannot apologize enough for what a spoiled brat I've acted like. I am well and truly sorry. I hope we can resume or rather start diplomatic communication. Rest assured i am no longer the lazy brat I once was. --Yankovic270 19:33, September 3, 2009 (UTC)

And I am altering the article to say that it took a while to fully subjegate the area, and in this extremely rough region the people have to adapt to the situation or die. Alas! there are no more such idealists left alive in the area. And to keep these hardened citizens loyal the government is a little harsh by necessity. And I will keep the Federalist party alive as they were in favor of stronger gov't and it draws comparisons between Washington and Meyer. They both were military commanders and both are the first leaders of their respective nations. --Yankovic270 20:01, September 3, 2009 (UTC)

And I am going to have the Virginians send out a scouting mission and establish contact with Superior in around '87-'90. i am going to add a link to Superior in my Article, and hope he/she does otherwise.--Yankovic270 20:36, September 3, 2009 (UTC)

Sorry. I can't figure out how to make a functional link. --Yankovic270 20:49, September 3, 2009 (UTC)
 * I have made some changes to the article. Does anyone have any comments on it?  Mitro 21:30, September 7, 2009 (UTC)

I added a bit to the Military section, and the "-era" means that they wouldn't be out of place in that era, not that they are vintage from the era. Its because more modern vehicles are more expensive than these relics, and most military spending is focused on the army anyway. ps: can anyone give this nation a flag? --Yankovic270 18:19, September 10, 2009 (UTC)
 * I understand what you mean but even if they are "primitive" they would still be products of 20th century thinking. Why build a bi-plane when you can build a jet?  Even if jet is too expensive a mono-wing plane is still more superior then a bi-plane and can easily be built.  Also the old 1980s weapons won't disappear with Doomsday.  1980s-era National Guard planes would still work and parts could be cannibalized when spares begin to run out.  The monitor could be the most advanced river going ship that 1980s could produce, with machine guns added on.  Its one thing not to fund a military branch well, but to go that far in the past just to save a few bucks for the ground pounders is unlikely.  Mitro 20:45, September 10, 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, build the technology if you have the knowledge to do it, but unless they had a bunch of aircraft engineers and skilled laborers who knew how to build them, the mono and biplanes are probably much more accessible. Louisiannan 20:52, September 10, 2009 (UTC)
 * True, but there I think mono-wing propeller planes are easy enough to build that if Virginia is lacking the experts that they don't have to go WWI when the jets break down. Honestly the air force might just be a few cargo planes and some helicopters, since its unlikely you are going to need an air-superiority fighter in post-apoc America.  That being said, what do you think of the article Louis?  Mitro 20:56, September 10, 2009 (UTC)
 * It's something that I think I could actually get behind now. It looks good enough that I would even consider suggesting a move from proposal to canon-as far as what's currently been written. Louisiannan 15:27, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * Excellent, unless there is any objections I will graduate this to canon. Mitro 15:40, September 11, 2009 (UTC)

I am going to describe the "ground pounder's" main weapon. The good ol' star of Mobster films, the M1921 Thompson submachine gun aka the "Tommy Gun". It is cheap to make, very reliable, extremely deadly in the right hands, and has been made famous (or infamous) by films like The Godfather There is no weapon more heavily imprinted into the American psyche, except maybe the .45 Colt Revolver (Do you feel lucky Punk?) If there is any weapon I love more than the AK47 it is the Thompson. And what self-repecting dictator wouldn't want a weapon with his name? I was also heavily influenced by the unholy carnage the weapon caused on the Mafia vs Yakuza episode of Deadliest Warrior. It isn't that farfetched as the US armed forces only abandoned the Tommy in 1971, and Doomsday was in '83. It wouldn't be a stretch to have a military using them. All you need is either a set of blueprints or a working model to make them. --Yankovic270 22:56, September 10, 2009 (UTC)

I made some changes to International Relations. I took a page from the British strategy book from both World Wars and created the VEF, the Virginian Expeditionary Force. So how do you like it Mitro? And while we are on the subject, should Virginia: A) recognize Sanguenay and Send the VEF B) not recognize Sanguenay and disband the VEF --Yankovic270 18:21, September 11, 2009 (UTC)

And, not that I am ungrateful for my brainchild being graduated to Canon, I am just curious when Virginia is to be included on the map of the Doomsday world.--Yankovic270 18:26, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * We generally wait until there are a significant number of new nations to add before updating the world map, so relax Virginia isn’t the only new nation not represented and its not canon yet. I also left my message to your question about Virginia on your talk page.  Mitro 19:07, September 11, 2009 (UTC)

I will remove all refrences to the VEF from the article. Also how long do you think it would take to make it canon? Besides Aroostock got onto the map while it was still a proposal.--Yankovic270 19:45, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * If no one objects by tomorrow I will graduate it. As for the map, we established the policy of waiting until something is canon after all of the issues with Southern Africa.  This of course happened after Aroostook was on the map and Virginia at the time was far from being canon-material at that point.  Mitro 19:56, September 11, 2009 (UTC)

I'm thinking about having the Virginians establish a puppet state in nearby territory. We'll see. Which city/town would be a good location?--Yankovic270 22:50, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * Graduated. Mitro 16:16, September 12, 2009 (UTC)

Since there is so little on Africa, I went ahead and filled in the Somaliland article. What do you think? Mitro 17:19, September 10, 2009 (UTC)
 * I like it. It's good to have someone doing something in Africa, something I've been intending to do for a while, but never got around to. --DarthEinstein 18:17, September 10, 2009 (UTC)
 * Graduated. Mitro 16:16, September 12, 2009 (UTC)