Alternative History talk:TSPTF

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This has to stop
There an issue I feel I have to bring to your attention which I think is a big problem on this wiki. The problem in question is bullying.

A number of people on this wiki are subject of insults, curses and bullying. I admit, I occasionally throw in one or two, but it's unacceptable. One of the main victims involved is a certain Octivian Marius. This started with simple jabs at his poor grammar, but soon led to an entire script and story, "Revolution: The Movie", in which a rebellious renegade by the name of "Mocktavian Sorryass" (really? It's not very subtle...) attempts to take down the mighty power of the TSPTF with his trusty gang of "rebles". I'm sure you're all familiar with the story. But this all stemmed from a harmless blog post in which he unfortunately spelled a couple of words incorrectly. After the creation of this character he was mocked relentlessly, and no one took him seriously any more. He now frequently gets greeted on chat as 'Octard', despite his repeated requests not to be called that. You might all think it was in good nature, but I know what it's like, it starts of as a few funny jokes but it builds up and up and you can't take it. I know I can't tell what's going on inside his head but I can guess. I mean, what did the guy ever do to you, other than his poor grammar and spelling, ridiculous ideas, terrifyingly ASB map game nations... nevermind.

Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that this is not acceptable. We can't have this on a supposedly respectable establishment. This has to stop. I know I shouldn't really have a say in it, and that's why I came to you guys, the only people with the power to do something. I hope you heed my words and think of a solution.

Yours sincerely, - FP(problem?) 15:47, May 20, 2014 (UTC)

I think you are painting Oct as too much of a victim here. He has been targeted, but has also targeted others. Those of us that go on chat, including Oct, have to stop this. I include myself in this. I'm not claiming to be blameless, just that we must stop insulting each other, and bullying members of this wiki. Local Mafia Boss (Talk) (Blog)

Ok, maybe I did add in a bit of drama, and yeah I agree, we all just bicker a lot and occasionally it goes too far. (Of what I've seen) Chat mods don't do a thing, they're busy kicking people for squirrels. They need to get their priorities straight. - FP(problem?) 17:49, May 20, 2014 (UTC)

Agreed.

I agree with the squirrel part.



20:56, May 20, 2014 (UTC)

Vandal
http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Sir_Mark_Granger_(Washington_Shot_at_Murdering_Town!)

Someone block home please ❂ FOR THE REPUBLIC OF CHINA ❂ 14:48, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Really Ratc!?!


At this point, I really do not know what we should do. Here Ratc is confessing to another sockpuppet account. All of the people on chat at the time can attest to his presence, and TOB deserves the credit for making Ratc confess. 20:46, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

After observing parts of the convo which I was not really involved in, I can tell you that he meets a large number of features Ratc has previously shown - obsession for future history, video games, Deus Ex, etc. 20:48, May 21, 2014 (UTC)



More... ~Rex
 * Another traite is heavy profanity.Whipsnade (talk) 16:55, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

Banned from chat for eternity. Bfoxius (talk)

Guys please. Let me explain!!!TerraFutura01 (talk) 20:54, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

You were banned and you must accept it. I sorry Ratc. It's for the wikis good. ❂ FOR THE REPUBLIC OF CHINA ❂ 21:02, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Rat is like a ghost. I don't think we can block him IP for forever, but we could do our best to get him away. ❂ FOR THE REPUBLIC OF CHINA ❂ 20:58, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

You were banned and you must accept it. I sorry Ratc. It's for the wikis good. ❂ FOR THE REPUBLIC OF CHINA ❂ 21:02, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Guys, please. I have been waiting a fucking goddamn month. Ok? Now can you please just stop this bullshit already. I already have problems with my parents and I dont want anymore with you guys. And remember I mentioned I needed a new PC? Well, its true. Also, I am simply feeling,bullied and unwelcome wherever I go here. And besides, I am not the same rat you guys know and love to hate ok. I just in other words, dont want to wait anymore.TerraFutura01 (talk) 21:14, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

The great Scraw says this is sockpuppetry. If you had attempted to reveal yourself beforehand, I think it might have been allowed. But this is hiding/lying/cheating/whatever you want to call it.

22:00, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

I'm kinda surprised he hasn't attacked BFE:W yet.

Also, it's sockpuppetry regardless. Rat, three more and it's a felony, and we get to contact SWAT.

22:20, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

I'm telling Wikia about the new socks.Whipsnade (talk) 14:43, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Could care less what "problems" - not that I think they are real for a second - you have. And a month into something that is forever? Pssh.

Scraw, even if he had revealed himself, would be the same block. Sockpuppeting is permanent banishment.

Lordganon (talk) 16:10, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc has returned once again, under the name "Ur-Quan01". Mscoree (talk) 20:59, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

He was not being silly or profane, so was it necessary to ban him. He may have changed and got help with is asperger's. give him a chance to prove him self.Whipsnade (talk) 14:36, May 23, 2014 (UTC)

Um whip, that isn't a good excuse. I have Asperger's part of the Autism Spectrum and I haven't done anything that would warrant a ban. No offense but that sounds like a cop out. I still don't have help with mine and I am functioning just fine, I may get irrationally angry at time,but otherwise just fine. I'm sorry whip but I disagree and say Ratc should still be banned.ALLONS-Y!!,Basically, RUN!! 16:54, May 23, 2014 (UTC)

I understand. I am new to all the Autisum/Autstic/Asperge's stuff. I had childhood ADHD, but it is mostly gon now. Thank you for your advice on Autisum/Autstic/Asperge's stuff. It is noted and will be concidered.Whipsnade (talk) 16:55, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

I told Wikia and they globally blocked the Ratc socks Global conquer and Terminal warrior, along with that Q-uarn guy. They did not block that Kansas IP 172.56.4.150 or that S. Carolina IP 172.56.4.72. I think they think the IPs are not Ratc.Whipsnade (talk) 16:55, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

TSPTF talk page
On a separate note, archived TSPTF talk page after 100+ subsections made it hard to get to the page's bottom. 23:26, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Are you foreign to the "end" key on your keyboard? Or perhaps the other keys and shortcuts that take you directly to the top/bottom of a page?

23:29, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

Scraw, be nice. I don't have an "end" key on my keyboard. I just go to the contents.

But isn't there some bug with Wikia where if you don't archive the page after a bunch of subsections the whole thing disappears? We had that problem with PM2, not long before the GCC...

23:30, May 21, 2014 (UTC)

As I stated, Guns, I archived the TSPTF talk page. 02:09, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Not even remotely your place to do that, Rex.

"End" is normally a shift or "fn" key and then pressing a number from the numberpad.

Lordganon (talk) 16:11, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Vandal
124.124.4.218, as evidenced by: this edit log. I have undone the damage, but would like to let the admin know. 05:52, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Blocked. Lordganon (talk) 16:12, May 22, 2014 (UTC)

Juuh Okei
There is another vandal, 80.220.169.157. He's replacing content of pages with "juuh okei". Mscoree (talk) 19:22, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

He deleted your user page Mscoree Sky Green 24 19:24, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

I have undone all his acts of vandalism, but he continues to redo it. Mscoree (talk) 19:25, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

Possibly another vandal/troll: 85.76.146.228. Appears to be making nonsensical pages. Mscoree (talk) 19:39, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

Possibly the same person, both IPs are in Finland. Sky Green 24 19:46, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

So just to fill everyone in. These two IPs vandalized for some time, before the database went down (not sure if related) and remained down for about ten hours. Glad it's back up now, and it looks like staff has helped a bit. Mscoree (talk) 13:31, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, the one seems to have been more than just here - wikia actually blocked all edits to the wiki, among others, for a while. Their bots later removed the spam pages.

As for the other one, the location is probably meaningless - seems to just be an angry person.

Lordganon (talk) 15:02, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc, again
GlobalConqueror is another Ratc sockpuppet, I checked his IP it is in Puerto Rico.

Sky Green 24 19:31, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

Guys, hello. It's me. Yes, yes I know, it was me the entire time but I really have improved. I don't know what else you guys want from me. LG, honestly I don't know what else to say other than the fact that I ask you this one last thing:Will you and the rest of the TSPTF ever forgive me?GlobalConqueror (talk) 19:42, May 25, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc, nope, you are banned for a millenium. Quit making sockpuppets. Bfoxius (talk)

Once again Ratc has returned, under the name Terminator Warrior this time.

Mscoree (talk) 15:48, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

I propose we make an "Implied Consent" rule. If a new user is acting really suspicious, then admins have the right to ask them to preform a manual IP check. Refusing will be like refusing a breathalyzer test and shall result in further investigation. Tr0llis (talk) 16:00, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Guys please, I am telling you:STOP BLOCKING ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please?!TerminatorWarrior (talk) 15:58, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

No. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 16:49, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

What part of permanent do you not understand? Lordganon (talk) 15:00, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

I told Wikia and they globally blocked them and that Q-uarn guy.Whipsnade (talk) 15:50, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

I told Wikia and they globally blocked the Ratc socks Global conquer and Terminal warrior, along with that Q-uarn guy. They did not block that Kansas IP 172.56.4.150 or that S. Carolina IP 172.56.4.72. I think they think the IPs are not Ratc.Whipsnade (talk) 16:57, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

Expected of them. Any Ratc IP would be located in Puerto Rico Sky Green 24 17:08, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

Spartian300 Sockpuppeting
I had a map game called Look Out, Sir! Revised, which is now defunct. But, besides that, a man signed up to play the USA, by the name of 'Eastest566'. He posted a couple of turns and disappeared, removing his name. A day or two after that Spartian posted this on the talk page: Link. I thought I would just bring this to your attention. Thanks. Blocky858 (talk) 16:04, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Taken care of CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 16:50, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Whoa whoa wait. Wasn't this already brought the TSPTF like a month ago and they determined he wasn't a sockpuppet? Tr0llis (talk) 16:52, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Crim this was already reported to the TSPTF (see Archive Three), at which point it was determined that when Spartian made that confession he didn't even know what sockpuppeting meant. You should probably look into the matter before  banning him. Mscoree (talk) 16:55, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

And this is why doing this from a mobile device is a bad idea. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 17:04, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Okay fair enough. All I'm saying is it warrants further investigation first, since he was tried for this crime previously and found innocent. Mscoree (talk) 17:07, May 26, 2014 (UTC)

Crim, you're still here?

04:48, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

It's hard to let go (inb4 frozen reference) CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:13, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

I think this is irrelevent. Spartian300 (talk) 17:01, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

BridgittLaura
This one is suddenly appeared last two days and making extensive editing in on America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire TL. Then, user AmericaLoove also suddenly missed and not even disturbed BridgittLaura's editings.

BridgittLaura has a very bad grammar, has not a best ability to write, speak, or understands English, and has a similar fond for Bella Thorne, all of characteristics that almost like AmericaLoove. She(?) also did a copyright infringement for blatanly copying my Italy (Cherry, Plum, and Chrysanthemum) page for her Italy (America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire) page.

Lately, she stupidly asked on the forum discussion for being appointed as an admin of wiki. (http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:148709#3)

FirstStooge (talk) 11:44, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

I noticed the other day in chat both these users came on and were conversing in a similar manner. It was the first time I had seen either of them in chat, and after they were both on they both left. I'm not sure if that helps, but that's what I witnessed so far. Mscoree (talk) 14:09, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

Seems less "there" than AL, to me. Blocked for spam for three days.

FS, using another article as a base in some form like that is not an infringement. They may have failed at it, but that was surely the attempt.

Lordganon (talk) 15:06, May 27, 2014 (UTC)

May i be an admin? Spartian300 (talk) 17:02, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

Spartian, on this wiki you cannot get a promotion simply by asking. Please read the rules on the TSPTF page on how to apply. Asking for a promotion won't help. Mscoree (talk) 17:47, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

It was more or less a joke. Spartian300 (talk) 22:41, May 28, 2014 (UTC)



Today in chat the user  BridgittLaura admitted that he/she is also  AmericaLoove. Can an administrator please deal with this accordingly? Mscoree (talk) 01:15, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Not sure what the best course of action would be in this scenario. Based on what she said before she was promtly removed from chat, she seemed to have made the two accounts in case she cursed on one of them. Given that she openly admitted to having a sockpuppet and it was a "backup," so to speak, I shall ban for a month each until further admin consensus.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 01:27, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Isn't sockpuppeting a permaban though? Why do we keep (attempting) making exceptions? Tr0llis (talk) 01:32, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Because exceptions have been made in the past to those who have admitted using sockpuppets before for reasons other than cheating the system. Also, because this is my first blocking of an account (two, actually) and I don't want to overdo it my first time.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 01:33, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

Actually, no.

Sockpuppeting is not always a permabannable offense, even according to wikia, who, following from that, will only conduct IP checks if it can be shown that the person in question used it to their advantage- Owen, Rat, etc, who used it to get around a ban, or others who used it in map games or votes, etc, to get their way.

The the case of "backups", generally, only the backup is banned, as was shown in the case when Enc made a backup- "EnterpriseCaptain", I believe it was called.

In conclusion, sockpuppeting isn't always a permabannable offense- however, because of the reasons that people make them, they generally are.

For another example, it's perfectly legal to use different accounts for different wikis.

20:12, June 5, 2014 (UTC)

What wikia says is irrelevant. They do not set policies for member wikis, beyond their little restrictions on checks.

Sockpuppeting is permanent, barring accounts being made to try and go around blocks for other offenses (in which case, the second account blocked forever and the other one has the block extended)

With Enc, his original intent was to change accounts. He did not, however, decide to do so in the end. That alone means the second one, as has been the case with such an event with past users, means it gets permanently blocked. That he mused about it being a backup is irrelevant.

That being said, not sure about this one. Both accounts are active, so it is not a question of a backup. Not trying to cheat or anything, either. Yet, we have that confession (note - would not have meant much without the note saying what happened afterwards) and their behavior generally being similar.

So, permaban in order, though with less justification than usual.

Lordganon (talk) 08:29, June 7, 2014 (UTC)


 * Just letting you all know that Josiah.cervo/AmericaLoove appears to have returned. This time as CasoNuevos. I went ahead and permanently blocked this account. -- 05:32, June 29, 2014 (UTC)

BridgittLaura has arrived again, this time with the name LauraBridgitMendez. She begin's making similar edits and both have same personal information as BridgittLaura did. This is as well completely multiple accounts and Lordganon, feel free to permanently block this account.

Eric von Schweetz, You Young and Sweet Boy!

We Should move this discussion to The Section bridgitLauras's Sockpuppet at the Bottom of the page.Likercat (talk) 10:41, July 8, 2014 (UTC)

MattyMG13
I've recently got a message from this user here. Apparently, Yankovic270 and some others on chat went to jump the gun thinking he was Ratc and thus led him to be banned from chat. Me, thinking he was actually a Ratc sockpuppet (seeing as Yank banned him), I went to ban him for 1000 Years.

However with that message he really doesn't seem to be Ratc at all. What should I do? Should I unban him? What do you all think? -Seiga  2014 May 29, 00:28 (CET)

We need actual evidence to confirm if he is Ratc or not. Lately people have been harassing every new user in chat and I don't think that is a good policy. Innocent until proven guilty, not witch hunts on chat. I would propose an IP check normally, but this user seems distinctly not Ratc. Usually when we catch Ratc we at least have evidence (such as a manual IP check), but here it looks like Yank just shot first and asked questions later. For now I'd say unban him until we have some sort of actual evidence. Mscoree (talk) 22:42, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

From now on, i suggest that we should greet each new user, and make sure that we know who they are. Spartian300 (talk) 22:45, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

Why'd Yank ban him in the first place?

I say unban him, but run an IP check just to be safe.

22:52, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

Not a fan of the new harassment policy. Tr0llis (talk) 22:55, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

Matty is actually a user on several other wikis. And he can spell and use English properly, something that Ratc could never seem to manage. Cour *talk* 23:31, May 28, 2014 (UTC)

According to the general concensus he is not Ratc, thus I have unblocked him. It is ok Seiga, accidents happen. Hope the issue is closed. Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:09, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

Ninjasvswarriors
The user Ninjawarrior has confessed to being a sockpuppet.



I believe this confirms my earlier appeal here. Mscoree (talk) 00:41, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

Right so, Ninjas told me his IP;

114.43.147.247.

He wants the TSPTF to know that he has been only using this account ever since his ban (Don't ask me about the details, that's the message I got on the talk page)

He also wants to tell that Flyingninjapanda is an older sockpuppet

Now I don't know how he behaved as Alexlee, but he seems to have improved his ability to control his sinocentrism (if I recall correctly, that was one of his identifiable traits) and his English. Of course I do agree that he should be blocked for creating sockpuppets, but maybe, just maybe, not permanently blocked.

That would be all, sincerely, Sky Green 24 13:44, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

His behaviour has greatly improved if this is the case and is actually not a bad guy to talk to. I think him admitting it but not continuing to use them for his own gain for any reason should disqualify a ban. Hes really a pretty nice guy all around and i have no personal issue to the fact hes openly admiting he has used the before and personally told me he felt bad about it. I think the fact he hasnt used them since the fact is a good sign his behaviour has since changed for the better which is what we should be advocating on this site.

The precedent for something like this would be the blocking of all sockpuppet accounts along with a month-long ban (or two) to get the message across of not sockpuppeting. I agree he has improved, but letting him off the hook so easy would set a bad example. I am in favour of a month-long ban for Ninja. Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:05, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

He though has confessed, so though I still believe in a ban, I believe it should be shortened slightly. ~Bfox

I would think 1 month would be a reasonable length of time, although perhaps I could look to block him for two weeks. What is the general concensus? Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:11, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

I hope that Ninja isn't permanently banned, but considering that this is supposed to be an automatic permanent ban, I fear that Lordganon will simply go that route. After all he won best ban last year, and basically circumvented a ban for a year or so. I wish of the best of luck Ninja. Tr0llis (talk) 23:13, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

You realize if we do this Ratc could use this against us? I don't want ninja berma banned, but thought it was important to bring up. Saturn (Talk) 23:32, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

Did wikia have to destroy a whole bunch of usernames all linked with Ninja? Imp (Say Hi?!) 23:55, May 29, 2014 (UTC)

Saturn, you can't compare Ninja and Ratc. Ninja got his act together and improved his behaivor. Ratc is still immature and isn't trying to change. Two wrongs may not make a right, '' but it makes me feel a lot better in the end! '' 00:11, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

Like i said his improvement is obvious and hes been the source of many a good times and laughs on chat and has not been seen with sockpuppets since i believe. I Believe that a short 2 week ban would suffice since i dont believe he can get out of this in any way shape or form. Im not TSPTF so its not up to me but 2 weeks definitely seems reasonable.

I am OK with a 2 week-1 month ban, but please give me prior notice. I have to ask someone to post for me in PMIII. Thank you. Ninjasvswarriors (talk)

^This alone only proves that he's changed. I say no ban at all given that Ninja has proven that he can change, while Ratc has proven that he cannot, given that he has already gone through four, I believe five sockpuppets now? Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 05:37, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

If Ninja receives a chance, rat should receive one in 6 months or something if he doesn't do more socks to see if he has changed. OCT MARIUS, HAIL HIM

Please don't perma ban me to stop Ratc from coming back to the wiki. Ninjasvswarriors (talk)

Let us not forget you had a chance to come clean a year ago, but neglected to do so. --NFSreloaded (talk)

I woul12:33, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

I would really recommend not to ban Ninjasvswarriors. He loves this wiki, and he give great contributions here at Althistory and I am a friend of him in real life and he is an expert in history and makes great recommendations. In fact, he constantly recommends his classmates (Captainjohnrex, Pacific Communist, and theMarxist) not to commit acts of ASBness and also has forced theMarxist not to vandalize LG and Seiga Miyako's page many times.)

Rcchang (talk) 13:28, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

I'm sorry NFS, but I didn't saw that a year ago. I'm really sorry. Ninjasvswarriors (talk)

1 month then? Imp (Say Hi?!) 15:13, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

How about 3 weeks? Bfoxius (talk)

I really don't see a reason to ban him. Him getting a chance a year ago and him getting one today are two entirely different things. It is entire unfair to ban something simply because they got a chance a year ago to change. A lot changes in a year, and if we follow the logic of some of the users here to punish someone for an action in the distant past, none of you would be here. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 22:37, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

2 weeks I think is good.

23:15, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

For the record, Ninja, if someone posts for you while you're banned, that's an automatic ban extension for you and a possible ban or warning for them.

24.90.246.100 23:46, May 30, 2014 (UTC)

You meaning someone posting for me in PMIII while I'm banned? Ninjasvswarriors (talk)

the rule is that if someone is banned, they can not have someone else post for them,however suddenly invading because you have been banned is considered meta and your nation will most likly be preserved, look at MS's Austria. Two wrongs may not make a right, '' but it makes me feel a lot better in the end! '' 03:38, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

I'd like to weigh in and say that Ninja has definitely improved and is actually a pretty decent editor. That being said, sockpuppeting is a permabannable offense. I think it's important to remember that, while we really don't want to ban him, rules are rules. That being said, I will not be the one to drop the banhammer. Actually, I'd like to commend him for making it this long with out getting caught. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 06:19, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

Punishment is clear - and there is only one. Permanent block to account.

Much better behaved now though. Shame he didn't have the sense to not confess.

As for that posting bit, posting for someone who is blocked is at a minimum a warning. Depends on person and context.

Lordganon (talk) 06:54, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

I don't think it should be considered sockpuppeting. He made the account after he stopped (was forced to stop) using the Ninjavswarriors account. Aind LG, Ninjas is quite a popular and great guy, and he always has great behavior and also has several great timelines and map games, it would be a shame to block him. Would you be able to make an exception? He has matured a lot since his sockpuppetting days.

Rcchang (talk) 07:05, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

Hello People of Althistory Wiki:

Ninjavswarriors has been notified that he has been permabaned. Therefore he has given a final speech about what he will do in the future, which is posted on the Map Game wiki. He will continue to contribute there.

http://mapgame.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Ninjasvswarriors/Permaban

Please read it, and I wish him best of luck.

Rcchang (talk)

Sigh...

You get permanently blocked for something, then any other account you make gets the same punishment. It's called trying to get around a block.

Could care less about his behavior or popularity.

Lordganon (talk) 08:38, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

* sobbing*

I just felt so bad for Ninja. :(

FirstStooge (talk) 10:32, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

Stuff
Six Kingdoms of New England is just an imitation of A Song of Ice and Fire (Game of Thrones). Should it be deleted? I think it counts as derivative work.

02:38, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Even though it is very similar, the setting and houses are different, leading me to believe it should stay. Bfoxius (talk)

The only thing really similar is the concept. It has completely different content so I think it's fine. Mscoree (talk) 17:31, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

No, it's more or less the same story with OTL people and places.

People of the Dawn - Children of the Forest

Yankees - Andals/First Men

Colonisation - Andal landings

John of House Adams - Aegon I of House Targaryen

Succession of House Lodge - Dance of the Dragon or Blackfyre dispute

Green Rebellion - Robert's Rebellion

Brahmin Uprising - Greyjoy Rebellion

Scrimshaw Throne - Iron Throne

Castle Rock - Casterly Rock

Williams' Landing - King's Landing

Foxwoods - Lannisters

Green Mountain people - Northmen

Downeast - Dorne

17:43, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Who cares. You could say that about basically anything on this site. PM3: Spain = Spain, France = France, Albion = England, etc. Tr0llis (talk) 17:51, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

That's based on real life. This is based on fiction. We have rules about that.

18:25, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Exactly. Marked for deletion. Lordganon (talk) 02:56, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

Wiki Chat
As many of you know, I spend more time on the wiki chat than I should. The chat effectively is a form of "frontier justice", where the chat mods hold all the power and use it as they please because they are respected amongst the community. However, many of the mods (myself included) have been neglecting their responsiblities and instead "joke-kicking" people from chat frequently. Since many of the more respected members of the community (LG, NukeVac) don't go on the chat, most of the active chat mods are Constables and some LTs. The TSPTF page was created before the chat was put into place on this wiki, and thus I don't believe it's updated for it. Therefore I propose that either we put a "chat patroller" section in the "duties" section of the TSPTF page, for TSPTF members who want to be active chat mods (because I know there are TSPTF members that don't like to use their chat mod status, and there are some that use it more often). Another suggestion I have is that we put into place a system of guidelines for when chat mods should kick/ban, as we all have our own personal policies, and I've personally seen trolls exploit them on chat. Any thoughts? Bfoxius (talk)

Sounds like a good idea, as the job of patrolling the chat is already an unofficial responsibility anyway. Hopefully this cuts back on the squirrel problems and other nonsensical aspects of chat culture. Mscoree (talk) 17:34, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Chat is supposed to be the place where we do everything and nothing.

17:38, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Nope. Nope.

You're actually just illegalizing squirrels. That's it. The joke-kicks will continue, the language and irreverence will continue, the chadmins won't change, but you'll make squirrels illegal.

Besides, the point of chat is to be an irreverent idea-generator. Every map game and a sizable amount of proper TL work is hammered out on chat; most of the ideas from community TLs, for instance (DD included; Feddy, Impo, and I have had many a fruitful conversation there on the future of various nations). The only things that shouldn't be allowed there are spam and other such unacceptable activity.

This is the wiki version of SOPA and PIPA.

Forth the Squirrevolution!

20:43, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

I support the Squirrels. I'm forming the Squirrel Party. Our mascot shall be a squirrel. Cour *talk* 23:45, June 1, 2014 (UTC)

Dammit, Cour. Dammit. I start the Squirrevolution, I fight alone against invincible odds, I suffer, and now, as we begin to force the Chadmins to allow squirrels, you come in and claim credit?

Nah, I'm joking.

Call it the Squirrevolution, though.

00:10, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

Guideline may not be the worst idea.

However...

Really, a lot of the problem is the chat mods either not blocking inappropriate behavior, or even worse, only using blocks for a quick moment to get their attention. That needs to stop. The number of them that I see immediately revoked after being blocked is just wrong.

Lordganon (talk) 03:02, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

Guns, I think you are missing my point. I'm by no means trying to restrict what you say, just restrict the chat mods a bit and put forth a guideline so we don't have mods kicking/banning for different things. Bfoxius (talk)

Edboy
It recently seems, that on chat, a topic about Edboy popped up. We were talking about Ratc, and about his stocks when we realized that he should've been unbanned on the wiki by now. Now if you look Here It was shows that he was a "Ratc Stockpuppet". Whereas here it says. That he wasn't a Ratc stock. I'm testifying this because I feel that he was wrongly banned, and should be unblocked. He was given a 3 month ban, and was originally supposed to be unblocked sometime ago (I guess). Saturn (Talk) 00:39, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

3 month ban means that at the end of three months, he automatically comes back.

However, when he left, he announced that he would NOT be coming back.

00:45, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

...Did you even read why he got the block extended beyond the original month he received for being offensive, insulting, and the like?

He made an account to get around it, and continue to insult us. So, it got extended.

Simple.

Lordganon (talk) 02:52, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

What Saturn is trying to say is that Ed isn't Midwest or Ratc. It was confirmed by Wikia that Ratc = Midwest (see wall of shame or last archive). It was then confirmed that Ed =/= Ratc, therefore that user who vandalized was not Ed. You extended his ban anyway because of that but it was confirmed to be false. Tr0llis (talk) 10:45, June 2, 2014 (UTC)

May want to, you know, read those archives. Nothing like that was said about Ed and MWC. Only thing said about that was that he denied it. But the evidence is extremely clear. Ed uploads an image as part of an offensive tirade, and gets blocked, with the image deleted almost immediately. Minutes later, MWC uploads the same image.

They are the same individual. Simple.

End.

Lordganon (talk) 02:39, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Why is this even an issue? He basically committed wikicide after leaving his retirement notice. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:13, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Couldn't Midwest just download the image after Ed posted it and reupload it as spam? Also Wikia did an IP check of them and confirmed that Ratc was a certain number of sockpuppets. Ed was not included in that. Tr0llis (talk) 10:39, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Time-wise, and being realistic, no.

Rat is irrelevant when it comes to Ed's block.

Lordganon (talk) 12:04, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

AnnihilationOfWorlds
So I don't mean to jump on the witch hunt train, but there are some very similar aspects between Ratc333 and AnnihilationOfWorlds. They have very similar intrests and when asked questions about things like location or something along the lines, he is very dodgy. Now I was going to wait and see how he posted in map game, but I know Saturn and Sine both agree with my theory. Could an IP Check be requested? Two wrongs may not make a right, '' but it makes me feel a lot better in the end! '' 02:03, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I second this Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk) 04:17, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

We talked about this. I've seen how Ratc communicates and I've seen how AOW communicates. They're two totally different people. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:50, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I'm just paranoid that there is another rat stock, and there's nothing else to do. From now on I will stop witch hunting Ratc and his friggin puppets only if I have proof. Saturn (Talk) 05:53, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I just have a hunch he's someone's sockpuppet. Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk) 06:08, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

True. He has similar interests as Ratc, and has seemed using frequent terms Ratc has. Only if i have further proof I will continue on this. Saturn (Talk) 06:15, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Same here. Further more he just asked me if i liked games about civilizations (Which i do to some extent) and that if i wanted to start one which kinda leads into the fact that ratc's previous sockpuppet had been pushing me to restart the CTD in the mapgame wiki and also the fact that he also tended to go on the Interstellar themes Ratc did. although this time in a more civilized and less implausible manner. Anyway that's what causes my doubts about if he's or not Ratc's new sockpuppet. Sine dei gloriem &#34;Ex Initio Terrae&#34; (talk) 21:46, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Actually I talked to him on chat and his grammar has improved. He has joined a few map games, and was quite plausible. Maybe observe for a while before jumping to conclusions? Rcchang (talk) 23:33, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Paranoia
I'm getting pretty upset at the number of people falsely accusing others of being trolls or Ratc sockpuppets. We're not only scaring off potentially valuable editors, but we're also making fools of ourselves. People, especially those in the TSPTF, need to be capable of making a confident decision when it comes to big matters, and accusing someone of sockpuppetry is a big matter.

In the future, gather information. Be sure that the person being accused of sockpuppetry is guilty. I'm going to start sending out warnings to people who play the sockpuppetry card without investigating. It's getting ridiculous. Slander is bad, kids.

CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:47, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I agree. There are already multiple cases of this.

Rcchang (talk) 05:32, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

Plagiarizing?
I was looking around the wiki for something to do and I've seen dramatic writing styles in the America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire timeline. I'm starting to wonder if this is plagiarizing, as Scrooge once saw that the Italy page had been copied to this page. Saturn (Talk) 14:08, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Last year something was reported here for being directly plagarized from Wikipedia and Lordganon said it was fine. Therefore I believe it's allowed. Mscoree (talk) 14:37, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia is alright because they freely state that anything on that site can be used elsewhere without need of citation.

21:36, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

...What I said was that it was fine so long as it was not excessive.

That timeline, imo, needs a lot of rewriting.

Took the content on the Italy pages off of the one that copied it from the other.

Guns is correct.

Lordganon (talk) 12:11, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

Britdgitlaura reverted the info LG removed from the Italy Page. She also stole some parts from This Other page on the wiki as well as some from this page. Saturn (Talk) 15:03, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

Guns sockpuppets
Ok, so I just overheard Guns admitting that Scraw and Crim are sockpuppets. All belonging to guns, saying he used the trick of keeping 2 browsers open. Now can somebody please ban those two if it's true? Or are they just joking?AnnihilationOfWorlds (talk) 22:42, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

He is screwing with you. No sockpuppets there.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 22:47, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Actually, I said three; Chrome, Safari, and Firefox.

Just being factual.

22:49, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Old joke.

22:53, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Lol!

Ok, and I'll come out with my reason for screwing with Anni.

Yes, it was hilarious, but on top of that, how would this brand new user know Scraw and Crim so well? I'm just saying, he appears both here and on chat to be extremely well informed about the wiki.

23:33, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

And he only has 4 edits... Saturn (Talk) 23:36, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

I'm not saying he is Ratc, and I personally think we're close to reaching witch hunt levels with that. Owen part two, anyone?

But regardless of that, at this point I think there is a reasonable threat.

23:38, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

So you tricked a new user into reporting you so that you could use it as evidence against him in some sort of sockpuppet trial. If he actually was well informed on the wiki he would know that you can't be trusted at all, and would know that Crim and Scraw are completely different people. Are we seriously going to harass/troll him too? Tr0llis (talk) 23:40, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

No, it was guns idea not mine to prank him. I just commented on what he said. Saturn (Talk) 23:45, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

False, Tr0ll. Seeing that he acted in such a familiar way with the wiki, I decided to see how he would react to such a joke. Someone new would have believed other members of chat when they reassured him it was a joke (and the members of chat present there can testify that it was done in a very joking way, and that several other members did state that it was a joke). Someone old would have realized that I'm not to be trusted at all.

Rat, however, would see this as a perfect opportunity to get some form of revenge.

23:47, June 3, 2014 (UTC)

Actually, he has 23 edits on the map game wiki.

Permaban
Ninjas wanted to ask you guys is there anyway a permaban can be lifted or does he has to pass it as a family heirloom? He says he will do whatever he can, as long as it doesn't involve fighting wild animals, breaking into the Pentagon or taking over the known world.

Ahh, damn, whaddya know. The way to be forgiven involves breaking into the Pentagon. Too bad.

01:41, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

No, Nada, Zip, Nothing, etc. Lordganon (talk) 12:12, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

I've Been Thinking...
Hello, TSPTF and active members of the Wiki Community,

First, I'd like to thank you for your time. Second, I would like to bring up an important issue that I've been thinking about over the past two weeks - my ban.

So, as an overview of what took place, I was banned for 2 weeks because I had uploaded (over the course of over 1 year) 3 duplicate images. Nuke, the Lt. who banned me, also pointed to the fact that I delete one of his warnings, which, while true, was viewed out of context since I deleted 3/4 of my talk page with the warning and had not been told to keep the warning on my talk page.

To see the entirety of the problem (at least from my perspective), please see here: LG's talk page on another wiki.

The key facts are, though, that I was banned for 2 weeks (the same amount of time I was banned for harshly insulting and berating the faith of a fellow Wikian, FS) for 0.036% of all of my edits being bad, or 0.78% of my file edits. Additionally, while I have my issues, I have been active in reporting vandals, Ratc's return(s), and working on categorizing.

So, here is why I come before you today - not to cry out about the ban I have already dealt with, but rather to make a proposal to prevent this from taking place again. Now, I feel that some users, esp. those with over 2,500 edits, should have to be banned with the consent of the whole TSPTF unless in the case of vandalism, sockpuppetry, flame-baiting or other larger crimes.

This would give people a chance to defend themselves. I feel that most Wikians would be upset by the length of the ban for such a minor infraction which I committed over the course of 1+ years. If 2.5k is too few, perhaps 4k, but I think the principle is what must be considered. Thoughts? LG/Imp? Lts and Constables? 09:13, June 6, 2014 (UTC)

Still on about that? Sheesh. Nuke's warnings were clearly labeled as such. Your help is more or less irrelevant as to the block.

As for the idea, no way in hell.

Lordganon (talk) 09:45, June 6, 2014 (UTC)

LG, yes his warnings were clear, but they were spread out over the course of 1+ year, leading me to believe that I would not be banned for an over-the-top amount of time, like the amount of time I was banned for viciously attacking FS.

By pointing out my help, my purpose was to let everyone know that I made a couple of administrative errors, not a vital flaw that comprimised the wiki or was overtly offensive.

Please also note that I made a provision for supposed "felonies," but I think misdemeanors more often than not can be explained to some extent. I am not complaining about my ban - it is over for me. I just don't want this happen to others.

Please explain why not, LG? 17:42, June 6, 2014 (UTC)

Vandal
Look here for a vandal, someone block him. Saturn (Talk) 11:13, June 6, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc Strikes Again


Here is a snippet of a conversation I had with AnnihilationOfWorlds. The rest is left out for containing possible personal information. Tr0llis (talk) 23:59, June 7, 2014 (UTC)

Why don't you all just LEAVE ME ALONE!!!!!! You know I hate having a bad reputation!AnnihilationOfWorlds (talk) 00:03, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

DFTT?

It is too late Ratc, you commited a crime, and you must be punish, even if that punishment is unfair, it is what it is, and you choosed your path very well, you must deal with your actions for one moment, Man up and suck it up. Continue this and you will only be seen as a bugger. Prove yourself better and bring a better reputation from another place and perhaps you will be allowed once again into this wiki. And even that its a long shot Sine dei gloriem &#34;Ex Initio Terrae&#34; (talk) 00:06, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

Troll baiting?

Prehaps he has changed?

Are you enjoying hunting him down?

A which hunt?

Will he be alowed to prove he is less porfaine?Whipsnade (talk) 00:26, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

It's a shame - AnnihilationofWorlds (or Ratc) has actually shown improvement. However, rules are rules Anni - and there's a lot of evidence suggesting that you're Ratc. Rcchang (talk) 00:36, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

I am not Ratc.Whipsnade (talk) 00:49, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

I don't think anyone said you were. Tr0llis (talk) 00:51, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

OK.Whipsnade (talk) 00:53, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

Considering he admitted it to Trollis, and Sine (who im not sure took a screenshot) i believe its quite obvious what the option it. Lets be honest i dont want to sound mean, but i dont enjoy having to doubt every single new person that comes on thinking its Ratc. So lets end this once and for all

He also confessed a few lines up. Mscoree (talk) 17:09, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

If he is really Ratc, even if he improved, the rules are clear, He may have to be blockedALLONS-Y!!,Basically, RUN!! 17:27, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

Told you so.

17:45, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

rat agan? i knew anni was rat. -Sat (i was checking the wiki from summer camp, and i saw this DOWN WITH RATC)

Ratc has arrived again, this time with the name CaptainSmasher. Mscoree (talk) 21:17, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

He said he's continuing to come back again and again. We need to take action, or he'll turn into Owen 2.0. Bfoxius (talk)

If this happens again, I'm reporting all known usernames and IPs of Ratc to wikia. They blocked his Ratc account already for harassing me on other wikis as a warning. This is not only a waste of everyone's time, but it's putting everyone on edge, which I will not stand for.

CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 18:34, June 9, 2014 (UTC)

Ratc returned as LieutenantMario, and I've went to block it permanently. Just letting everyone know. -Seiga  2014 June 11, 05:25 (CET)

Continued Vandalism on New Union Articles
Several IPs have been making minor (though annoying) edits to several articles on New Union. Regardless of whether I block the IP or revert their edits, they simply revert them.

The IPs include:


 * 95.236.184.20
 * 95.244.185.120
 * 79.45.174.224

I've went ahead and protected several articles on the timeline to curve these edits and have contacted the recent IP address to cease these edits. After blocking one of the articles, the IP then commented on the talk page (which means he intended to continue vandalizing the article).

I have no doubt these are the same individual, which means there no real way to block them (since they can change their IPs [SonnyPatton all over again]). Not sure what to do beyond what I've already did, so I'll bring this up so it can be known. -- 17:04, June 8, 2014 (UTC)

Here is an anon vandal of this page -- List of Presidents of Chile (Central World). Edits reverted, just need a ban. Thanks, 09:16, June 10, 2014 (UTC)
 * Special:Contributions/14.2.44.77

I have another problem, this time with my timeline (6-2-5 Upheaval). So, I started writing some elections pages and accidentally made the page US Presidential Election of 1960 when I intended to make the page US Presidential Election of 1956. I moved the page to 1956, and I figured that'd be the end of my worries. That was a while back. Now, when I went to make the page for the election in 1960, I couldn't because I relocated the 1960 page and somehow I left a redirect when I renamed the page.

Can someone fix this problem for me? Thank You, 10:30, June 10, 2014 (UTC)

Here you go. All I had to do was remove the redirect. Mscoree (talk) 10:34, June 10, 2014 (UTC)

Thank you, Ms. Sometimes I just cannot figure some basic stuff out. 23:59, June 10, 2014 (UTC)

Linq
User Linq seems like to spam "Nice blog!" over some blogposts on this wiki. He also vandalizing 1983: Doomsday and making such nonsense editing on his own map game, Great Advance Restarted (Map Game).

FirstStooge (talk) 05:29, June 12, 2014 (UTC)

Looks like someone trying to get badges easily rather than a malicious user. Gave him a warning. Will follow up with a block if he doesn't stop. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 05:52, June 12, 2014 (UTC)

Hi,

Linq is my friend at school. He spams because he thinks that if he has a lot of edits and badges, everyone will respect him. However, he uses the school computers, and as a result, I could not use the school computers to make any edits, and CaptainJohnRex and a few other users from my school couldn't either since the IP was banned.

Rcchang (talk) 22:58, June 13, 2014 (UTC)

Chat Abuse
I am sorry to bring up something that may be controversial, but these are the kinds of discussions that I feel need to be had, comfortable or not. As you all may (or may not) be aware, today is the day of the Political Elections.

Mostly a whimsical event taken too seriously by people like me, these are supposed to be fun ways to bring the community closer together. However, in chat today, things got quite serious.

A bit of background first. Chat has never really been too controlled. As Bfox put it once, it is a sort of "Wild West" with sherrifs brandishing their pistols in the air. There is one main dispute that rages on... the Squirrevolution. The main opponents are Guns and Fed. Guns sees the ban on squirrels (as imposed by Fed) to be tyrannical, as does much of the wiki.

Today, Fed was on the chat, along with Ms, Guns, Tr0llis, Andrew, myself, and a few others. Engaging in fun political banter, it became clear that the TSPTF were acting a bit authoritarian. (What can you expect from "Communists"?) They kicked Guns, then Sine, then Tr0llis, then banned Guns, and finally (without a kick as a warning or any other direct warning to me) I was banned. I cannot relate any of the story from there, as I was banned.

I asked Fed to unban me, or else this wiki would have this discussion. Well, now we are having this discussion.

According to Fed (and Crim, who I do not think [not sure, but definitely was not speaking] was on chat at the time), I was banned for ad hominem attacks on Andrew. The only comments I made were directed at either Comrade Bear (your stereotypical Communist, who Fed seems to personify) and Chairman Meow (the avatar which Andrew uses). None of the attacks were on Fed or Andrew directly but on their abuse of mod powers and Communist propaganda.

Additionally, I was banned for "spamming," although spamming is defined as "send[ing] the same message indiscriminately to (large numbers of recipients) on the Internet." I varied my message, but generally speaking all of my comments were aimed at the same idea, but not once did I repeatedly copy/paste the same message, as "spamming" would imply.

That was one incident, but not the only incident. Twice, when in an argument over the plausibility of Viva's African Vivimpire, Oyo/Najiria, he has kicked me when I have only argued about his nation and nothing else. Generally speaking, authoritarian modding practices are frowned upon by all other users in chat, but at the same time the mod will not notice/pay attention.

As I told Fed, unban me or this is going to Ganon. Enough really is enough, and mod abuse on chat has reached a tipping point. I am not sure what needs to be done to correct this issue for the long term (that is why we elect TSPTF members, no?) but something has to change. 03:37, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Those attacks at "comrade bear" and "comrade meow" were obviously meant at us two. You don't have to refer directly to a person so that that person knows that attack is directed towards him.

As for the spam, the wording may have been marginally different every time you posted it, but the message remained the same. The definition applies. Fed (talk) 03:42, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

I never abused my mod powers against you Rex, you are cherry picking events here. I kicked troll for spamming not for political attacks, actually on chat I was very friendly toward political debate constantly saying everyone is allowed to voice my opinion. This is silly and there is no need to waste the TSPTF's time.ALLONS-Y!!,Basically, RUN!! 03:44, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Fed, I attacked Comrade Bear and *Chairman* Meow precisely because I was attacking the hypocrisy of the purported beliefs of the Communist party, and those characters represent you in the Communist Party. Not once did I personally insult either of you - it was all directed at the ongoing political simulator elections. Andrew, I am not trying to say you did anything wrong. I don't really believe that Fed should get any reprimand for how he reacted. I just feel that this is a discussion that must be had - Chat.

I think that this is most definitely not a waste of the TSPTF's time, since we have an issue, and nothing can be resolved by day-long bans and resulting bad feelings. Since I cannot go onto chat to discuss this problem, we have to speak about it in a public forum, and this is the most appropriate public forum available.

I do not think I called you out for being overly authoritarian towards me, Andrew. You were not, and if that is the impression you got from what I passionately typed, I apologize.

Now, Fed, you make it sound like I just spammed messages like "Stop the Commies!" over and over. That is not true. I did indeed change what I was saying, and it was not intended to clutter the chat. While I did have a number of cliche (and perhaps in your mind overused by the world population as a whole) responses, I never truly spammed chat.

Furthermore, even if I did insult either of you on a personal level (which I did not, but you may have had different perceptives), there is a certain expectation to be had for the TSPTF, or the officers of the wiki. IRL, should an angry mob verbally attack police officers, they cannot do anything about it. I believe that as members of the TSPTF, you ought to act similarly. Perhaps I am a bit too romantic towards the reality which is the TSPTF, maybe I am a bit too romantic towards the expectations I have for Chat Moderation. 04:33, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

"I don't really believe that Fed should get any reprimand for how he reacted."

Is that why you blackmailed me saying 'unban me now or I go to Ganon' and why this post is titled 'mod abuse'? Fed (talk) 04:58, June 14, 2014 (UTC) Chat Abuse, but same difference, no? I seriously do not want you to get into any kind of trouble, but I think that what happened needs to be brought before the TSPTF and Lordganon. Fed, once you are done findng any ways in which I can be turned into the "bad one," I'd appreciate it if you could talk to the points which I made? 05:33, June 14, 2014 (UTC)
 * I'll get the popcorn. Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk)

Here is what I remember: What I don't understand is, we asked Fed permission to talk about the simulation (hold a "march"), he then said the attached picture. Also, no one is being blackmailed. IF anything Rex is holding his government accountable.
 * I quoted the Blues Brothers and said the line about "Orange Whips". I said orange whips the amount of times in the quote (about three lines overall) and Fed kicked me for spamming. That I can understand at least.
 * I then started talking about the government simulation and politics differing from Fed's beliefs. I was then banned.

Tr0llis (talk) 12:58, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Firstly, I would like to point one thing out; I was most certainly not spamming. At no point did I even repeat the same sentence (well, except for a few celebrations about the Netherland's 5-1 smashing of spain- #ORANJE2014).

Secondly, the Squirrevolution is not nonsensical. It's satirical. There IS a difference.

13:11, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Can someone remind me what's going on? Bfoxius (talk)

Apperently, Rex said something stupid, ticked off Fed, and got banned. Or at least that's what I'm reading. With Guns and Tr0llis, I can understand the kicking. They do a lot of stuff in chat that gets them kicked a lot (like spamming squirrel smilies). With Sine, it was probably for laughs for for something justifiable by the mods. With Rex, he says a host of stupid and unneccessary things, such as harassing a user over their actions in a map game (such as myself). So there is probably more to his ban than we know. Just a shame I didn't see that conversation go down myself. And Rex, I kicked your during the argument because you becoming annoying, disrespectful, and insulting my actions and my intelligence because I refused to conform to your views of ATL. Saying a kicked you for no reason is pushing it. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 13:58, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Really not buying any of this, Rex. I know enough of how you lot act in that chat to know better. Same reason for kicking as always.

Guys, if they do stuff like this in the chat and don't listen, just block them from the wiki. Seems to not learn from chat blocks.

Any more of this garbage about those "parties" and "politics" leading a to a fight, I'll probably just put tags on it.

Lordganon (talk) 14:35, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

How do you plan to put tags (I assume you mean categories) on my user page, and how is that in any way a punishment? Mscoree (talk) 14:56, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Firstly, I have never spammed squirrels. I want to point out that I have, occasionally, posted one or two, and those are kickable offenses. For god knows what reason.

Secondly, in this case, I think I was banned because Feddy supports Spain and I support the Dutch.

Not cool, Feddy.

Ms, deletion tags, I believe.

22:45, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Also, I just want to say that I agree with LG about the political parties. They're a joke, guys. You all take them WAY too seriously.

Now the world cup, that IS serious.

22:57, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

Guns, not everyone cares about the World Cup, and we don't take the political sim that serious. When the election's all said and done, we'll forget about it for another six months.

It's funny, when this issue's all said and done, Rex and everybody else will be unbanned from chat.

Bfoxius (talk)

Feddy banned half a dozen people yesterday over it. People thought I was part of that, too, because I may have been rubbing in the fact that the Dutch smashed the Spanish 5-1 (ORANJE WOOHOO). Feddy cares, I care, people I respect care, end of story.

23:05, June 14, 2014 (UTC)

I did not write this post so that I can try and appeal my chat ban. It really does not bother me, being away from chat for one day. I wrote it so that we can discuss chat guidelines. We had general consensus that they were needed back at the start of this month.

Nothing has happened, and that is the main reason that I am trying to get real discussion going about this. Ignore what happened... "It doesn't matter; it's in the past." But let's learn from this. Let's improve the wiki. Let's do what we agreed was needed. We need to actually discuss this issue, or it will keep popping up. 00:21, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Correct - deletion tags. Had I meant categories, I would have said that. Nor did I say a word about your user page.

Realistically, we do have guidelines - just need to actually be enforced.

As for the squirrel bit, do know you guys have spammed them.

Lordganon (talk) 14:23, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Please don't put deletion tags on my user page. This problem represents something among a few, not all of us. Mscoree (talk) 14:28, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

I've never typed a squirrel once. Secondly, on this chat even if you post one in your entire lifetime you get kicked. It's not about spamming (despite what the admins may document it as), it's about the simple act of using a squirrel. I believe Fed once said something along the lines of, "they're vermin and not allowed at all." If they weren't allowed at all I'd think the brass would just remove them. Tr0llis (talk) 14:30, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Tr0ll, you have not typed a squrrel once - and I've never kicked you for squirreling once. The two people who I've most kicked for squirrel abuse are ratc, who did it only when I said I was not allowing them,  and Guns, who spams shamelessly. The "vermin" thing is called a joke; I know apparently you don't get any of my jokes, since you also posted a joke as explicit permision, but it was a joke nonetheless.

I have placed a non-tolerance policy on squirrels because I know that otherwise they're abused horrendously; for instance, once, while discussing PM3 policy in another wiki chat I had no admin powers (Ms was banned at the time, and we needed his opinion), after the facts somebody copy-pasted as many squirrels as chat box allows onto chat non-stop for about fifteen minutes.

As for Guns, I could not care any less about whether you support the Netherlands or not; the reason why I banned you is the fact that you filled Ms' PM chock-full of squirrels, and then started hammering on about "squirrevolution" in chat, at which point i was so irritated by your, Tr0ll's and Rex's nonsensical screams about dictatorship that I enforced a two-hour (should've been more) ban from chat because of spam, something I'm entirely entitled to. And don't exaggerate things; I didn't ban "half a dozen people", I banned three people.

Before you go out spouting "political oppression" think about it. Bfox, Ms and Viva all opposed the Communists vehemently, both IRL and in the government simulation; had I tried to oppress them, I would've banned them as well, don't you think? Fed (talk) 17:16, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

WOAH WOAH WOAH!

That's a blatant LIE, Feddy. I filled his PM YESTERDAY, and NOT when I was banned for it, and only because the general opinion on chat- including that of Ms- was that it would help the situation.

I talked about the Squirrevolution... twice. I actually just asked around "Who's in in the Squirrevolution?", and then I held a rally for the Squirrevolutionaries.

Also, Feddy, I have NEVER spammed squirrels. If you banned squirrels because someone spammed them once, then you should ban all emoticons, all english words, and all links, because people spam them too. Your idea of spam is "woah I see a squirrel". You know what? For now on, everytime you kick someone for posting a squirrel, I'll screenshot it and post it on my userpage; after 100 kicks, let's see if even ONE of them has more than one squirrel.

I VERY much doubt it.

18:20, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Is all this bickering really necessary? Lg has provided his opinion, fed has defended himself. Let's just stop the silly bickering. Ok, as far as I'm concerned fed was right. And it has nothing to do with politics, if it did everyone that didn't agree would have been kicked or banned. Please, just chill.ALLONS-Y!!,Basically, RUN!! 18:44, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

^ I agree.

18:48, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Andrew is right, but that does not mean that this discussion should be over. We just need to stop the bickering, but we can carry on talking about the need for better (or more enforced) chat guidelines.

LG, you stated that there are guidelines for chat. Could you link them, and then perhaps go over them so all Chat Mods know the instructions and how to follow them?

I also agree with Guns' statement about Squirrels and spamming. Much like the Prohibition, the ban does not prevent squirrels and only makes them more popular and likely to be spammed, which is clearly what Fed is trying to prevent. 20:49, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Are you kidding? You've been on chat long enough to know what's expected of you. You aren't a toddler, Rex. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 21:09, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

I know what is expected of me, yes. I would like to make sure the mods know what is expected of them. I think that reviewing our Wiki's Policy is of vital importance. We must be an organized community with specific rules and regulations, rule of law, rather than what someone with a star by their name and a badge on their user pages says, autocratic rule.

Crim, you make it sound like my request is outlandish, but I just want to make sure that we go over things like this. I am pretty sure that nowhere in the rules of chat are squirrels prohibited, for instance. 00:49, June 16, 2014 (UTC)

Guidelines = same as wiki ones, more or less. Not hard to figure out.

Know full well you guys spam those things.

Spamming is prohibited. You guys spam squirrels. Simple. And your response to both that and warnings/blocks is to do it more.

Problem is that the warning and blocks are, realistically, empty threats - often taken back right away, or the only consequences. Needs to be wiki blocks if it persists after warnings.

Lordganon (talk) 10:00, June 16, 2014 (UTC)

Actually, we don't.

Here's a PERFECT example. I had been absent from chat for quite some time, and when I came back, Sat posted a squirrel, in response to which I posted ONE squirrel.

Here's the result: ONE squirrel is a ban, and then they claim it was spam? I have witnesses to the fact that I was absent from chat for quite some time, as I was playing an online card game with some of them: as Will, Feud, Fed, Toby, Crim himself, Ms, and someone who claimed to be LG, though I do doubt that. 01:06, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

Here is another example of the "spamming":

In picture one above I posted (for the first time in quite some time and definitely the first one all day) a single squirrel. You can even see Fed in the picture saying it is not a bannable offense (maybe a kickable one then). In picture two we see Fed threatening to delete the evidence I posted on the wiki (and I believe he later did). I hope that shows that posting squirrels is a kickable offense currently, spam or not. Thanks, Tr0llis (talk) 01:20, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

Squirrels is a kickable offence indeed at first thing.

As for deleting the influence, "I believe he later did", he says, POSTING THE FILE I THREATENED TO DELETE. Are you kidding me?? Fed (talk) 01:22, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

If a squirrel is a kickable offense (pray tell why) then why was I chatbanned for posting a SINGLE squirrel? Note, I had not posted ANY squirrels prior to that.

01:23, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

I was not responsible for banning you because of the squirrels, and it's a kickable offence because you've overdone it and no more squirrels are acceptable. Fed (talk) 01:25, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

When making this post it looked like the image was removed. It has just come to my attention that the file was vandalized not by Fed, but by Blocky. I had to reupload it to make this post. Tr0llis (talk) 01:29, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

First off, ONE user- some flashie- spammed squirrels a LONG time ago. Since then, they have been banned, and users who even protested the silliness of the ban were kicked. This is stupid, and should be changed- we'd ALL shut up about squirrels if you'd stop banning them.

Secondly, Feddy, if so, then most of your chadmins don't know that, cuz this isn't the first time such a ban has occurred for a single squirrel.

Can we turn chat off?

01:31, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

This is so childish its ridiculous. for the love of god people how hard it is to not act like an idiot and not spam.

Fed its a squirrel, GET OVER IT, 1 or 2 every little bit isnt the end of the world as long as they are not superspammed.

Squirrel People. Stop throwing up such a big fuss over a squirrel Smilie. Its a smilie on a chatbox on a website you frequent that has rules about spamming. FOLLOW THE RULES PEOPLE

Chadmins, for the love of god show some restraint. No more joke banning and kicks need to be reserved for when the situation calls for it and Bans need to be legitimate and not over personal opinion. I take a grand total of two or three of you seriously because i cant trust any of you to NOT abuse your Chadmin powers over absolutely Frivolous or ridiculous crap. Honestly nobody takes you guys seriously anymore because when people are banned now its a joke, or for a personal reasons, such as dislike for a particular member.

That is where i disapprove. Bans and kicks cause you dislike someone rather than them acting up and causing issues are two different things. When you are acting as an Chadmin, your bans and kicks can not and should not reflect your personal reasoning and dislike for a certain member of the wiki, and trust me it happens alot more than certain people would care to admit. CUT IT OUT and grow up. Me and Viva had a big blowout the other day. Still went and apologized for my stubborn and outwardly rude behavior towards him. Please i know you all can grow up and be a little less ridiculous towards eachother.

So for my final words im just putting it out there that pretty much everyone needs an attitude adjustment (including myself in some cases) We need to be more civil to eachother in chat, big blowouts need to be stopped (with kicks as appropriate) and Chadmins need to stop acting on personal dislike and bias against someone. If it doesnt stop ill contact higher ups to take action who im absolutely sure at this point are probably absolutely done with all this nonsense and foolishness. What stops LG from just removing chat alltogether and making this a non issue. To be honest i actually enjoy chat and when people are civil its a pretty fun and nice place to be. But when a new user walks into a total storm where a single smilie or ridiculous stuff happens causes kicks and bans it makes our wikia look awful and has probably stifled our new user base by a ridiculous amount. We are one of the first venues that new users visit and while some people try to act civil, nice, and open to new users, walking into a total storm of a chat with ridiculousness floating around and bans and kicks flying left and right... yeah that immediately turns me off as a fequent user.. imagine a new user. Well thats all i have to say

...

Really guys? You are doing squirrels like that? And complaining? Sheesh.

Quite frankly, given the overall context, a lot of the ones you guys used in those images, I'd have kicked you too. Not a question of spam, but... Well, I'd call it, for lack of a better way, "Poking the Bear." It's kind of like saying "I won't listen to your rules."

As noted before, no rules against squirrels. But the "why" of you posting those ones? I would say that needs to stop.

Troll, you need to learn to read sarcasm. Kind of obvious that that is what Fed did there.

Yeah, I have just about had it with this. Almost regret turning the "chat" feature on, actually. Concept of turning it off grows more appealing.

That card thing - definitely not me.

Lordganon (talk) 09:53, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

Removing chat is a very risky move. I see a lot of people leaving if we make that move. I've seen sites make this move and it spelled disaster for them. People will just post links to other wiki chats and frequent ours less and less. Over time, we'll lose traffic to competitor wikis. Worse, what wiki will everyone go to for chat? Likely, the Map Game Wiki. We can't lose traffic to the Map Game Wiki of all places. I'd rather lose traffic to the Man/Boy Love Association Wiki than the Map Game Wiki. I'm not sure if that's a big deal for any of the other head admins, but it's a pretty big deal for competitive people like me.

I think, rather than deleting chat, the chat mods need to take their jobs seriously. It would definitely help if people like Tr0llis weren't constantly trying to start arguments about stupid things. The fact that an argument over whether or not people should be allowed to spam squirrels is the hottest debate of the month is pretty pathetic, don't you guys think? Can't we at least argue about something not involving squirrels?

CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 13:10, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

No intention of removing it, rest assured.

Taking their jobs seriously - and, my beef, actually instituting punishments and not immediately reversing them - would do wonders.

Pretty pathetic, true enough.

Lordganon (talk) 13:40, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

On another note - going to try and keep the chat up more often. Though, bet money on me not paying any attention to it. Lordganon (talk) 13:41, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

I think the issue is more so the right to have squirrels at all, not to spam them. If the administration decides they should be banned just remove them. As for Lordganon's entry, I'm sure his presence is very much welcome. Mscoree (talk) 14:03, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

I feel like just having LG on chat- regardless of whether he is paying attention- will solve 90% of the chat's issues.

15:22, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

Not even that, probably the threat of it solves 90% of the issues

BridgittLaura's Own Althistory Wiki
While BridgittLaura has been blocked by Lordganon, she is goanna strike again. This time, BridgittLaura has founded an another wiki called Alternate-Histories Wiki and she is founder. It liberally means admin of this newly wiki and steals copying one of America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire articles. For example, they copying from United States (America Takes All Lands From Mexico And Ottoman Empire) to United States (Americana Unionismo). BridgittLaura also stealing copyrighting and copy from Alternative History:Templates to Alternate-Histories:Templates This is not okay and you should report Community Central if Wikia deleted this wiki. Thanks you!

Eric von Schweetz, You Young and Sweet Boy!

She's allowed to copy the articles, as they were hers. I also think the wiki is allowed, because there is a wiki called "another alternate history wiki" Saturn (Talk) 19:53, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

AAH is different than AHW; it documents moments in history which could be used as PODs, not TLs, which is the purpose of AHW. In most cases, other wikis would be reported and deleted.

20:10, June 17, 2014 (UTC)

Just a quick note, the two templates pages (albeit copied) are in no ways the same thing. Ours works, and hers fails. 19:30, June 19, 2014 (UTC)

Greetings to all users of the Althistory wiki.

11 days ago, an unknown wikia-user has created a page on Althistories Wiki called COPYRIGHT WARNING and it concepts Copyright and violation. However, BridgittLaura copy and stealing some materials from Althistory wiki and she also did a copyright, copying from Alternative History:Templates to Alternate-Histories:Templates. Before COPYRIGHT WARNING was created, she blocks this user for removing content from pages, and posted here. I should already sent to BridgittLaura as a warning now.

Regards, Eric von Schweetz, You Young and Sweet Boy!

DannyCity Circumventing His Block?
I recently blocked DannyCity for duplication. Recently a new user by the name DannyGuySonic22 began uploading similar files as DannyCity.

This is clearly DannyCity circumventing his block (which was only for a week). Not completely sure what to do. I will block this new account as well. LG, feel free to permanently block either or both accounts upon reading this. -- 23:31, June 18, 2014 (UTC)

Just getting around to this. Yeah, hunting around shows him admitting to it on another wiki, made for just this purpose. Perm blocks added. Lordganon (talk) 15:32, June 20, 2014 (UTC)


 * Lol, didn't realize you perm blocked him (the squirrel debate made me miss that one). Anyway, I just got a message from an IP claiming to be DannyCity and He requests that his first account be unblocked. I went ahead and banned the IP. However, I would request that we do remove the block on him. While no doubt he made a bonehead move by creating a new account to get by his first block, I genuinely believe he's learned (in the hardest way possible) that both these things were wrong. Combined with the fact that he's pulling a SunnyPatton by manipulating multiple IPs, I suggest we unblock him. But if he does anything like this afterwards, than I'll shut up. -- 21:35, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

Zero tolerance policy, and he has, by my findings, tried similar things elsewhere. Not going to undo this one. Lordganon (talk) 15:11, June 25, 2014 (UTC)


 * Do forgive me. I wasn't aware of the zero tolerance policy (don't have to deal with that many on my end). -- 15:36, June 25, 2014 (UTC)

The End of Squirrels
I've made a long overdue MediaWiki page for emoticons. As you will all notice, I added some cool, new ones. Among others, we have the (tardis) emoticon and the shark emoticon. You'll all notice fairly quickly, though, that squirrels are no longer an emote on this wiki since some users can't handle having them. No, they will not be coming back, no matter how much you people ask. If we see another incident like the squirrel incident, all emoticons are going to be going away for a very long time.

CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 01:54, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

I have been trying to tell people for ages that if they don't like squirrels they can be removed. I'm glad this is finally over. Mscoree (talk) 01:57, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

OMFG. Literally an hour after the whole issue gets resolved, Crim opens it up again. GODDAMMIT. Good job, Crim.

01:59, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

The iron fist of the TSPTF has smashed the squirrevolution down and pulled it up by its roots! No way!

At the request of users, I have added... *sigh* Elsa and Polandball emotes. I have no idea why I enable you people... CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 02:55, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Elsa =/= A Squirrel. 06:57, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Oh god you actually made chat worse. ELSA?

I hated that movie. It was ridiculously generic and anti-climatic, and the plot made no sense.

Wait, so let me get this straight. After the whole "squirrevolution" business is over, after no one else on chat or on the wiki are actually paying attention it, when everyone has forgotten about it, you decide "Hey, let's open up the whole argument  all over again", you ban squirrels, and then you complain about US being "enabled"?

Crim, just, I mean... smh.

10:43, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

And so they've come to an end. About time. Thank you Crim. That is all. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 11:03, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Although I do enjoy elsa and the tardis, we still need thumbleweed.

On a more serious topic, won't the squirrevolution find a new emoticon? Sky Green <font color="A00000">24 - Join the party  14:25, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

The squirrel revolution had little to do with actual squirrels. It was just about have clear and fair guidelines for chat really. I'd imagine now Guns will continue toward that goal, and maybe pursue the return of the squirrel emoticon. Mscoree (talk) 14:46, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Guns, you know that the revolution business was not over and people continued posting squirrels. If you had forgotten about it, you must have the memory of a goldfish. If anything like the squirrel business starts again, emotes are gone. Period. Squirrels are not coming back either. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 17:49, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

I think what he meant was, the squirrel revolution was getting so much exposure that Fed no longer was kicking per squirrel. Spamming of course was still not allowed, but we were finally getting to a point where you could post a single squirrel in a non spam-like manner and not be punished for it. Sounds like that essentially made the matter settled, but just as things were cooling down, squirrels were completely removed. That's how I understand it anyway. Mscoree (talk) 18:34, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Ms is pretty right on. The fact that you removed squirrels when a VAST MAJORITY of the entire wiki community wants them is by definition tyrannical. Just because you can access MediaWiki stuff and we cannot doesn't mean that you can abuse it.

Furthermore, this should at a minimum, have been brought before the entirety of the TSPTF. LG and Imp, our two active Brass, did not sign off on this (AFAIK) and if they did, they did not do so publicly. In fact, LG said he was considering it, but made no further move to do anything.

This is just ridiculous, in my opinion. One person cannot hijack chat. Wikia is quite clear, admins are for doing stuff for the community, not for themselves. 19:12, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

...

Crim, Rcc, posted a single squirrel because he didn't believe me when I told him that the Squirrevolution had won.

Ms, yeah, basically.

Good job, Crim. You managed to cause a resolved problem to become a big one AGAIN. Like, actually? Everyone except you is happy with the settlement, so you just go and screw eveything up? Isn't the TSPTF meant to RESOLVE disputes?

19:15, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

I'm not an avid squirrel supported but someone give these people their squirrels back Kurt Cobain&#39;s Haircut (talk)

Hold on a second.

This is so wrong.

Why were squirrels banned? Common premises include:

So, why exactly were they taken away? If they were used responsibly, and not as spam, I don't see a sensible reason that they should have been removed. As you can see, several users have changed their icons to squirrels in protest. I have had mine changed for a while, but I still echo the same sentiment - the squirrels were taken unjustly and should be restored immediately.
 * 1) The frequent spamming of the squirrel icon - This was highly popularized by Ratc. However, taking the emoticon away from the entire wiki is a nuclear solution. Just because one person can't handle something doesn't mean we should all loose our privileges. When everyone else uses it, the icon is used merely once or twice, not as spam. Let me say - spam is not permitted. However, one could just as easily spam the new (tardis) and (elsa) icons. What would happen then, would those be taken away as well?
 * 2) Prejudices by mods - I didn't really see the problem here. I know Fed wasn't a fan of the squirrel, and would ban people for using it once. However, he got over this and allowed it in normal conversation. Other than him, I didn't see any other mods banning the emoticon when it was used normally.
 * 3) The Squirrevolution - Honestly, this argument isn't even about squirrels at all. This stands for the freedom of speech, the press, and so on. You know what? If I want to post a Squirrel icon on chat, I will. But now I can't, because it's been taken away. I know in the US, there are multitudes of court cases dealing with our freedoms - for example, Texas v. Johnson  and Tinker v. Des Moines . These rights are protected.

Cour *talk* 20:09, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

1. ...yes. If someone spammed the (tardis) or (elsa) icons, they would be taken aay.

2. Crim, Imp and other mods have all kicked because use of the squirrel. It's preventive policy.

3. THe Squirrevolution is ridiculous. Firstly, there's no place in this wiki's policy that guarantees freedom of speech, and the removal of an ICON won't take away your freedoms or whatever. Fed (talk) 21:38, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

The problem seems to be the methods used to moderate chat. Simply taking away an icon will not limit a user's spam, only change it. However, it will prevent the rest of the population from using it. I believe that this is not a effective method. Cour *talk* 21:42, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Seriously? I remember a time when wikians acted like civilized humans and didn't whine and war on the TSPTF talk page over one emoticon. Bfoxius (talk)

I remember a time before the admins would have abused their power to ban it in the first place.

21:51, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

How is removing an emoticon abusing of power? Fed (talk) 21:54, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

Look, it's not the emote, it's the principle of the thing. This wiki is quite proudly a democracy; we represent every member equally, or at least hope to.

When almost every user on chat- including several TSPTF members- think that a rule is stupid and should be struck down, and then two admins refuse to strike it down (when they, it should be noted, installed it) for personal reasons, I don't think we can call that anything else.

Furthermore, that rule was voted against on the TSPTF page, I believe, and yet is still enforced.

AFAIK, the issue has once again been resolved, and so I recommend we all forget about this as soon as possible.

22:02, June 20, 2014 (UTC)

I liked the emoticon and kicking, it was great kinda like a inside joke with everyone. And cour don't blame rat for everything he never did a squirrel once, it was guns who awesomely spammed it out of existence. <font color=Purple face="Algerian">OCT MARIUS, HAIL HIM

I never had a problem with squirrel. My problem was with spam. And Guns and others just used the emote in the hundreds repeatedly. It became annoying and stopped being funny after the first three days.

00:52, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

No longer works... 04:47, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

Yes. Because people abused it.

04:50, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

Good god seriously? this is extremely off the wall. Removing it really just pisses alot of people off and turns this Squirrelvolution thing into a legitimate issue about TSPTF members being able to responsibly handle power. In my eyes, yes thats an abuse of power, no you do not have the right to revoke an emoticon just cause it bugs you, maybe if you enforced legitimate bans for spam THIS WOULDNT BE AN ISSUE

I for one would like to see it restored just for the principle of it. Spam or not, enforcing legitimate chat bans over overuse of it should be standard rather than removing it. Now youve just honestly pissed alot of people off when the issue was already solved. At least changing the Squirrel to the Ban me thing was actually kind of funny given the irony. Completely removing it is a tad over the top and honestly is not exactly the best way to handle this situation.

I honestly realize that some people cannot be mature when using the emoticons but your pretty much punishing everyone for the actions of a few people. Thats not how this works. If Ratc sat there and got banned for vandalism this is essentially tantamount to the TSPTF banning every standard user for Vandalism. Thats the standard issue i see with this. Ill agree about it being overused and pretty much been killed by Guns and friends, but that shouldnt constitute in the removal of the emoticon for use by the responsible users.

LG said himself that you guys need to take your jobs seriously and actually enforce your punishments. If that was the case none of this would be an issue in the first place.

You guys warn and warn and warn and then do a 10 second ban. How does that allow for anytime to think about the fact your being a jerk off on chat and shouldnt be. enforcing the few hour bans and at most 1 day bans for spamming would probably make this whole thing dry up in less than 2 weeks just because people know their ban wont be lifted less than a minute after its brought down they come back and do the same exact thing. I see it on average 3 or 4 times a week when im on chat. So can we please be a bit more responsible with the Chadmin powers?? If its an issue of being seen as the bad guy for banning people over spam... get over it.

Please restore the squirrel and please for the love of god start enforcing legitimate chat bans for these issues instead of letting it get to the TSPTF or letting it turn in a wiki dividing issue.

Expanding upon what Feud said (and I think it is a very valid point), I believe that the TSPTF should be somewhat separated from the Chat Moderator powers. Not all Constables use chat, and not all of them are the best people to be Chat Mods. This does not mean they should not be in the TSPTF, they just should not be Chat Mods.

Not everyone can control people on chat. I know I can't when I am on any wiki I have Chat Mod powers on, I just am not good (or experienced enough) at it.

Now, how will we do this? This will probably only apply to future constables and shouldn't be applied retroactively unless someone is proven to be abusive with the powers. I think a good way to implement this plan is to have a person, when nominated for User Rights, to be nominated for Constable with or without Chat Mod Powers.

Some people who do not use chat as much but have still done great services for the wiki (think LG or Nuke as Constable nominations), will opt to not have Chat Mod powers, while others would prefer them.

Separating the Chat Mod and Constable powers, in my opinion, is a good idea and is worth some consideration.

Thanks, 07:24, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

From what Feud has stated, I find I must agree with him. My only issue with the stupid icon was spam. But going so far as to remove the squirrel icon borders on ludicrous. I seriously find the action excessive, and given that this is what the Constables are moving on instead of serious chat violations disturbs me to no end. I'm also concerned with the fact that this was done without the support of the rest of the TSPTF, and was done unilaterally without TSPTF or community concensus. The stupid squirrels should be returned to chat, but spamming of them severely punished. For Christ's sake, the administration shouldn't be going around removing bits of code from the wiki because its members are personally annoyed by their functions. It should be focused on combatting serious issues, such as Ratc puppets and vadalism. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 07:38, June 22, 2014 (UTC)

Hey look, I made a post on this topic. &#34;SO SAYETH THE EAGLE&#34; - Fascist Eagle ಠ_ಠ (talk) 05:17, June 25, 2014 (UTC)

What is this "Squirrevolution" that the icon belongs to? "I have never heard of a "Squirrevolution" free smile icon site before.Whipsnade (talk) 00:00, June 29, 2014 (UTC)

79.7.145.50 probably Ratc
Messaged LG with "I'm not violating the rules do you understand that? Why I don't receive any messages from you ?stop blocking my pages. For example I edited the Caribbean countries on the 1983:Doomsday page of the World Country Profiles to include the RTFA and the United States Atlantic Remnant. Why there weren't on the list, eh? Put them on the list? Oh but you're not going to do it. Anyway now I'm going to do it and remember I AM NOT INSERTING FALSE INFORMATION AND I'M NOT VIOLATING THE RULES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Not certain, but fits with Ratc's tendency to get crazily annoyed about things and post a ridiculous number of Exclamation Marks.

I assume the TSPTF is already aware, given the messages are on LG's talk page, but I thought it should go on the TSPTF page anyway. Local Mafia Boss (Talk) (Blog)

79.0.180.173 is not Ract 333 since it's from Padova, Veneto, Italy. He uses Telecom Italia.Whipsnade (talk) 00:30, July 2, 2014 (UTC)

I think over-use of exclamation points is not proof for someone being Ratc. Can we please stop the witchhunting? Fed (talk) 00:44, July 2, 2014 (UTC)

Guy has nothing to do with rat. As Fed noted, stop witchhunting. Lordganon (talk) 10:05, July 2, 2014 (UTC)

Potential Vandal (Very Minor)
As I was creeping around the wiki's recent activity, I've found that a wiki contributer, who's IP is: 129.96.82.240 editted the page Flood Basalt Eruption, to include his own contributions.

While this is relatively minor, adding several "g's" to the end of the word "throughout", I believed it should nonetheless be brought to the attention of the TSPTF in order for an eye to be kept on said IP incase either more vandalisms erupt, or to welcome a new user who simply made a mistake.

Either way, the ball is in your court, enjoy. &#34;SO SAYETH THE EAGLE&#34; - Fascist Eagle ಠ_ಠ (talk) 06:05, July 1, 2014 (UTC)

Dealt with. Though, in the future, this is the kind of thing you really don't need to report - someone will find it. Lordganon (talk) 10:04, July 2, 2014 (UTC)

BridgittLaura's Sockpuppeting
She returning. Another Josiah.cervo/AmericaLoove/BridgittLaura/CasoNuevos' sockpuppet:

LauraBridgitMendez.

FirstStooge (talk) 09:44, July 8, 2014 (UTC)

It Is Her, She Just Changed To LauraBridgitMendez. she has gone to far.Likercat (talk) 10:03, July 8, 2014 (UTC)

Don't think that they could be less obvious than that. Blocked. Lordganon (talk) 09:26, July 10, 2014 (UTC)

Daxus Inferno
I banned Dax for a week for openly attacking users, including me. I also added LG's grievances with Dax to the ban. Went on a nice little hissy fit. Seems to have a grudge against me after I doubted his claims to being on acid a few weeks ago. I think he's also fishing for reasons to get people on the TSPTF that he doesn't like impeached, so it'll be fun when he brings that list up. At any rate, I thought it would be wise to tell you guys why he was banned. LG, you are more than welcome to add to the ban as you see fit. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 19:39, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I was watching the entire thing Crim, you banned him because he stated that the mods were terrible. He indirectly called the moderators (not you, Fed, or Ms) "retarded monkeys", yet you claim the attack was directed at you. You use the term "octard" (i.e. "retard") all the time when referring to others, yet you now expect Dax to not do what you do yourself? You just banned me from chat because I called you and the PMIII moderators out for your ludicrious and implausible behavior. How can you expect any of the users to respect you if you don't respect the very rules you break all the time? The only time you tolerate any actions is when they are not directed against you or the other moderators. Your in a position of authority, and you hang it over every one of us, and threaten us with bans when your pride has been hurt. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 19:47, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Not true. Dax insulted Crim heavily; other users, such as Rex, even asked me to kick him because he was getting out of order. Fed (talk) 19:49, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

It seems like both Daxus and Crim were very insulting. For example when I came on chat I said "Hello" and before I even knew what was going on Crim made a comment about my apparent lack of intelligence. As a bystander I'm not sure why the admins were directing insults at me, but again I think everyone was just in an insulting mood. Tr0llis (talk) 19:51, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Which users were these Fed? Because I only saw Rex say anything at all. Eip, Sky, Scar, and myself said nothing at all. If this was PM, then I would like to know which users requested Dax's banning. Vivaporius:  "I don't need a slogan"  19:52, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Good lord people, this is an online chatroom not a highschool. Calm down and stop with the hostility, im trying to actively tone down my hostility but there seriously is a limit. I literally got on about 15-20 minutes ago and watched Viva do Ad Hominem attacks against admins and PMIII mods THE ENTIRE TIME. I realize this is about dax but seriously, Why are the Chadmins tolerating this. Its open and shut that if your being harassed your allowed to ban/kick or request one from an admin

Watching and paying attention are two totally different things, Viva. If you're unable or unwilling to see what exactly he did wrong, don't bring this nonsense to the TSPTF. On a very similar note, I banned you on chat for nonstop harassing the moderators in PMIII. I have been getting numerous complaints about you over the last few days and it's driving me up a wall. You should not be acting like this any you know it. To add to that, I don't care if you don't like us. I care that you don't openly attack people, mods or not.CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 19:58, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Feud, none of my arguements against the moderators were ad hominem. When I made a post, everything was relevent to the subject. The same applied to Dax. Everything he said was correct and to the point. Crim and Fed are terrible mods, and trying to protect them from the reality of that is foolish. And Crim, I honestly don't care what you think of me either, so the feeling is mututal. The only complaints you've gotten are from other mods. I have yet to see any of the players say anything about me because they all said the same thing. I was right. Watching you ignore reality drives me up a wall to because you in a position of authority, and you routinely abuse it. If I see something wrong, I don't care if your feelings get hurt. I'm bringing it to light, and if it doesn't get fixed, I'm going to keep talking about it. Dax did the same, and banning him for telling the truth about your actions is childish. You openly attacked Dax. You openly attacked Trollis. You openly attack Oct all the time. You openly attacked me. You openly attacked, Imp and his actions. And you openly attacked Ratc. He was annoying, but the fact that you say what you say about him is hypocritical. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:03, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Rex complained about you. So did Eip and Nk a few days ago. Are all of those mods? You are not right, you just refuse to accept you are wrong for some reason. Don't worry, you calling us terrible mods because we banned you is absolutely unrelated to any issue. Fed (talk) 20:04, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Fed, Rex has been complaining about me since the dawn of time. Nothing is new about that. Eip complaining to you is new, but until I see some proof, I'm discounting that. And Nk was in on a lot of mod-backed actions in PMIII, and frequently consorts with all of your schemes against other players. He practically is a mod. And me calling you terrible mods is indeed unrelated to my ban. I've been calling you terrible mods before that, and I will keeping calling you terrible mdos until you change and learn to be plausible and unbiased. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:08, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

You can discount whatever you want and call out against the Gods about our evil conspiracy to make you suffer. I would not go as far as to lie about someone complaining about someone else misbehaving. As for the rest of your argument, you're free to do that, but you could learn one or two things about plausibility and bias yourself. Fed (talk) 20:12, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Considering you blatantly lied to me in Chat about Australia i really do have legitimate right to discount EVERYTHING you say. You Entitlement and really hostile attitude is really not helpful ever and you cause issues nuff said. At least im semi personable in a good mood and can hold a decent conversation. The Gist of your attitude is "im Right now deal with it"

We're deviating from the point here. Why Viva is gwumpy is not why we're here. The subject is why Dax was banned. Viva, if you think you were wrongly banned from PM, please post it elsewhere. CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 20:16, July 11, 2014 (UTC)


 * This isn't about my ban from PMIII and never was. I don't see why it is now. Flag of the Hurian Federation.png Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:26, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I don't understand anything in the first part of your post. As for the latter, unlike yourself, I look up what I can and cannot do, and then I give everyone my source to back my actions. You and the mods just disregard it since it means you have to accept the fact that I'm correct. I gave you a source on the size of Oyo's army, and you disregarded it. I gave you a source on the size of Oyo's cities and its population, and you disregarded it. I gave you a source on the Maori being able to build sailed vessels, and not only did you disregard it, but Callum, a mod who actually does his job, had to say I was right and prove you wrong. And I haven't been bias. I don't create events to punish players that are advancing and turning into a threat, or implausibly clog massive canals with weather that doesn't exist in the region, or start a rebellion in a country because the people just "felt" like rebelling or anything. So no, I'm not implausible or biased. You might learn something by watching me in fact.

And to Feud, I didn't lie about Australia. Sine, Ms, and and Andrew were all in chat when I mentioned it. I asked Sine, and he said he didn't see why not, though he cautioned me to wait. I asked Andrew, and all he said was "Mhmm...". And when I spoke to Ms, he said I should focus on Australia since he wanted Polynesia. So you can let go of it and accept that I didn't lie. You lie all the time. You lied about the rules, you lied about your expansion, and you lied about your sources. I will continue to criticize your actions because you are a liar. Period. You act as if you own everything and know everything because you do more than "Google s***", and you punish other players who dare confront you about your actions in PMIII. So you have no right to say anything.

Also, Crim makes a good point. This isn't about me, so don't make it about me. Dax's ban was unjust. Plain and simple. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:24, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

The fellow Daxus was banned for a reason mates. He regularly exhibits his neo-nazistic, anti-semitic, germanophillic and sometimes generally racist opinions and throws insults at others often. Calling Crimson here a retard, insulting others aswell. He does deserve a punishment. <font color="#00AAE4">Sky Green <font color="A00000">24 - Join the party  20:20, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

Keep in mind that this all started because I didn't think he was on acid as he claimed to be... CrimsonAssassin-See you, space cowboys 20:21, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I was there for the whole of the conversation with Daxus. He not only was rude to Crim, he cursed an ungodly amount, something which also makes him deserving of his ban. I did ask Fed to kick him on a couple of occaisons because of the huge fight he was causing/instigating.

Some of the many insults Dax has said: Fed would go on to list all of the people who voted for Crim, and the people who Dax insulted. This list includes: The shear level of insults Dax continued to spit out, even after being told the sheer number of people who he was insulting, did not stop there.
 * To Crim - "you inbred"
 * To Crim - " Crim, which monkeys with extra chromosomes though that you should be in any position of power on this wiki wahtsoever?"
 * Continuing from the other comment - " Because those monkeys need to think on their sins"
 * Pita
 * MP
 * Kath
 * Kogasa
 * Imp
 * Yank
 * Fed
 * Lurker
 * Cour
 * First
 * Me (Rex)
 * Scraw
 * LMB
 * UT
 * Insulting all people listed - " and I can't independently verify the amount of chromosomes they have/but I am sure they have some extras"
 * Insulting Crim by impersonation - " ' I'm Crim, I'm an asshole, I can't possibly allow this kid to talk on the chat about fucking short-wave radio frequences' "
 * Insulting Crim and Fed - "Crim and a lackey or so/being malignant assholes"
 * After Crim was talking about volunteering to help some people with Autism, Dax retorted - "It rubbed off on you"
 * "Crim is just a chimp"
 * @Crim - "Noone cares about your unfortunate childhood"
 * Descending into NCNC - " Crim, I once went to a school dominated by Pentecostle fucking cutlists/ with almost no thinking abilities/absolutely indoctrinated/ There is a kid who went there that reminds me of you/ a real aggressive drone he was"

He was finally banned by Fed at 12:27 after a solid half-an-hour of hateful insult-spewing, which started at 11:57.



In addition to today, he has insulted me on many occaisons, mostly during discussions.

His hatred carries over to Ms, as well. As soon as Ms got on, he was "welcomed" by Dax, insulting his second greatest project (the first being NOTLAH).

I can go on, but I have two things I want to close with. That is all. Sorry about all this having to come up to you, but Fed and Crim wanted to make sure they were justified. Personally, I am all in favor of a 1-2 month ban as a minimum. He contributes practically nothing to the wiki.
 * 1) Sorry for all the cursing I have had to post. I hate it as much as anyone here, but I want to get his direct quotes.
 * 2) Knew_it.pngr is Ratc.

20:22, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

This is my contribution here. &#34;SO SAYETH THE EAGLE&#34; - Fascist Eagle ಠ_ಠ (talk) 20:24, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

After seeing all that, I modify my 1-2 month proposal and say a permaban/1 year/6 month ban is called for. Clearly this wiki is hated by Dax, and that hatred is both uncalled for and will only create more problems. 20:27, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

In the first picture, that isn't a direct insult. In fact, it can be assumed Dax is speaking of the school teachers, not Crim. In the second, Dax calls Crim "aggressive" not "retarded". The two are not related, nor is one magically more insulting than the other. I've been called aggressive multiple times. Am I now entitled to ban those who say that? Dax's antisemitism is an ad hominem, since it has nothing to do with the argument. As for the final one, Dax can say whatever he wants about a person when they are not present. If he can, then we better hire some thought police while we're at it. Also, Dax doesn't hate the wiki, nor has he ever stated anything of the sort. That is an unfounded accusation that has no backing by any known sources. Finally, Rex, you aren't a member of TSPTF, so I don't know why your suggesting any sort of prolonged ban, or a ban at all. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:31, July 11, 2014 (UTC)

I'd ban him for a very long time, how dare he insult those with mental handicaps. I am autistic. Dax is an uncouth, rude, inconsiderate individual that has long expressed desires OPENLY on chat to and I quote " exterminate Israel" as well as constantly attacking those of Jewish desent and spewing truly venemous words, plenty that I would assume is not allowed by wikia period. Everyone has a right to speech true, but he has been belligerent and absolutely unacceptable attacking others, fed, ms, crim, me, sine, and numerous others have been a target of his hate. It isn't right.FOR THE GLORY OF THE PARTY! 20:40, July 11, 2014 (UTC)