User talk:Orangebird763

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Re: Independent Sydney
How you do want this to affect the rest of Australia for this timeline. Matt121 ??? Matt125 (Talk) 20:39, January 22, 2016 (UTC)

Duplication
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The following uploads have have been removed from this site, and have been replaced with the following correct files:


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Please try not to let this happen again. Do not re-upload this file or remove this message from your talk page. Be advised that while this message is simply a warning, continuing to upload duplications will result in the temporary suspension of your account. Thank you for your cooperation. -- 05:42, February 13, 2016 (UTC)

Southern Independence
Hey,

Please may I be the head mod (and provisional owner) please. I promise to be the best of my ability and not to be baised.

I have got lots of experience of playing map games as I've created Battle of Britain, Ancharist America and I've been a mod in Atomic World, A Brand New World and many more (I can't think of many other map games, if u want u can look through my edits on MG and this wiki).

Thanks,

Awesome history 28

I did get banned from a map game once because I kept accidentally deleting the categories (silly reason, I did it on accident) apart from that I haven't been banned from a map game. Just said that if you wanted to know.

Do u want to meet me on chat sometime and I'll PM you about my plans for North America in your game.

Thanks,

Awesome history 28

Re: Down a Different Path and Southern Independence MG
Map games, i'm not really a fan of as I prefer to create my own timelines. But in terms of the sport aspect of the Down a Different Path timeline, I could do that it but that would be after get my timeline (An Earlier World Cup of Football up to the second world war. HawkAussie (Talk)  23:37, March 20, 2016 (UTC)

I did see you might need some more nations, so I will let you do it. HawkAussie (Talk) 23:40, March 20, 2016 (UTC)

Southern Independence Mod
Could I just be a regular mod in Southern Independence? The Epic Dragon (talk) 03:03, March 24, 2016 (UTC)

On Re:Southern Independence
Oh, that is fine, I just wanted the game to start. Oh and was it ok that I changed nations? The Epic Dragon (talk) 03:38, March 24, 2016 (UTC)

Southern Independence:Nations
When u said South Germany did u mean North Germany? The Epic Dragon (talk) 18:57, March 25, 2016 (UTC)

Re:Southern Independence (x3)
I thought I removed my name from Germany. Sorry for the misunderstanding. The Epic Dragon (talk) 19:31, March 25, 2016 (UTC)

Southern Independence: The Map
Hello there! I'm willing to prepare the maps for Southern Independence if you want me to. I've done it before and the head mod was quite satisfied. Let me know if you ever want me to.

~ Jeffrey Arenburg (talk) 15:37, March 27, 2016 (UTC)

thank you for that just about to do it. Wild designed my new new signature and it appears to be turning everything gold? - Emp

Emancipation
I can't find it anywhere, can you tell me which turn did Polenysians agreed to peace? Wrto12 (talk) 17:37, April 25, 2016 (UTC)

Huh, I guess you are right. I searched for it, never received a mod response for the Polynesian kingdoms when I gave 'Alihikaua autonomy. Must have mixed that up with my dispute with the French. -- Orange (→My wall!←) 17:40, April 25, 2016 (UTC)

Ok i will act like Polenysians accepted peace. Still they hate Hawaii more than the colonial powers. Wrto12 (talk) 17:41, April 25, 2016 (UTC)

Fair enough. Apologies for my mix-up.

-- Orange (→My wall!←) 17:41, April 25, 2016 (UTC)

Invitation
Hello,

You seem like a fairly active user here. Feel free to join us on chat anytime and become a bigger part of our community!

Perhaps I shall. I never know what chat is about though.. Guess I'll find out!

-- Orange (→My wall!←) 19:27, May 14, 2016 (UTC)

British Ain't Coming
I will do the German States,is that ok? --The Epic Dragon (talk) 21:48, May 22, 2016 (UTC)

Okay, I'll let you construct some of the German nations. Use this for reference, and just leavem e a message if you need any help! When you finish, let me know so I can ratify the articles. Thanks!

-- Orange (→My wall!←) 22:06, May 22, 2016 (UTC)

Australia in British Ain't Coming
Can I do Australia for the timeline, or at least start it. HawkAussie (Talk) 23:46, May 28, 2016 (UTC)

Thanks. HawkAussie (Talk) 22:18, May 29, 2016 (UTC)

Map Game
You might be interested in 1400 (Map Game) --The Epic Dragon (talk) 01:31, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

Act of Ambitions
Hi, I'm Mexico in the game, do you want to have an alliance with me, I'll send you aid and troops if you promise me at the end of the war I can have Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, Oklahoma, South California and Nevada.

Thanks,

Awesome history 28 (talk) 15:15, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

I shall agree to this proposal, but you must also support our secessionist movements from the Fascists. I'll assure that the nation I form will be on good terms with Mexico.

-- Orange (→My wall!←) 17:28, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

This is a notifcation to say Act of Ambition (Map Game) the map game which you signed up for has started and therefore you can now post your first turn on this new game. Person67 (talk) 17:52, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

Plan B
So.............Orange. Mind getting into chat? I may have a Plan B to save your arse. Through Stars We Rise. (Welcome to the Universe). 12:50, June 2, 2016 (UTC)

Announcement
Hello Game of Nations player!

Now that turn one is done (Turn to starts Saturday) I have recognized the need for a more comprehensive way to plan events that involve more than one nation. So, if you would like to propose a past event, such as a war, Nation formation, or other event, please use the link I have provided below. Note that this only applies to events that involve more than one nation, so you are still free to make events that only pertain to your nation.

Thanks for playing Game of Nations, and I hope it continues to be a fun experience!

Link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1p1YFsylq8KUQkpuEDwMemOiMO7t7nbBtYp3xp8DGhRc/edit?pref=2&pli=1

Leaving TBAC
Hey

So... i'm not to much active on the The British Ain't Coming, so i've decided to leave the history (Besides that I want to focus on my althists). I apologize for that.

--Massacote (talk)

No worries, Massacote. I understand if you want to work on your personal timelines, and if you must withdraw from TBAC in the process. If you ever want to work on the timeline again, you'll always be welcome.

-- Orange (→My wall!←) 17:04, July 1, 2016 (UTC)

Wiki chat
Hi - do you want to go on the wiki chat so we can talk for a bit about SSY? Bryce III - ☕ Tea? 22:11, July 14, 2016 (UTC)

Second Duplication
Just letting you know that you uploaded a second duplication onto this site.


 * File:Flag of New France 3 wht.jpg → File:Flag of Royalist France.svg

Please be advised that a third duplication may now result in the temporary suspension of your account. Please try not to let this happen again. Thank you. -- 19:29, July 28, 2016 (UTC)

Bahmanid Support of Brunei [PMIV]
Bahmanids here: I'm no friend of Majapahit, and your revolt seems like a good thing to support, but I won't send my men to die for something I don't think will succeed. Majapahit has a lot of power, and at most I might (realistically) be able to send 40-50,000 men of my 180,000 or so army, and my whole navy is only 40 ships. My ally Mogadishu (Fallacyman) might be able to send 60 ships or so. How many troops (and especially ships) can you muster? (On the other hand, though, my larger population will give us an advantage in the war algo.) Also, will Khmer intervene on Majapahit's side? If you can prove to me that victory is plausible, and convince Fallacyman, I'll back you to the stars. (Just another thought, could we also stir up a revolt in the former Malacca Sultanate?) Sorry for being a little ramble-y. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 15:52, August 6, 2016 (UTC)

Oh, and if we do restore the Malacca Sultanate, it will be in personal union with us Bahmanids. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 17:18, August 6, 2016 (UTC)

Your plan seems reasonable. You have our support. I'll ask Mogadishu to help us. A couple things: 1830? Do you mean 1630? I can't even get a trade deal with the Gurkanis, and I doubt that the Ottomans (who only have coast n the Med) or Abbasids would care. (And my relationships with the Abbasids aren't stellar, either.) Even though the Ming aren't Muslim, they could come if you offer them trade posts or territory. Also, what about Sunda? They're not Muslim, but an offer of enough territory could convince them to join us.The Guardian of Forever (talk) 18:09, August 6, 2016 (UTC)

Well, Majapahit has found out? Any ideas?The Guardian of Forever (talk) 23:08, August 6, 2016 (UTC)

Also, should I include my support in my post on the main page?The Guardian of Forever (talk) 23:46, August 6, 2016 (UTC)

Sounds good. I'll ask Bengal, the Timurids, the Abbasids, and Zanzibar for support. Perhaps you should also ask Champa?The Guardian of Forever (talk) 01:24, August 7, 2016 (UTC)

hello orange wanted to talk about SI because i would like to be a nation but i 95 edit less then needed to be it  Vinnyus   Stop Calling me Map !   19:57, August 7, 2016 (UTC)

Southern Independence - Edit Count
Hello Tullin. I'm sure you can attain 95 more edits before SI starts; it's been delayed since the start of Emancipation; now that I'm participating in PMIV as well, SI probably won't be able to compete for the longest time. It will be a a month or two at least. However, if you can't reach those 95 edits, which nation were you specifically eyeing to play as? -- Orange (→My wall!←) 03:43, August 8, 2016 (UTC)

The British Ain't Coming: Blast Impacts
Hey Orange, I'm new here but I noticed your series of The British Ain't Coming and I have studied many different subjects, so I would think that when the Asteroid hit 1. Continents have changed in 65 million years, but it still could have affected The tectonics so Britain wasn't formed, so that's ok. 2. Would nearby areas like Brittany, Netherlands, Norway, Iceland and other places near Britain be affected???. This is just some advice for your timeline, because I just thought other places would be affected By The blast. (((I'm not trying to be rude, just some advice :).

Hello; you are not the first one to ask about other effects of the PoD. I'm sure that a megatsunami in the North Sea would result (like to OTL Gulf Tsunami after the Chicxulub impact), since it is the same meteor as the Chicxulub meteor. However, since it was so long ago, I doubt it would have any great impacts on the coastline of France, the Netherlands, Iceland, etc.; in this TL, Shetland was far enough away to survive the impact. I wonder what effects it could have on the Yucatan peninsula, though, since the Chicxulub crater is absent.

-- Orange (→My wall!←) 17:00, August 9, 2016 (UTC)

Moderating
Hi. I'd like to moderate your map game, specificallythe North American portion. My specialty in history knowledge is of the confederacy, and American history in general, so I think that I'd be fit. I also have experience modding, and playing map games. Vatonica (talk) 02:31, August 10, 2016 (UTC)

Play as Japan in SI
Can I be Japan in Southern Independence? Captainjohnrex (talk) 00:58, August 12, 2016 (UTC)

Confederate Victory Map Game USA question
Just wondering but does the USA have to pay reperation to the CSA, and could I possibly conquer North America Tl-191 style and bel wanted to be Morocco but doesn't have the edits but I think has a good reputation to be it.

A couple more questions, could I if I have rebuilt enough and made a large standing army by 1914, conquer North America by WWIs end, uhh could I also puppet Liberia since it was a quasi American colony to send slaves back to Africa, and could this game if it kicks off turn (which I hope it does) out like Tl-191, thoughts? User:Mr.Orwell

Gender
Btw I am a guy by the way everyone calls me bel for whatever reason just to clear up future misconceptions  By the grace of god Count of maine, Forcalquier, Anjou, and Provence, prince of albania and his highness the dauphin of France Belial.  22:14, August 14, 2016 (UTC)

Cross the Time Streams
Go ahead and take your turn ahead of time man. .....  Because I'm Just... Too... SSSWWWEEEEEETTT!!!

联合的在幸福和歡笑
Google Translate says Laughter - not Mirth.

Bil

EoGuy (talk) 23:25, August 17, 2016 (UTC)

Yes, I am aware of this; I cannot find the accurate translation of "mirth"; it keeps translating back to "laughter."

-- Orange (talk) 23:35, August 17, 2016 (UTC)

Another Cross the Time Steam Turn
Go ahead man. .....  Because I'm Just... Too... SSSWWWEEEEEETTT!!!

It's been 24-hours and your turn has not been posted you will be bumped down.

Unie Van Zuid-Afrika
Hey i was wondering if i could possible make South Africa in BAC. I fifure they would be Dutch that is would probably be similar to saying what if blacks had there rights but never took Power in South Africa as i was thinking, and also, how much territoy in Africa should be dutch, they already carved out a massive empire ranging from Michigan to New South Wales. - Orwell

Sure, Orwell. Just be sure to use at the beginning of the article to indicate a proposial. When you feel it is ready to be ratified as canon, just apply on the talk page. -- Orange (talk) 01:29, August 28, 2016 (UTC)

Third Duplication and File Stealing

 * File:California TBAC.png

I genuinely do hope this was a mistake on your part, that you truly didn't intend to take one of my images and Photoshop some cities out and call it yours. I probably wouldn't be as mad had you taken the time to ask permission or had you simply used the original image for your article, but you chose not to.

I will be removing this file. I will also be suspending your account for 24 hours. I sincerely hope you don't try anything like this again. -- 02:31, August 29, 2016 (UTC)

Another Cross the Time Stream Turn
Go ahead and do another turn my friend. .....  Because I'm Just... Too... SSSWWWEEEEEETTT!!!

Uh?
Why did you do two turns on Cross the Time Stream? I did not see the first turn you did when I sent you the message above. So if you could kindly remove your second turn please. .....  Because I'm Just... Too... SSSWWWEEEEEETTT!!!

PMIV as Delhi
Just a friendly reminder that next in line to the throne of Delhi is my ruler's son. We are also in official alliance. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 18:18, September 10, 2016 (UTC)

Maybe we (and perhaps Bengal) should form some sort of Kalmar Union-esque thing in India? I'll be on chat most of tomorrow if you want to work out the details. Also, sorry for leaving you to the Majahapit, but you know that there's nothing I could of done-their navy was just too strong. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 00:43, September 11, 2016 (UTC)

No problem about Brunei; I guess I should've known I was dead from the start. And when the dynastic union begins, I was thinking the same thing: I was thinking about calling it the Union of Indian Sultanates, or the United Sultanates of India, or something like that. I was also thinking of an incursion into Nepal to create an Indian tributary there, bring Islam to the HImalayas, and open up trade routes to Tibet (but Tibet could very well get aggravated by these military actions, so I'm not all too sure).

-- Orange (talk) 06:21, September 11, 2016 (UTC)

I've been talking to LordMarlborough (Assam) and he says he'd be willing to switch to Bengal and become the third member of this. Do you want to go on chat sometime today and work out the specifics? (Oh, and I gave Ace a bloody nose in revenge a couple years ago. He's pretty sore about his loss, though, so I'm willing to bet we'll have a war or two with him.) The Guardian of Forever (talk) 15:17, September 11, 2016 (UTC)

As for the Himalayas, I think vassalizing Ladakh, Kangra, and Nepal is a good idea, but right now Delhi has -14 war exhaustion so you might want to wait on that campaign. (Even if Tibet objects, I doubt they have a large army). The Guardian of Forever (talk) 16:52, September 11, 2016 (UTC)

Lastly, be careful with religion. At most your population is 35% Muslim, probably lower. Be very careful with the Hindus, and I wouldn't actively try to convert new regions. Just let the religion spread by slow osmosis. The greatest threat to both of us is a large-scale Hindu (or Gunturist, if Ace manages to get his religion to India) revolt. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 17:10, September 11, 2016 (UTC)

That is quite true; however, with the Buddhist sects uniting in Siam, it looks like Ace's religion has hit a roadblock.

-- Orange (talk) 17:22, September 11, 2016 (UTC)

Do you want to come on chat and discuss this? The Guardian of Forever (talk) 18:39, September 11, 2016 (UTC)

When are you on chat? The Guardian of Forever (talk) 19:13, September 11, 2016 (UTC)

Scraw said that my guy might not actually be first in line to your throne. As I see it, we have two options: either just wait and arrange another marriage later, or fight a sucession war. The first might be a better idea. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 22:40, September 11, 2016 (UTC)I t

I think so too; lol.

-- Orange (talk) 22:46, September 11, 2016 (UTC)

In terms of marriages: Ilyas first got married back in the 1430's, so the eldest son's probably somewhere in his 20's-good time to have a kid. LM can switch to Bengal today or tomorrow, and my (11-year old) son can marry his ruler's only daughter in a couple years, and then their only daughter can marry Ilyas's grandson, and we can get all three Sultanates in p. union. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 11:57, September 12, 2016 (UTC)

That sound like a pretty good plan. As far as my war exhaustion goes, it looks like our incursion into Nepal can occur by 1470.

-- Orange (talk) 17:29, September 12, 2016 (UTC)

I'll have a draft of a treaty sometime today for you. (LM said he'll switch to Bengal next turn and sell you Odissa.) The Guardian of Forever (talk) 17:36, September 12, 2016 (UTC)

Ah! Thank you for that.

-- Orange (talk) 17:42, September 12, 2016 (UTC)

Here is my proposal (LM said he's fine w/it): (shura=council-see later articles for what exactly I mean-the term was first applied to the committee that elected the first Sunni Caliph, but it came to be used in a general sense. I believe one of Iran's legislatures uses the name.) It also probably needs to go in a more logical order:

On the Monarchy: 1. The Sultanate of Delhi may join this agreement at any time through marriage into the Monarchial line. (OOC: Or we can just call you a 'prospective/future member from the beginning-it really doesn't matter)

2. All signatories will be ruled by a common monarch, and no one else may claim the title of head of state. The Monarch will be from the patrilineal line of Muhammad Shah of the Bahmanids, to be determined by the following rules of succession:
 * The Monarch must be Muslim.
 * The Monarch must not be a child of adultery.
 * The husband of an only daughter will be co-Sultan with his wife, unless one is non-Muslim, in which case the other will be sole ruler.
 * Simple male primogeniture (w/o crown treating all as living) (OOC: See this from 1:33 for what I mean, I'm just too lazy to type all that.)

3. All succession disputes will be resolved by the shuras. While resolving these disputes, all military units will be under command of the shuras. Any candidate who takes up arms against another will be automatically disqualified. If the Monarch if under the age of 15, the shuras will act as a regency for him until he reaches said age.

4. Titles and names of the Monarch: The Monarch shall be known as Badshah-e-Hind (Emperor of India), (x) Badshah-e-Hind, or Emperor (x) in reference to outside nations. Within the territory and vassals of Delhi, the Monarch will be known as (x) Hamza Khan, within that of the Bahmanids, as (x) Shah, within those of Bengal as (x) Shah-ud-din.

5. On the upbringing of the monarch: until the age of 8, the Monarch will stay at one of the three capitols, to be chosen on a rotating basis. (OOC: in other words, the player who gets this gets to decide the Monarch’s base character, siblings, etc.) After the age of 8, he will accompany the previous monarch, if still leaving, or the closest possible relative, if not, and travel between the capitols as a Monarch does.

Policy: 1. Each of the three Sultanates’ nobles will elect a shura (council) of the 30 most distinguished of them-the responsibilities and powers of these shall be discussed in the pertinent sections later. The exact election of each will be determined by each of the constituent nations. (OOC: Also, a good excuse to get into democratic systems.) These shuras will represent the interests of each of the three Sultanates in relation to the union/Monarch.

2. All members shall have a coordinated foreign policy, decided by the Monarch and the shuras in concert, who shall meet for one month each year (a meeting to be held one of the three capitols (OOC:the three of us can rotate each year)) to determine foreign policy and other such matters which concern all three states, such as economic integration or amendments to this compact. These meetings may also be held in times of major war or other crises.

3. In war, whether offensive or defensive, all signatories and their vassals will be obliged to support each other (OOC: Informing the others before charging off into a major war would be courteous, though.)

4. Each of the Sultanates will be independent in its domestic affairs, the Monarch and the shura of each determining the domestic conduct of each nation together, in a matter to be decided by each signatory individually.

5. All tariffs between the signatories as well as their vassals, shall be abolished. Further economic integration will be discussed at the annual meeting between the Monarchs and the three shuras.

6. Vassals of the signatories will not be considered members of this bloc. All members and their vassals, however, are obliged to defend them, and they will be part of any economic integration that is agreed to between the members.

7. Any dispute between two signatories will be moderated by the Monarch and the shura of the third. If all three are in a dispute, an individual selected by the Monarch (OOC: An allied Monarch) will resolve the dispute.

The Guardian of Forever (talk) 00:49, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Looks pretty good to me; I shall arrange the marriage of the Sultan's daughter (not in the Delhian succession line) to form the union.

-- Orange (talk) 01:16, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

On the marriages: I was thinking this sequence: My son marries Begnali ruler's only daughter, their kid marries your current heir's son. Seem to me the fastest way considering the various age gap hoops. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:32, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Seems good, though I would prefer if Delhi unified with Bahmani first. The threat of a possible Abbasid invasion on our eastern frontier seems much more dangerous than a Majapahit incursion. Bengal seems in a safe position than Delhi. Additionally, with the sale of Odisha next turn, a Bengal-Bahmanid union wouldn't make India a contigiuous nation; a Dehlian-Bahmanid union would.

-- Orange (talk) 02:48, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Good points, but the ages/genders just don't match up in the right order (our rulers both have sons, and yours is twice the age of mine.) I'm not so worried about the Abbasids-we have the Gurkanis, Omanis, and Mogadishans (all of which are officially or unofficially my allies, and the first yours as well) to cover our flank there. As for the Majapahit, there's nothing but us. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 11:52, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

And the Abbasid realm may seem enormous, but it's not very populated. Even w/the Ottomans and Russians on their side, they couldn't beat Rimp's empire at half strength. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 11:56, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

do not buy any land along the coast Bibleboyd316 (talk) 12:02, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

I know Tibet wants coast access, but you should try for a trade treaty w/LM (Bengal) rather than making vague demands. Don't pretend that Tibet could take on any of the Indian Sultanates. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 13:26, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

@ Orange: Maybe we can consider you an 'observer' or something like that until the time's right for you to join. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 13:32, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Also, could I have Marwar and Mewar? The Guardian of Forever (talk) 01:56, September 14, 2016 (UTC)

I was thinking maybe we could partition the two states? Based on the Wikipedia maps of  and Marwar, I've drawn up a partition map: light blue is land that is already Bahmanid land, light red is land that is already Delhian land, dark blue is what the Bahmanids get from the partition, and dark red is what the Delhians get from the partition. The main compromise is that in exchange for me obtaining Jodhpur, you get Udaipur. How does this look? I had to draw it up quick, so it isn't the most, ah, visually appealing.

Just a little note: I think this should occur after the defeat of Nepal, since all of my war exhaustion will be gone by then. Both of our war exhaustion should only take a few turns to go down to 0 after Nepal is defeated.

-- Orange (talk) 16:08, September 14, 2016 (UTC)

I saw Rimp's note on religion, (and as a half-Pakistani who knows a good deal about the region), I'd also like to note a few things. At the time of the partition India was ~35% Muslim. (It was probably more like 25 back in the 1400's, and if we prosper we might get it to 45.) Current OTL Pakistan is about 15% Shia. OTL's India is ~3% Christian. As long as you don't do anything to opress any religion (except Gunturism), you should be fine. Also, I'll have a daughter ready to marry into your line around 1474 or so. The partition plan is fine with me. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 00:22, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

Also, nowadays everyone just says the westernized 'Delhite,' but the traditional demonym was 'Delhavi,' I think. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 01:17, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

Alright. What do you think about my partition?

-- Orange (talk) 01:32, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

I'm fine w/it. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:18, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

The 'Eastern Myth' isn't an actual book or anything. It's more like a combination of the Donation of Constantine with bribing prominent Hindus to spread some rumors. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 22:20, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

It seems like the 'Eastern Myth' has backfired big-time. I suggest that we use harsher methods. We cannot allow Gunturism to infect India. (Though if you have a third option, I'd like to hear it.) The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:54, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

I would say that I would prevent a Hindu revolution by giving them a spearate court system as you said, and I can also give Hindus and Muslims a common enemy: the Gunterists. Campaign the evils of Gunterism to the Hindus, creating interreligious unity. Secure the borders and ports tightly, turning back the Gunterists. Persecution shouldn't start yet, or Ace will get a causus belli for a relgious war/liberating oppressef groups if he decides to strike.

-- Orange (talk) 02:57, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

Well, that was what the 'Eastern Myth' was about, and it backfired miserably. If Ace does start another war, (which, based on what he's saying on chat is basically a when question), isn't it best to do it before too many Gunturists infiltrate India? He has just as much war exhaustion as us, so it'll have the same result as the last. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 03:00, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

I'd have to agree: but secure the borders, and maybe we should start deporting Gunterists. Keep building your navy, and build trebuchets to defend your ports. When will the time be right?

-- Orange (talk) 03:04, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

For crushing the Gunturists, or war w/Ace? The Guardian of Forever (talk) 03:06, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

The right time to go to war with Ace; the Gunterists would be crushed in the war anyway. Perhaps if I can get a scope on the Maja population, then I can see how are chances look, with war exhaustion, population, and military factors.

-- Orange (talk) 03:08, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

Personally, if possible, I say wait until war exhaustion is gone, (anyway, I'm thinking of conquering the Maldives beforehand. Gives me more navy.) I think he'll force a war beforehand, though. Militarily, we have the advantage. The only reason the Andaman War took three years, was that Delhi and Bengal only provided half-hearted support and I was an idiot in the naval sphere. His population's something like 11 mil, Khmer, less than that. Together, we have more than 100 million people, and a far superior army. I'm hoping that our combined navies may be able to locally outnumber any force he can send into the Indian Ocean (~25% of his fleet) in a couple of years. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 03:17, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

Well, that's good for us; that means it is a minor war, so war exhaustion won't explode like in major wars. We need to defend Burma and Lanka the most, since that seems to be what Ace wants.

-- Orange (talk) 03:26, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

Makes sense. They are also the most vulnerable Bahmanid areas. Burma's a lesser problem, we can just march our armies through Bengali territory and crush whatever landing Ace makes. Lanka's a more difficult one, though-there's no way to defend it w/o naval superiority. The good thing about it is that I gave Swahili a ton of economic interests there, so we have a good justification for their (really good) navy to intervene. I think we should just pull back our navies to defend Lanka, and just use land power to smash any landings elsewhere. (The other reason I want Ace to attack is so we can react to his troop deployments more easily). The Guardian of Forever (talk) 03:35, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

Looks like Ace is stirring up trouble in India again. The time for war is coming very soon. Keep building up your navy. You should tighten your security, and try whatever you can to stop the Maja assassin. Perhaps if we persecute the Gunterists, that will aggravate him; however, that will give him a good causus belli. Ace must be stopped, or the Gunterists will rise in India.

-- Orange (talk) 06:30, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

I wouldn't worry about the 'assassin.' MP declared all assassination illegal back in 1401 and I informed Ace of it. I think he's just too lazy to change his post. Also, just how large is the Delhavi navy right now? (Bahmanid=100 w/20 more on the way, Burmese=40 w/10 more on the way, Bengali=72). The Guardian of Forever (talk) 16:02, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

Assuming that every time I build 10 ships after I purshased Odisha, I would put it around, maybe, 40, 50, or 60 ships.

-- Orange (talk) 16:54, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

I think we need to step up our anti-Gunterist movements. At first I was worried about aggravating Ace, but I now see that getting him to attack would be a great advantage. I'll start deporting Gunterists.

-- Orange (talk) 16:57, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

Wait a sec; perhaps it is only 4 or 5 warships per year. I guess that would put my navy at 20, or 25 ships. Tiem to build more.

-- Orange (talk) 16:58, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

Scraw told me that negative mod events (probably Hindu revolts) are coming to India soon. Now, considering that not a single revolt so far in PMIV has suceeded, I don't think we should worry too much, but still...The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:03, September 24, 2016 (UTC)

The mods seem to think that our bloc is OP, so I suggest we wait on the PU stuff for maybe a century or so. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 11:55, September 27, 2016 (UTC)

Yeah. Build up your military good in that case. As for negative mod events, they may also attempt to get all of us to turn on one another to end our alliance.

-- Orange (talk) 15:40, September 27, 2016 (UTC)

On your alliances: The Gurkanis are also an ally of Delhi. It was done when Delhi was an NPC back in the 1430's. I really recommend keeping it. Rimp's not a very demanding ally (speaking from personal experience here), and if the mod do give us a Hindu revolt, his large army might save us. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 22:39, September 28, 2016 (UTC)

Kan ek Suid-Africa in Britse Is dit nie die toekoms kom
Can I do South Africa in British Aint Comming, i might have a idea, but the flag is gonna have to change-- Orwell

Sure; just don't change anything on the Nations page yet. When you make your article, please add  to the top of the article. Thanks!

-- Orange (talk) 01:44, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

tibet deal
if you not vassle napel i let you in ona deal with me and ming china tell more later Bibleboyd316 (talk) 16:54, September 14, 2016 (UTC)

I see your deal and rise your if you give me Nepal and is I will give 15% of trades on this new cash cow I'm doing with Ming China Bibleboyd316 (talk) 00:36, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

how about we splits it in half and 50,000 doller Bibleboyd316 (talk) 00:56, September 15, 2016 (UTC)ga

nevermind it my vassale now Bibleboyd316 (talk) 01:37, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

nepal is already my vassel so back offBibleboyd316 (talk) 16:42, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

well lets make a deal p.s what is this Easter myth?

(i have ming as a allie)

Bibleboyd316 (talk) 16:53, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

how you have all the east side and i can have the west side Bibleboyd316 (talk) 16:57, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

what is the eastern myth>

50/50 no long strip Bibleboyd316 (talk) 17:52, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

dealBibleboyd316 (talk) 18:16, September 15, 2016 (UTC)

On Tibet [PMIV]
BibleBoyd got banned by Nate. He shouldn't be a problem anymore. (For the record, the Bahmanid army's about 3/4 the size of yours, and Bengal's a bit over 2/3 of mine.) Also, prevailing opinion among the mods seems to be that your religious policy might lead to a Hindu revolt. (And from personal, experience, I can tell you that will be a nightmare. Ace has also told me several times that if there's a Hindu revolt, he will invade India.) I would highly suggest being more tolerant of the Hindus. Follow my example and let them have their own separate court system (like OTL Cordoba). The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:40, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

I am preparing for war.      18:01, September 17, 2016 (UTC)

Naval Concentrations
Orange, sorry but why did you pick a naval concentration? You know that your maximum fleet size is abut 30 ships, considering the only Delhian coastline is Orissa. Also, you have the most population out of any of us, which gives you the strongest army. Since both the Guardian and I have picked naval concentrations, we will need a strong army supporter. Thanks,      10:17, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

My two cents on this. 1. Orange, your coast is tiny. A naval concentration probably won't get mod approval. 2. LM's right. Though my concentration is still army, we have our backs covered navally, with the Swahilis to the west, and Bengal+Burma to the east. I'm also hoping to make the Maldives a vassal and get my hands on their fleet. After all, our strategy has always been, 'crush any landings with our superior army,' and if Ace brings his ally Khmer, we can launch a full-out overland campaign and push the war algo totally to our side. We need your army concentration for that. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 16:05, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

Alright. I was just thinking that navy might have been more important to defend against Ace. I hadn't considered Khmer. But if Scraw rejects my naval concentration, I'll change to army as soon as I can. Sorry guys.

-- Orange (talk) 17:24, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

Majapahit
Orange, I have no war exhaustion. If you want me to humble Tibet, I will be more than pleased to do so.      17:48, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

Ace has declared war. I'm not sure if it'll effect this turn or the next, though. Strategy-wise: if his navy outnumbers ours, retreat to port, and crush whatever landing he tries to make. If he waits, we can invade Khmer (and maybe even Malaya) and end this war on land. #s: Delhi can send 150,000 troops to Burma (1/2 your army), while keeping the rest at home to deal w/any landings. Bengal can send 100,000 to Burma, me, 70,000. I'll also send 100,000 troops to Sri Lanka. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 18:16, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

Agreed. I'd like to actually send 75k troops to Burma, since I want to stop any revolts that may occur. Start rallying your Hindus to fight!

-- Orange (talk) 18:38, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

Well, combined the three of us will have 250k troops at home, so I thought that would be sufficient. (I want to really hammer Khmer, though-might convince Fires that allying w/Ace is a bad idea.) The Guardian of Forever (talk) 18:41, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

And I was thinking: if we do win the war, and the Maja are finished off, we could install Muslim Bruneian rule in Borneo. Then we can avenge me (lol). In any case, I want to keep Sumatra, and if possible, liberate Malaya.

-- Orange (talk) 18:42, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

Let's win this first. Also, could you officially declare war in your post for today? (Sending above troops as well, of course.) The Guardian of Forever (talk) 18:44, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

Alright then. Would this be the "Second Andaman War," perhaps? Maybe the "Indo-Majapahit War," or the "Gunterist Wars."

-- Orange (talk) 18:47, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

I'll let Ace do that? He's really good at war naming. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 18:49, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

Mk, lol

-- Orange (talk) 18:51, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

Yes. Majapahit will die!!      23:56, September 18, 2016 (UTC)

It's almost certain the war is won: what territory if any do you want? I just want the Andaman/Nicobar islands and permission to take all of Burma (LM's agreed to sell me his part), Khmer wants Sumatra and Malay, and of course, restoration of Brunei (maybe as your vassal?) The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:19, September 19, 2016 (UTC)

I was hoping to assimilate Sumatra and make it the "fourth Sultanate" of India; I think Fires and I can work something out. I am willing to relinquish the islands east of Sumatra, though I can accept just having the islands west of Sumatra. I would like it personally seen that our whole coalition (India and Khmer) occupies Java, and Wilwatikta (the Maja capital) is sacked and burnt to the ground (leave no stone behind, destroy Wilwatikta like Carthage was destroyed by Rome). As for me, I would like to obtain the southern islands that range from Bali to Timor. I would prefer Brunei to be under Delhian guidance until its eventual independence (though still under heavy Indian influence), its territory being Borneo and Celebes.

I've drawn up a partition map of Majapahit, showing our claims to the former empire. All red territory is coalition-occupied, which pretty much means we don't know what to do with it yet.

-- Orange (talk) 04:09, September 19, 2016 (UTC)

I dunno if the mods will approve all that (they were earlier saying they were against 1 war=annexation or breakup of empire), but we can sure try. As for trying to push more, Ace is disputing the war algo, and we already have over 200% anyway. (Also, it would take us decades of construction to get navy superiority-that's why I'm hoping for ships instead of gold as reparations. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 22:51, September 19, 2016 (UTC)

Destroying the empire is certainly what we are pushing for, but all we need to do is get Ace into a position where he can never bother India again. If anything, we could push the Maja all the way back into Java. And about Ace disputing the war algo, I found this in the Leaves of Absence section of the PMIV talk page; it appears he's got a bit of a history being a sore loser:

"Alright, THAT IS IT! I officially quit. I want nothing to do with PMIV and I much less want anything to do with any of the moderators involved and their rubbish. You know that? If you think I am arse, then you NOW made me one. For all I care, this game better be dead by the time I come back. And honestly, hopefully, I avoid this game like the plague and any subsequent games. Now, I am honestly done. D-O-N-E. Done! So, honestly, I can at best give you the mother of all insults if I could come up with one. Lousy wankers! Now, to the rest of you, I suggest you do the same. So, if anyone wants to boycott this game, feel free to. I know I will. Through Stars We Rise. (Welcome to the Universe). 03:24, August 14, 2016 (UTC)"

-- Orange (talk) 23:58, September 19, 2016 (UTC)

That's an old post from Ace-he rants like that every time he loses a war, but recants a few hours later. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 00:00, September 20, 2016 (UTC)

Well, as I've said, pushing back the Maja to Java would destroy the Majapahit position, and please the mods as well. Receiving ships as reparation would be a good tactic, and might be crucial to finally finish 'em off a decade our two later.

-- Orange (talk) 00:08, September 20, 2016 (UTC)

Okay, because I am lazy, I am going to make my terms short and sweet.
 * 1) Khmer gets Malay and Sumatra, plus those islands east of java to do as I wish with.
 * 2) Brunei becomes independent. All participating nations, excluding Khmer, mutually decide on the royal family.
 * 3) The red stuff is occupied by us jointly for 20 years, and is then either a) annexed by Khmer or B) given independence
 * 4) All participating nations are allowed to sack Wilwatikta. while each nation's troops take what they can, the treasury of Majapahit will be split evenly among us.
 * 5) Majapahit ships are split on the following basis: 30% each to Khmer, Bahmanids, and Bengal, and 10% to Delhi.

A few thing you might see unfair off the bat: Delhi get's less ships because they are the most land based power, and that is the same reason they can't get Sumatra - no way to hold it. Also, dividing the treasury evenly might be unfeasible, so a little loose on that.

I'm just going to write a treaty w/my and Bengal's (uncontroversial) demands. You two can work out whatever you want and post it on the same page. I think I'll call it the Treaty of Kuala Lumpur. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 01:15, September 20, 2016 (UTC)

I'm drawing up a counter-proposal to this. Seems a bit biased on the Khmer side. Gaining Sumatra and the islands east of Java would allow me to become a naval power, so I would like to hold my claim on those. -- Orange (talk) 01:36, September 20, 2016 (UTC)
 * 1) Khmer gets Malaya, Singapore, the Riau Islands the Bangka Belitung Islands, Pulau Madura, and Pulau Kangean.
 * 2) Delhi receives Sumatra and the islands ranging from Bali to Timor.
 * 3) Brunei is restored, controlling Borneo and Celebes. All participating nations mutually decide on the royal family.
 * 4) The red area is occupied by us until a consensus can be reached on what to do about it.
 * 5) All participating nations are allowed to sack Wilwatikta. While each nation's troops take what they can, the treasury of Majapahit will be split evenly among us.
 * 6) Majapahit ships are split evenly, 25%, among all participants.

I agree with everything, except I get Sumatra and the islands east of Java. You can't hold it, and 25% of Ace's Navy won't change that.

Perhaps it will be less effective in the islands east of Java, but I can hold onto Sumatra just fine. Besides, I doubt that Khmer would be able to do any better.

-- Orange (talk) 02:18, September 20, 2016 (UTC)

I'm willing to give you the islands west of Sumatra, but it is pretty ASB for you to get the island itself. The rest of my demands are on the page. ~Fires

No offense, but I think you're both being overambitious. Remember, the Majapahit fleet is still intact. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:22, September 20, 2016 (UTC)

True, I would be willing to give up the islands from Bali to Timor, but I doubt Fires could have them either. And Fires, I am willing to cede you the islands east of Sumatra.

-- Orange (talk) 02:24, September 20, 2016 (UTC)

Okay fair enough - Islands from Bali to Timor, occupied. But I get Sumatra and the western islands, you get the eastern ones. It is just implausible, is not completely ASB, for you to hold that much territory that far away. Frankly, even the eastern islands a stretching it. ~Fires

Umm... I kind of meant that I would let go of my claim to the eastern islands, but get Sumatra. I'd be with you taking those islands east of Java, if you must. It would be more plausible to hold Sumatra, anyway, since it is way closer than, say, Timor.

-- Orange (talk) 05:14, September 20, 2016 (UTC)

I completely understood what you meant, but that doesn't make it plausible. You are separated by a vast expanse of empty ocean from Sumatra, which would make it hard to hold even if they were culturally similar, which they aren't. Especially with a weak navy, and no way to improve it quickly enough, you simply could not plausibly hold it. I meanwhile, am separated by a short channel from it, and we have pretty similar cultures and history, making it many times easier to hold. You get the Islands to the west, I get Sumatra and the Islands to the east. That's final.

~Fires

Orange, you controlling any of Indonesia won't get approved my the mods. (And why have a territory filled with Gunturists?). Fires and I have a compromise proposal-Fires gets Sumatra, Brunei is independent (but only on Borneo, no Celebes) in Dynastic Union with you, and you get 50 out of the 100 reparation ships. Fires also asked that the three of us and him go our separate ways after this, (with the exception of Majapahit getting aggressive again.) Also, if you agree, I'll let you have all of Marwar and Mewar. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 23:04, September 20, 2016 (UTC)

Looks like you've got yourselves a deal. And sorry about being absent all Tuesday, my Tuesdays are busy.

-- Orange (talk) 16:03, September 21, 2016 (UTC)

Great Eastern War
The war is not over. You are the most reasonable Indian player, so I am going to be nice with you. Don't try to claim anything else. Scraw's ruling is considered moot by most other mods. AM, the King of the Banat (talk) 08:35, September 24, 2016 (UTC)

Ace and I agreed to a compromise to end it before it got even more insane and drawn-out. Please see []. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:39, September 25, 2016 (UTC)

Compact of Iskenderun
I noticed that you edited the Compact of Iskenderun to place your application and then removed it. So just gonna let you know that if you want to, you can sign the Compact. It doesn't only facilitate trade with India but rather if you sign it, it would allow you to establish Indian spice markets in Gurkani cities as well as trade with Europeans by exporting their goods to your nation. Ofcourse that depends on whether or not you're interested of which I don't have a clue xD

Yeah, sorry bout that Rimp, I'm always a bit indecisive when it comes to map games. Perhaps the term of intervening if Gurkani ports are blockaded deterred me a bit (unlike previous map games I've played, I try to avoid war). I'll think this over again. lol

-- Orange (talk) 18:35, September 24, 2016 (UTC)

Scotland says "Yes"
Hi Orange - there's a few ideas concernign the German-Speaking Community which I think we should think about which i've posted on the SSY Talk Page - could you have a look? Thx Bryce III - ☕ Tea? 16:28, September 27, 2016 (UTC)

Hello again - just wondering if you'd had any thoughts on whether we should change the GSC. From what i've seen, the arguments seem to be in favour of independence or joining Luxembourg - joining Germany would cause them to lose their high levels of autonomy, and many commute/trade with Luxembourg.

Bryce III - ☕ Tea? 09:07, October 10, 2016 (UTC)

The Map
I believe that the map is wrong. I am posting for The Guardian of Forever. I don't know why they asked me to post for them, as they are somewhat secretive.      00:12, October 11, 2016 (UTC)

The Guardian of Forever tells me to tell you to be nicer to your Hindus. Give those who didn't revolt a tax break for 1 year from the Jiziya tax.      21:24, October 11, 2016 (UTC)

Guardian told me to tell you to ask Rimp if he needs help. We can cover for any revolts.      19:53, October 12, 2016 (UTC)

hello there could i joined your ATL timelkine?

India and the Chagos [PMIV]
Orange, I was thinking we could establish a small military outpost on the OTL Chagos Islands, (They had no Indian name as far as I can tell, but I think Junoob Jezair (southern islands) would be appropriate, maybe a monarchial name for Diego Garcia, maybe 'Ismail Island?'), nothing more than 20 troops, 50-60 farmers to provide food, and 5 ships or so. I'm enviagizing them as a sort of 'early warning post,' as well as a demonstration of force. Maybe we can justify it by some sort of 'Majapahit scare' in the south or something like that? (I'll also ask LM if he wants to join in). The Guardian of Forever (talk) 23:01, October 17, 2016 (UTC)

Also, sorry for not getting back earlier, but I was away. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 23:02, October 17, 2016 (UTC)

I like the idea; perhaps a pan-Indian shared territory. Take note that I exiled Gunturists there before the Great Eastern War, though I left Diego Garcia unpopulated in case we wanted colonial ventures there. Stopping a Gunturist uprising in the Chagos could justify a colony of Diego Garcia.

Also, I got Marwar and Mewar under my sphere of influence, though I've promised not to infringe upon their culture and have granted them Burma-level autonomy; for now, they're more of protectorates than tributaries.

-- Orange (talk) 23:57, October 17, 2016 (UTC)

I nearly forgot about those Gunturists. Personally, I was thinking that they either would have died off by now or have been picked up by the Majapahit fleet during the Great Eastern War, but actually, your idea sounds nice. As for Marwar and Mewar, seems fine to me. Rajputs have a reputation as great warriors, so it's good they came w/o a fight. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 01:45, October 18, 2016 (UTC)

Also, if you want a shorter name than "Marwar and Mewar," I would suggest either Udaipur or Rajpunta. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 01:52, October 18, 2016 (UTC)

Suid-Afrika Size
Hey I'm finally getting around to making South Africa in BAC, how big do you want it to be, I was thinking South Africa, Botswana, and Southern Rhodesia-Orwell

Are you sure not going into Zimbabwe and the OTL Boer Republics http://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/colonisation-of-southern-africa-by-the-dutch.27182/ -Orwell

Well could the Great Trek happen during this ATL Scramble for Africa and with the discovery of vaccines helped along with new technology could help conquer places like Transvaal and the Zulu Empire-Orwell

On Burma [PMIV]
Sorry for responding so late. I agree with your points. Right now, I just need to keep some measure of control for the next one-and-a-half decades, so my Great General can be of age. As our combined fleets now outnumber Majapahit's, I'm hoping to use him to giver our old enemy a good drubbing. (To get him, however, I had to promise Scraw that we wouldn't take any Majapahit territory, but I'm hoping to use this war to expel the remaining Gunturists from India and force Majapahit to allow Islam, as well as dissuading any Europeans from allying with them.) After that, I would be willing to downgrade Pegu to a protectorate, or even let it go entirely, provided that it gives over most of its navy (which I built), and agrees to be neutral. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 21:11, October 22, 2016 (UTC)

We can also colonize the Chagos (or should I say 'Junoob Jezair') just after the war. I'm already starting to push the Maldives' frontier south. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 21:12, October 22, 2016 (UTC)

They're not Majapahit territory and never were, so they are fair game. (I do believe that LM should have them though, after all, he has the smallest nation of any of us. Nonetheless, we can get you Borneo, but we just have to wait a few centuries. (And probably cooperate with a European power.)) The Guardian of Forever (talk) 22:39, October 23, 2016 (UTC)

I agree on that. Surviving the Europeans will probably be the hardest part of the game for us. We do have a few advantages: 1. Unity-the main reason the British were able to take over OTL was because of factionalism and squabbling between the Indians 2. We do have a large advantage (at home, at least) for the next couple centuries thanks to our massive populations. (After all, large-scale land grabs didn't really materialize until the late 1700's, and even then the Brits had a hard time of it. Wellington called Assaye, not Waterloo, his hardest battle). 3. I'm hoping that we can play the Burgundians and Iberians against each other, having non-binding alliances with both, and thus being able to switch to the other side quickly if necessary. 4. I'm thinking we can split Indonesia w/either Burgundy or Iberia, depends on the exact situation at the time. 5. I'm hoping that inflicting a significant defeat on the Maja soon will make the Europeans see them as a far easier target, and be willing to work with us. 6. As for Christianity, even in OTL, the Europeans only managed to convert a measly amount (~3%) of India's population. Personally, I think adopting the Mongol position on missionaries, (they can preach as much as they want, as long as they praise the government), will work for us. 7. Scraw told me that no Portugal means that European exploration will be significantly delayed. 8. Oh wait, the IU, England, and Burgundy are all allies? That's scary. Nonetheless, we have an enormous amount of naval power, plus the Swahilis, plus the Gurkanis for you (and in a century for me). 9. On that: it seems most reasonable to try and ally with the mainland Euro powers to oppose these three seagoing nations. I definitely should start paying more attention the European political sphere. 10. I suggest we make only non-binding agreements with Europeans. Getting dragged into the losing side of a World War is a sure way to end up being cut up by the victors. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 04:34, October 24, 2016 (UTC)

Hrmm, France seems to be the only major sea-going power (partially) outside this IU-England-Burgundy power triangle, and one that might have a beef with Burgundy. Could be useful. I'm also thinking a serious external threat might be a good way of unifying Hindus and Muslims as Indians. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 04:36, October 24, 2016 (UTC)

I entirely agree with you. My current strategy is give the mods what they want, and decentralize. You can look at IATG's talk page for what I proposed for Indian relationships w/Europe. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 23:31, October 27, 2016 (UTC)

On Southern Independence
Your map game looks interesting. Unfortunately, I can't join because of time, but I'd just like to point out a couple of corrections: 1. The British Raj at the time was smaller than on the map. 2. The Mexican Empire should be a French puppet state played by whoever's going to to play France. (Maybe the Mexican republicans should be playable, too. I believe they controlled most of the country anyway). 3. Walachia, Moldavia, Montenegro, and Serbia should be independent as Ottoman vassals. 4. Austria-Hungary wasn't formed until 1867. 5. The flag of the Maldives on the signup list is the one used from 1965. It should be the one I use for PMIV. 6. The Philippines had no flag under the Spainish. The one on the page wasn't designed until the Spainish-American War. 7. I'm pretty sure the flag of Burma wasn't the one on there. 8. Same goes for Thailand. 9. Russia's border is too far south. 10. Egypt, Tunis, and Algiers were all de facto independent and should be playable. (Actually, if I had the time, I probably would have chosen Egypt). 11. Assuming no more states are admitted, the US flag should have 19 stars. 12. Burma only had de facto control of the darker turquoise areas here, the light being vassals. 13. The Ottomans didn't rule the Arabian peninsula, only the western fringe. The rest was Kuwait (Otto vassal), Bahrain (which also included Qatar, I think), the Trucial States, the Emirate of Jabal Shammar and the Emirate of Nejd/Second Saudi State. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 05:14, October 24, 2016 (UTC)

Odissa Road
I think your plan looks great. Way more detailed than anything I thought off. I'm thinking we can each put in 1/3 of the capitol, and construction will take 5 years or so. Now that LM's agreed, we can start building it. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 22:35, November 5, 2016 (UTC)

And I presume that unlike Burma, the Himalayas will not be magically impassable to him. Nonetheless, we should be capable of defeating a youngblood steppe warlord. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 18:40, November 6, 2016 (UTC)

Also, is there a time when you could come on chat? I want to talk about a few things for the next decade or so. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 18:41, November 6, 2016 (UTC)

Just a reminder: I do have a (Burmese) GG at my disposal. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 20:34, November 6, 2016 (UTC)

Also, I'm thinking of starting a (little) war w/the Majas over the weekend, so Bengal can grab the neutral zone, and we can finally kick the Gunturists out of India once and for all. (As part of my promises to Scraw for the GG, though, we can't take any land). I'll manufacture a suitable casus belli. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 21:46, November 8, 2016 (UTC)

The Khans
The mods have signaled the return of the Khan. Prepare yourself, for he will have pegasi in his army that will enable him to cross the Himalayas with no trouble at all.       11:23, November 9, 2016 (UTC)

I would suggest pulling your main army back towards Delhi so it can link up with LM and my troops, as well as my GG. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 15:34, November 9, 2016 (UTC)

Since the Gurkanis are your ally, you could also call them, if necessary. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 16:27, November 9, 2016 (UTC)

I'm worried Tsetseg's gonna delay us on Majapahit so long that my GG will die, making everything a lot harder. Now, according to LM, we don't have to send that many troops: only 60k or so, though I would bring 100k just to be sure. You can just send a handful, letting LM and I handle it, while the Gurkanis can help you out if Tsetseg gets a magic army from somewhere. (Though really, you should be able to handle him on your own. You have more than enough men.) What do you think? The Guardian of Forever (talk) 03:49, November 11, 2016 (UTC)

Maybe we should just invade and wreck the Tsetseg Khanate, a preemptive strike? The Guardian of Forever (talk) 04:55, November 12, 2016 (UTC)

Well, it seems Tsetseg's raids are over for now. I'll send troops (including my GG) to help you crush the Rajputs, and sometime next week we can commence the war against Majapahit. (According to LM's calculations, we won't even need that big of an army contrib from you, anyway). The Guardian of Forever (talk) 22:27, November 12, 2016 (UTC)

Re:The HRE Plan
Oh,I wasn't aware that the French Revolution happened.I was under the impression that because the American Revolution never happened neither did the French one.As a side note,how about the HRE exists but the emperor has no power except in their home state.Basically,it exists for the sake of tradition.Also without the Final Diet,a lot of smaller states would still exist. ReclaimLandThatIsMine (talk) 22:33, November 10, 2016 (UTC)

Khans
If you have the time, meet me on chat. I'll explain to you why I think its better for me to support the Khans over you and the Indians

I know the feeling, Orange. If you do choose to 'ragequit' (which I would totally understand), I'd just ask as a last favor: leave Delhi on a (relatively) stable footing. (But before that, could you commit your navy and some tiny token number of men to one last war against the Majapahit?) Nonetheless, myself and LM will do everything we can to defeat Tsetseg's army. Also, have you asked Rimp on chat? I had a similar experiance in the 1430's, but we were able to work out or differences on chat. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:31, November 16, 2016 (UTC)

Sometimes, PMIV can feel more of a chore than a game. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 02:36, November 16, 2016 (UTC)

Orange, I would suggest looking at Rimp's post for this year. It might intrest you. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 23:01, November 16, 2016 (UTC)

I would suggest "accepting" Tsetseg's offer, and then inviting him to the palace for a nice cup of tea-just make sure you don't put in any of the 'wrong leaves.' The Guardian of Forever (talk) 23:39, November 16, 2016 (UTC)

We should be able to kill Tsetseg and get some good tech off of it, but still: maybe just poisoning him would have worked??? Also, you should ask Rimp for some support-Tsetseg's a GG, and I dunno if mine will arrive in time to counter him. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 03:15, November 17, 2016 (UTC)

Majapahit II
I pray thee, please do declarest war on Majapahit. It shall be amusing.       16:54, November 15, 2016 (UTC)

Just send your navy and some token number of troops. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 20:17, November 15, 2016 (UTC)

There's no need to send such a huge number of troops to Majapahit: just 2,000 and your little navy. We only need 60k total to get an overwhelmening victory w/my GG. Use your army to destroy Tsetseg. The Guardian of Forever (talk) 23:28, November 16, 2016 (UTC)

Chat
If you or Guardian could possibly meet me on chat, I would appreciate it.