Talk:Axis vs Allies Resurrection (Map Game)

1.0.1

 * Added Tier 2.5 (Italy, Brazil) to industry

1.0.2

 * Fixed minor bug regarding Tier 2 countries (Score was 3, not 2)

1.0.3

 * Added Tier 4.5 (France) to military

1.1.0

 * Lowered victory score differential threshold to 45 (previously 60)

1.1.1

 * Fixed major bug that dismissed Tactical Advantage scores.

1.1.2

 * Changed random number from =Today*Now to =RAND*(9999-0)+0 in algorithm.

1.2.0

 * Added tactical aspects regarding air superiority to algorithm
 * Massive air superiority: +15
 * Moderate air superiority: +10
 * No air support: -10

1.3.0

 * Changed victory score differential to +63

Guatemala/Mesoamerica
Reason: Mesoamerica now has a population of around 25 million, giving it a large potential pool of recruits. It has also industrialized significantly since the game's start, enabling it to supply some of its own arms needs, and has also purchased weans from overseas to give it a fairly modern military.
 * From: Tier 1
 * To: Tier 2

Sure.

Saudi Arabia

 * From: Tier 2
 * To: Tier 3

Reason: For the same reasons listed below, as well as the fact that Saudi Arabia has undergone substantial military expansion since the start of the game. ~Edge

Seems legit. 00:35, March 27, 2015 (UTC)

Sweden Reason:Sweden may be a small nation with population about 8 milion but at that time that i took control of Sweden(1954) it was already a very technological advanced ,industrialized nation.~Wrto12
 * From:Tier None
 * To:Tier 3

I would say tier 2. ~Edge

Yemen
Yemen has undergone sigifigant military developments since it has fallen in the Saudi Sphere. Armed with modern weapons and training, the Yemeni Army is better than others in the region, baring Saudi Arabia and other major nations in the region. ~Edge
 * From:Tier 1
 * To:Tier 2

Saudi Arabia

 * From:2
 * To:3

Reason: The Saudi's have been involved in arms trade with the Germans for several years now. The Suadi's also started in a similar technical situation to Turkey, who has now progressed to tier 3. While I may not have the raw industry to Match Turkey, deep arms trade with Germany should be sufficant to make up the difference between our military scores. ~Edge

Ye. 00:36, March 27, 2015 (UTC)

Sweden Reason:For the same reasons listed above.
 * From:Tier None
 * To:Tier 3.5

No, Tier 2 at best for this,~Edge

Industry
Sweden Reason: For the same reasons listed above.
 * From:Tier None
 * To:Tier 2.5

Again, Tier 2 at best.~Edge

Map Issues
If you have an issues with current map please post under here. ~ Somebody 17:28, March 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * A couple of mistakes with the map include
 * 1) Ethiopia never conquered Italian Eritrea nor British Somaliland. The player simply mentioned attacking both on his turn but no algorithm was made.
 * 2) If I am not wrong, South Africa controls the former British Pacific Islands (Maldives, Socotra etc) as well as Lesotho, Swaziland and South Rhodesia
 * 3) Australia purchased and controls the former Dutch East Indies
 * 4) Japan controls Macau, East Timor and Western Papua.
 * 5) Saudi Arabia does not control Oman. However, they do control Yemen (Those two Yemen things)
 * 6) The Map for Greece needs to reverted to how it was after its conquest by Italy and Turkey
 * 7) France never ceded the Hatay province of Syria to Turkey. It should therefore be returned back to Syria on the map.
 * 8) Brazil annexed the Three Guineas as well as South Carribean Islands.
 * 9) Even if inevitable, I don't particularly remember Ireland uniting in any Mod Event.
 * 10) France is under control of its Indian enclaves.
 * 11) Spain is in control of the former Portuguese enclaves in India.
 * 12) Gibraltar is supposed to be a single pixel and attached to the Iberian Peninsula. I believe the Spanish enclave on Morocco (Ceuta/Mellila) has been incorrectly coloured showing British control.
 * 13) Something about Germany and Posen that NK said. (there should be no border between Posen and Germany its all a single entity now.)
 * 14) It isn't helping that Brazil/Italy/Saudi Arabia share the same colour. Similarly, Canada/USSR/Britannica share the same colour as well..
 * 1) Hmm I was pretty sure that happened already.
 * 2) OK I'll fix that.
 * 3) Australia just "bought" Indonesia? Which has a larger population than it? As well as a completely different cultural base? I say ASB and call for a retcon.
 * 4) This will be fixed.
 * 5) This will also be fixed.
 * 6) It is like that. It's just in lighter shades of the colors of those countries.
 * 7) Hmm yeah that's a mistake.
 * 8) This will also be fixed.
 * 9) It's part of the Scotland things. Although I think there's a few turns to go. This will be removed from the current map.
 * 10) Yes.
 * 11) Yes.
 * 12) Yes.
 * 13) Yes.
 * 14) Yeah the greens are pretty close together, but not the reds I don't think. Something with your screen brightness probably.

Re:China
Hi, I was wondering whether I can be China in this game. I know I only have 16 edits (17 edits after publishing this) but on my previous account (UglyTurtle) I had 1,633 edits, so if that counts I qualify. Do I qualify for China? KawaiiKame (talk) 01:27, February 10, 2015 (UTC)

I mean, you had enough edits, so I don't see why not.

When?
When will the map game start? As there has been no start time listed yet. Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 10:02, February 13, 2015 (UTC)

When I talked to MP yesterday, he said that the game would be starting sometime over the weekend. Saturn 10:18, February 13, 2015 (UTC)

Re: China Part II
Since China is in the middle of its Civil War, do I control all the Chinese factions or just the '''Kuomintang? '''

Just whatever faction you signed up for. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Note
Hello, this is QC (QuebecanCanada), I cannot post with my account as my computer broke down, my mobile broke down and my tablet broke down, so I have to use this computer, and on this one I am not logged in on my account, so I will have to post anonymously, this is just a Note not to revert my edits. - QC

Canada
Hey mods, why are all of my diplomacy actions deleted? Isn't that the point? You do know that Canada was separate enough from Britain to make its own decisions about foreign affairs, right?

~ Vatonica

You are aware that history has happened before 1933, right? You already have relations with half of these countries and the other half are basically fascist killing machines that bear no relevance to Canada.

18:40, February 16, 2015 (UTC)

Am I not allowed to specify where my embassy is? That is important, and not clear in history. And can't I choose who I form relations with?

~ Vatonica


 * Please sign your statements. Also, you have embassies with most of those countries already.


 * 19:48, February 16, 2015 (UTC)

Also, may I ask, why were my diplomacy turns crossed out (Although I am completly fine with the crossing out, jusk asking why) ~ QC

Please Answer my question. Isn't the point to choose which countries I form relations with? I have a strategy, and it involves Japan. Is that not allowed? And for the other countries, I'd like to specify where the embassy is and confirm that the other countries recognize me, so I ask for embassies in countries Canada already had embassies in. I find it useful to have that confirmation. There is no need to cross something out for it being useless if it does something. Vatonica

The relations have to be realistic. for example you can't have the Nazis ally with the FRench then take over Europe. That would be very ASBish, and map games like this are supposed to be realistic. Saturn 22:38, February 16, 2015 (UTC)

So basically, I can't change what I already have, and I can't do anything new. So basically, the map game has no point. Isn't the idea that it ISN'T excactly the same, and that's why it's interesting? Nothing interesting about doing the exact same thing as has already done before. If you want that to happen, then you can just write that yourself. Vatonica (I know I'm Right)

No, the point is that you can do whatever you want, but you have to be somewhat realistic at this moment in time. The Britsh Empire and its dominions had shaky relations between Japan and them, so it wouldn't be realistic to establish a major embassy. You can do things, but don't get all unrealistic from OTL. Saturn 00:47, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

So based on this, name a country that I don't have an embassy with already that you wouldn't reject. You rejected Venezuela even for reason I don't know. Vatonica

I didn't say anything about Venezuela at all. I would check to see what nations the British Commonwealth had close relations with, and then go from there. France might be a good start. Saturn 02:49, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

Venezuela is a impoverished mess that is not doing well at this point in time, so we do not want to spend time and cash building embassy in Canada.The River Nile-2 (talk) 03:13, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

Vatonica, you might as well quit the game if you kep this attitude. Canada getting relations with Japan? Not in a million years. Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 10:25, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

Sean, i think he was just asking. - QC

No, don't worry, I have stuff planned that will make my mark. Vatonica

Just because you "can", does not mean you "would". Many of these nations you are trying to build relations with you either A) Have relations with them already, B) Its dumb to build relaltions with at this point, or C) you would't have built relations with at this point.

Having this argument on chat kept getting the Westminster decleration thrown at me. Yea, that may have given Canada the power to control some aspects of foregin poliocy, but if you look at OTL, Canada had formal relations with few nations before the 1940s. So it's clear that even if they had this power, they didn't fancy using it. On top of that, Canada is, despite the westminster treaty, dominated by England. Same with the other domains.

Vatican City
Why has the purchase of the formal papal enclave in Avignon been crossed out? Its a castle, a few chapels, and limited gardens and small houses within the complex. Currently, France has to pour money into restoration of it. Additionaly, there is historic precent (from 1929-1930s) for the Holy See to purcahse many buildings and properities within Italy which served as extraterritoriality region for the Holy See. The border would not be closed to the French, but rather the same as the Vatican City and Rome's relationship. If necessary I could write a formal treaty if that would make everyone feel better. g greg e  (talk)  22:31, February 16, 2015 (UTC)

Any mod response at all ? g greg e  (talk)  19:37, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

While I don't know who was responsible for the crossing out of your post, I can suggest a reasoning for it. The Vatican had just recently regained its independence and I feel like too the instance of losing said independence put a damper on any plans of expansion. This is just my idea, I'm not entirely sure what the reasoning of both the expansion and the crossing out is.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 19:42, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

Its not like im trying to purchase vast swathes of land. Its a deal that made sense for both parties. The reason for expansion is to use it as a place to get to catholics in France and western europe (and to potentially have a place to go if the Italian government turns hostile - which the papacy was still no 100% trusting of mussolini and other italian leaders despite italia's large catholic population). If no one has any objections otherwise could the crossing out be rescinded? g greg e  (talk)  07:22, February 18, 2015 (UTC)

Unless anyone else has other objections can I assume that I can purchase my few buildings as an extraterritoriality? g greg e  (talk)  13:51, February 19, 2015 (UTC)

Whichever mod crossed it out, can they offer me some feedback please? g greg e  (talk)  19:52, February 19, 2015 (UTC)

Hey yall I am alerting you that ill be gone for the next few days due to midterms. Thanks for understanding g greg e   (talk)  08:12, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Algorithim
We need an Algorithim. - QC

From what I have heard, I think that the algorithm is on Edge's sandbox. Not sure thought. Saturn 13:35, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

There is an algorithm, it's just that we keep forgeting to post it. There shouldn't be too many wars at this point either.

Liechtenstein
What happens to Liechtenstein? Someone just took it over yet I had already started the process for union with Switzerland. • 14:02, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

I am currently playing as Liechtenstein. I am open to having good relations with you, I just prefer to not be annexed. Also if you were hoping to annex Liechtenstein on turn one like that, that's probably implausible anyway. Tr0llis (talk) 14:09, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

Liechtenstein was not going to be annexed. They would unite with Switzerland. It would have taken a few years to complete the union though, which I would still like to see through as it would benefit both nations. • 14:21, February 17, 2015 (UTC)

Location
Location goes by the location of the nearest large concentration of troops.


 * Defending nation: at heartland: +5


 * On the border +4


 * A city close to the border +3


 * Far from the border +2


 * Opposite side of nation +0


 * No former presence +0 (you have to have troops in the location before the attack)

You can only have one; it will be of the Leader nation closest to the area.

Power
Aerial assault is tangent with location. For the attacker, your aerial power must be close enough to the location of attack, with your land nearby for the planes to return to.

Naval assault is only applicable when attacking a coast.

Land assault is also tangent with location. No requirements for land assault other than being somewhat near to the border.


 * Large aerial assault capability +3


 * Large naval assault capability +3


 * Large land assault capability +3


 * Medium aerial assault capability +3 (if enemy has no aerial power) +2 (if the enemy has aerial power)


 * Medium naval assault capability +3 (if the enemy has no naval power) +2 (if the enemy has their navy stationed in or around the location)


 * Medium land capability +3 (if three or more times larger than enemy) +2 (if less than three times larger than enemy)


 * Small aerial capability:+1


 * small naval capability:+1


 * small land capability: +1

Land, aerial, and naval is compounded. If you have large naval, medium air, and medium land, your score is 9 or 7. You cannot have medium aerial and large aerial at the same time.

Power is averaged in a coalition war.

''' Ahem: from now on, Power will work as a MULTIPLIER to development. You can increase your power, too, through development. '''

Industrial Strength

 * US, Germany, USSR,UK: +5


 * France, Japan: +4


 * Brazil, Italy, Czechoslovakia: +3


 * China, colonies of the UK and France, rest of Europe, Ethiopia, South America, Saudi Arabia, Turkey: +2


 * Everyone else: +1

Industry is added up for all participants in a war.

Scores will be changed over time.

Power Caps
Based on your industrial strength, you have a cap on your power


 * +5=power caps at 9


 * +4=power caps at 7


 * +3=power caps at 5


 * +2=power caps at 4


 * +1=power caps at 3

Development

 * Military and Economic: Power x # of turns of development in that past 10 years (20 turns)


 * Infrastructure: Power x # of turns of development in that past 10 years (20 turns) (defender only)

Nuclear Weapons

 * +7 if major city is destroyed


 * +7 for first nuclear attack


 * +6 if minor city is destroyed


 * +5 for retaliatory attack


 * +10 for the first nuclear attack ever (can only be used for the first use of a nuclear weapon)

Chance

 * The last digit of each editor's edit count. In case of PC-NPC war, NPC automatically gets 5.

Motive

 * Economic (Gains land, resorce, etc): +2


 * Defending territory not owned by nation more than 20 years: +3


 * Defending territory not part of heartland but held for more than 20 years: + 4


 * Taking territory of similar culture but not part of nation: + 4


 * Aiding an Ally: + 5


 * Pre-emptive Strike: +5


 * Taking back territory recently held by nation but since lost: + 6


 * Defending Heartland from attack that will not cripple/ destroy nation: + 6


 * Aiding Social/Moral Kinsmen who are being oppressed: + 6


 * Attacking to enforce politcal hegemony: +7


 * Defending Core/heartland from possibly fatal attack + 8


 * Defending from nuclear armed nation that has a motive over 5 and has not yet used their weaponry: + 8


 * Defending from nuclear armed nation, regardless of motive, that has used said weaponry: + 9


 * Defending from attack that will wipe out nation and culture: + 10


 * Modifiers:


 * Non-democratic Government supported by people: + 3


 * Democratic government supported by people: + 4


 * Government not supported by people: -5


 * Troop Morale high (requires motive over 5, chance over 6, and stronger development scores in at least one category): + 5


 * Troop Morale low (any of the above: chance below 1, lower development scores in all categories, recent war penalty over 8): -5


 * Fighting Guerilla War: -5 attacker, + 1 defender


 * Implausibility: -2 per impluasibility


 * Warning: Negative motive scores are possible!!


 * Lead nation's motive, not average.

​Population

 * Greater than 100 million +20


 * Greater than 50 million +15


 * Greater than 30 million +10


 * Less than 30 million +5


 * Larger than opponents: + 2


 * 2x size of opponent's: + 5


 * 5x size of opponent's: + 10


 * 10x: +15


 * Every further order of Magnitude (eg 20x, 30x): +20


 * ONLY of the leading nations

Allies

 * Leader Nations: +5 each participating


 * Military aid: + 4 each participating


 * Supplies: + 3 each participating


 * Cultural Support: +1 each participating


 * Vassal: -2 each participating


 * Withdrawal: - 2 each nation which was participating and then left


 * ex: China (L) Vietnam (M) France (S) Britain (C) Japan (MV) Korea (SV) = 5 + 4 + 3 + 1 + 2 + 1 = 16


 * Please note that Vassals CANNOT give Cultural aid

Number of Troops

 * 1) of friendlies/# of enemies
 * Takes effect the 1940.5 turn.

Recent Wars

 * Each year in the past 15 years where nation was a...


 * Leader: -3


 * Military aider: -2


 * Supplier: -1

Participation
Both Sides get a +10 for this

Fighting on Multiple Fronts

 * Divide your power by the number of Fronts. Round to nearest whole number

Results
The equation for gains from war algorithms is (p)*(1-1/(2x)), where x is the number of the years the war goes on and p is the amount of territory determined by the algorithm ((y/(z+y))*2)-1 where y is the winner's score and z is the losers). So if your war lasts one year, you only get 50% of the territory, but if you let the war last five years, you get 90% of the territory. The minimum amount of territory you can win from an algorithm is 1%, otherwise it is a percentage of the loser's territories to two decimal places e.g. 13.69% not 13.69242%.

A great calculator for this is http://web2.0calc.com/ you just copy and paste the equations into the box and replace the letters with the numbers for that specific war. And then you just copy the answer to the main page. Or folks, just use Google. Their automatic calculator is a great aid in working out all this.

There will be on algo per phase/front of the war- NOT PER BATTLE, and ONLY for MAJOR wars.

If a certain war appears Implausible or otherwise, the mods reserve the right to change the amount of land gained.

Notice
My sister has an activity that ends at school which ends at 4:00 PM PST, which is also 00:00 UTC, when the turn starts. As such, I will have to post when I get home which will be after the new turn starts. I can't post the turn now because it is long and I have to go to bed soon. Thus I ask permission in advance to post my turn after the turn ends. Thank you KawaiiKame (talk) 05:46, February 18, 2015 (UTC)

Permission granted. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Suggestion
I think we should recruit the former players of the first Axis vs Allies and other Axis vs Allies map games to play this one. - QC

They're already free to join (or already have). Mscoree (talk) 13:02, February 18, 2015 (UTC)

OK. - QC

Canada again
Mods, I need to have this settled. How much freedom from the UK do I have as Canada?

Vatonica (talk) 01:30, February 19, 2015 (UTC)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominion

Im not mod, but I found this- "Dominion status was formally defined in the Balfour Declaration of 1926, which recognised these countries as "autonomous Communities within the British Empire", thus acknowledging them as political equals of the United Kingdom; the Statute of Westminster 1931 converted this status into legal reality, making them essentially independent members of what was then called the British Commonwealth." I think you run everything except forieng relations with the UK, the other British Dominions and the British colonies. The River Nile-2 (talk) 02:16, February 19, 2015 (UTC)

You have some foregin relations freedom, but for the most part, that should fall in line with what the British do. Canada was isolationist in this era. Even though they could establish relations abroad, they didn't for various reasons.

Joining as a rebel organization
I might play here as the Azad Hind, a gorup of restless Indian nationalists. Is it allowed? IstocnoSarajevo (talk) 12:40, February 19, 2015 (UTC)

Yes. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Quited
The year was not turned by the mods, so I quit.The River Nile-2 (talk) 01:27, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

Ok, bye.

Me too. I obviously wasn't happy being Canada. I'd rejoin as a different country, if allowed, or as a terrorist organization, But not Canada. Vatonica (talk) 02:37, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

we could use some more asia and americas flavor...or eastern europe g greg e   (talk)  02:38, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

Japan

 * Location: 4
 * Power: 6
 * Industrial Strength: Japan (4)
 * Development: Mill and Econ (6*4+(6*4)) 48
 * Chance: 8
 * Motive: Economic: 2
 * Modifier: Non. democratic gov spported: 3
 * Population: 20
 * Allies: Japan (L) Manchukuo (LV) Korea (MV) West Paupa (MV)=5+5+4+4-2-2-2=12
 * Recent Wars: 0
 * Participation: 10
 * Total: 111

China

 * Location: 5
 * Power: 4/2=2
 * Industrial: 2
 * Development: Mill and Econ: (4*2) 8
 * Development: infra. (4*2) 8
 * Chance: 1
 * Motive: Defending from attack not destroying nation: 6
 * Modifier: Government supported: -5
 * Population: 20+5
 * Allies: China (L): 5
 * Recent Wars: (1) -3
 * participation: 10
 * Fronts: 2
 * Total: 62

Result
(111/62+111)*2)-1=.28

14% in a year, 21% in 2.

Discussion
Why is USSR even helping Japan? From what I know, relations between USSR and Japan were pretty bad since they have a lot of disputes and fought a series of border conflicts from between 1932 - 1945. I am aware that this game is different from otl, but I really have not noticed any particular change in relations between Japan and USSR. Seems rather strange for USSR and Japan to jointly invade China. "It's not going  to suck itself."  16:53, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

These should be their own seperate fronts IMO. Also, I think the USSR was already invading China but I would have to double check.

China is in civil war atm, might want to change the government support modifier. Saturn 19:14, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

Accoring to Mp, these where supposed to be seperate wars, so this will be fixed.

Soviet Union
Total:90
 * Location:+2
 * Power:+5
 * Industrial Strenght:+5
 * Military:3*5=15
 * Economy:3*5=15
 * Chance:+9
 * Motive:+2
 * Motive mods:+3
 * Population:+20
 * NPS: Russia (L) Mongolia (MV) Tuva (MV)=5+4+4-2-2=+9
 * Recent Wars:0 (I think)
 * Participation:+10

China

 * Location: 5
 * Power: 4/2=2
 * Industrial: 2
 * Development: Mill and Econ: (4*2) 8
 * Development: infra. (4*2) 8
 * Chance: 1
 * Motive: Defending from attack not destroying nation: 6
 * Modifier: Government supported: -5
 * Population: 20+5
 * Allies: China (L): 5
 * Recent Wars: (1) -3
 * participation: 10
 * Fronts: 2
 * Total: 62

Result
18% max

9% in a year, 13% in 2

Activity
I won't be home on the weekend so I don't think I'd be able to post my turns. I just hope I'm not removed or suddenly invaded cause of that. • 15:27, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

Oh, and is it possible to get another user to post for me? Nk has offered to post what I add. • 15:50, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

Yeah other people can post for you.

19:38, February 20, 2015 (UTC)

Brazil Implausibility
The Brazil player has, in the space of four years, turned Brazil from an impoverished country reliant on the West into an independent economic superpower that is vassalizing hostile Spanish-speaking nations, massively building up its military, and trying to form a South American European Union.

I, for one, am calling bullshit on this. Let's not forget that, at this time, South America was hugely dependent on the West economically. There is no way the United States would plausibly let Brazil build a possibly hostile EU-type organization in its strategic backyard. Not only that, but Brazil's neighbours will never plausibly let it "vassalize" or influence them. Uruguay, Paraguay and Venezuela, (the three targets thus far), all have different reasons to dislike Brazil, and there is no way they would plausibly let themselves be pressured into economic subservience by a somewhat foreign culture. Any such organization would not be led by Brazil, but by a fellow Spanish-speaking nation.

Second, Brazil was not a stable military power at this point. It had three revolts, including by both Communists and Fascists, over this period, as a quick look at Wikipedia will reveal. There were attempts at secession, massive general strikes, and general instability and unrest. ATL Brazil, meanwhile, has discarded the the Depression at least five years early, suffered no serious unrest, and is even making massive purchases of foreign arms. In fact, Brazil has even proposed to intervene in Central America, something so far outside its capabilities at this point that I am amazed it hasn't been crossed out already. Brazil at this point was poor, unstable and massively corrupt. Suddenly, Brazil has magically transformed itself into regional power. It even is acting to halt Communism, despite the fact that Brazil at this point had a massive Communist movement which was fighting in the streets with right-wing elements. OTL, this was crushed by the police, but ATL, it seems to have magically vanished instead. Can we see some mod action please, or we'll see an implausible-ass South American Empire by 1940. Shikata ga nai! 01:33, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

I have never claimed to be an economincally independent superpower or any such thing. Im trying to build up heavy industry im not saying its not corrupt either but me saying improvements in certain things does not remove the point that there is still corruption among other things im just not talking about it. Far enough into this, Getulio Vargas was a fascists for the most part. As for the communist element. Communism was not in the streets fighting as you so say, there may have been a few riots but Brazil was nowhere near being a communist country. As for riots and unrest that is the mods job not mine. If they see it as implausible then they can give me some unrest but im not stopping a solid development program that Vargas did OTL.

You also seem to have missed the point that i have in fact put in a much different constitution than OTL which would easily negate a communist upheavel especially if they could gain their power legitimately.

As for the depression i havent discarded it. I am nowhere near pushing out of the depression but i am also once again not talking about the problems that are present because those are really for me to try and figure out how to handle. I will handle them when they are an issue or i deem them needed to be addressed. But as of right now Brazil had loads of potential period end of story and im exploiting Vargas's monopoly on power to handle this.. Unless you have spent a year doing research on the capabilities and issues of Brazil (which i have been) then i would suggest calming down and letting a mod address the problem. I am also not even trying to make an implausible south american empire. I am fostering relations and going off of what Venezuelas player did before he left. He set me up for influence. The last game i was Brazil Venezuela had a major revolt that i helped crush when i wasnt even a great power yet, i had my unrest and im going to address it. As someone who thought you could colonize greenland as a native state i dont really thing you should be going after me.

Just as a heads up, if this devloves into a pissing match instead of a debate, the ban hammer will be used. Also keep this within AvA Feud, Bringing Pm3 into this will only cause more issues.

Also, any claims made need sources to back them up. No source means your claim is invalid. This is Edge, He is a cool guy when he isn't too lazy to sign his real sig. Hit him up. 01:51, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

Well to back me up, the Brazilian government OTL while corrupt managed to gain a solid industrial base under Vargas OTL just lesser than the current one im building right now. OTL Vargas was moderate industry focus, mine is Heavy industry focused. The Vargas Era while a dictatorship was one of recognized industrial improvement under his Industry friendly policies. Im just perpetuating those with heavy industry and a plan to empty out the favelas as well by putting people to work voluntarily in the Amazons (for whatever resource or settlement opportunity). My industry focus in the southwest will undoubtedly cause class conflict which i will address when the time comes but its really not too pressing of an issue right now. Since i took over in 33 i have had plenty of breathing room to avoid the 35 on upheavals of communists and fascists by putting people to work pretty much. It may still be there but its definitively delayed until probably 1939-1941.

As for the Great Depression the amount of people being put to work (as well as foreign purchases increasing) is simply implementing economics that i have mentioned to the point of having Vargas's political favor running out if he does any more really. People are being put to work and some people arent happy, sorry but it still doesnt change the fact i can make foreign purchases for various projects and developments. Debt or no debt i am allowed to make these purchases regardless which is purposfully my point in buying heavy industry product from aborad so i can increase my own domestic heavy industry development by using that base status to expand it. I even mentioned my industrial production is slowed due to the lack of industry producing the consumer goods among other things. Also as for Rapidly industrializing, thats not implausible. Brazil doesnt have a dust bowl and doesnt have the same crop shortage as the US which drove people to cities i have other problems of just stuff being too cheap for the few main exporting industries in the country.. I buy coffee crop from farmers and burn it to keep them soluble as coffee growers (OTL this happened) and in general im just trying to migrate a good portion of people from that to new industries (steel and some manufacturing) in states that have pretty decent coal reserves which i think is relatively plausible.

As for military development and purchases, i was planning on having it develop up to a point until the political support for it dies down a bit and the Great Depression is over. My military development and purchases is purely to employ a crap ton of people for a good long while, WW2 brought multiple countries out of the Depression through military purchases and development. Simply put, the overspending on equipment allows for alot mroe jobs, might increase the debt but it doesnt really have an effect other than having weaponry for troops and having employed more general purpose people as a result.

As for the potential meddling in guatemala, Vargas was anti-communist as anything and im almost completely sure if he had the ability he would have prevented communism from expanding into Central america. Venezuela in general is of the point of the previous players on agreements with me. He wanted economic development and defense and i was going to help provide that. He essentially opened the whole country to influence when he accepted a deal to jointly develop oil.

Given that there doesn't seem to be a plan for a new Brazilian Empire, the domestic unrest hasn't just vanished, and the economic stuff is justified by OTL, Brazil seems fairly plausible to me. So I guess this is cleared up, at least to my satisfaction. Shikata ga nai! 02:25, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

PS-Venezuela has a trade and defence agreement with Guatamala, I know, I was the foremer Venezuela. The River Nile-2 (talk) 14:44, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

Austria

 * Location: +4
 * Power: +4
 * Industrial Strength: +4
 * Development: +44 (Military), +4 (Economy)
 * Chance: +6
 * Motive: +6, +3, +5
 * Population: +5
 * Allies: +5 (Yugoslavia), +4 (Soviet Union)
 * Participation: +10
 * Overall = +104

Czechoslovakia

 * Location: +5
 * Power: +1
 * Industrial Strength: +3
 * Development: +3 (Military), +3 (Economy), +2 (Infrastructure)
 * Chance: +5
 * Motive: +8, +4, -5
 * Population: +7
 * Allies: +5 (Germany), +5 (Poland)
 * Participation: +10
 * Overall= +56

Result
Austria wins by 37%. 35% in 1 year.

Discussion
Good god.. All those headings are killing me.. "It's not going  to suck itself."  06:09, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

this algo needs to be adjusted since i joined on the side of czechoslovakia, which is plausibl under the anti-communist regime in currently in. With Blood and Iron (talk) 15:21, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

This algo does need to be updated for the incoming support for Czechoslovakia - LightningLynx89

NK needs to put his dev scores here. ~ Blocky858

I need dev scores, people. ~ Blocky858

i dont know what my score is but ive developed every turn military and economy so. also the ussr isnt involved and france would be involved independent of their alliance ot germany on the grounds of the czech-french alliance, and the polish-french alliance. With Blood and Iron (talk) 03:32, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Let's use LL's algo. +44 military? His seems more accurate.  Happy65  Messages  07:19, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

The Soviet Union aren't participating. It's just a few independents from the Soviet Union without official government authorisation. I'm pretty sure that Austria and 200 Yugoslavians would not win against Germany, France, Poland. If this is our algo, then something is HORRIBLY wrong.  Happy65  Messages  15:18, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

We forgot about the 45,000 Danes fihgting in Austria, guys. • 18:44, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

Ireland
I was wondering could I join as Ireland? I'm asking because it does not appear on the nations list. I think Ireland would have an intresting alternative WWII History if The Fascist Leader Eoin O'Duffy got into power or perhaps joined Britain in the war in hopes that it would lead them closer to having Northern Ireland returned to them. These are both realistic, the second was considered by the Irish government and the first is something that was a rising movement before Eoin O'Duffy was arrested to prevent it becoming a fascist state. People also feared that the arrest would lead to a non- Democratic state, I think these are intresting plausible scenarios. I would also ask to reserve Ireland for myself if it's allowed. I'm activeon the General portal of Wikias 5-6 days a week.

Masterire (talk) 17:31, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

Go for it.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 20:17, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

Don't know how plausable that is, but you can play as Ireland.

Germany and France: Allies?
So it seems to be a topic that has very mixed opinoins, but Germany and France seem to be way to close in this game. So I decided to open up a fourm for people to voice their opinions on this issue. NOTE: THE VOTING SECTION IS ONLY FOR MODS, but everyone is welcome to say something here. Mods, Vote Aye if you think the alliance is plausable, or nay if you don't think it is plausable.

Disscussion
An alliance? No way. Trade? Better. It isn't plausible really at this time, but tbh it wouldn't be ASB without the Germans not re-arming the Rhineland and with the Soviet threat in Eastern Europe. Depends, I guess. Saturn 21:01, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

I think that it is fine. Without Hitler, I think it makes sense for the two countries to join against communism. Vatonica (talk) 22:16, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

Nope. A non-aggression pact is far better than a straight up alliance. Remember that World War I was less than a generation ago. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Also, let's not forget that the Communists were massively powerful in France right now. A Socialist-led Front Populaire government led France after the 1936 elections. The French electorate sees Germany as more of a threat than Communism. Shikata ga nai! 01:36, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Who is to say the socialist-led Front Populaire is in power right now? It's all really up to me who's in power, and by the way I've been writing the right seems more in control than the left. -  .....   Because I'm Just... Too... SSSWWWEEEEEETTT!!!

if there is an issue with my dealings with france there is no problem with the alliance being rolled backed however a non aggression pact would still in place, and with a huge change in german policies the deals would have happened lets face it germany was going to remilitarize nazis or no nazis. france couldnt do anything to stop it otl and they wouldnt have been able to here but in the atl case the change in german regime wpuld have allowed for a more pragmatic solution which would have allowed for french and german eventual reapporachment dont get me wrong germany and france would still have issues and tensions but it wouldnt be as alarming as the rapid expansion of communism in europe. With Blood and Iron (talk) 03:19, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

also a heads up most of my diplomatic stances this ava are based on the harry turtledove series the war that came euarly. the germasn, brits, and french do actually form an alliance against the soviets in the book, and poland sides with germany as well, and if i have a saner leader then the fuhrer i honestly dont see why a legit anti-communist league cant be established, on the grounds of keeping peace in europe. but again its up to the mods With Blood and Iron (talk) 03:53, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

I don't see why you couldn't form the alliance, but I still see it as unrealistic. Only one generation had passed since WWI and there'd still be much animosity between French and Germans. • 13:19, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Neither France nor Germany should be taking major positions on this war and they definitely shouldn't be fighting on the same side of the war.

22:57, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

germany qould have a vested interest in the conflict as it is trying to stop the spread of left wing idealogies and lets face it pan germanism was still strong in germany even withouit the nazis. as for france historically the french had a alliance with the czechs so it is a legitimate cause to get involved in the austro-czech war. With Blood and Iron (talk) 17:45, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

Austria

 * Location: +4 (On the border)
 * Power: +4 (Large Land + Small Air Force)
 * Industrial Strength: 2+2= +4 (Austrian + Yugoslavians)
 * Development: 2x5 = +10 (Military), 2x2 = +4 (Economy)
 * Chance: +6
 * Motive: +6 (Taking Back Territory), +5 (Preemptive Strike)
 * Population: +5 (Smaller than the Czech’s population alone)
 * Allies: +5 (Yugoslavia), +4 (Soviet Union)
 * Participation: +10
 * Total = 67

Czechoslovakia

 * Location: +5
 * Power: +2 (Less than opponent's military)
 * Industrial Strength: +3+5+4+2 = +14 (Czechs + Germany + France + Poland)
 * Development: +3 (Military), +3 (Economy), +2 (Infrastructure) = +8
 * Chance: +5
 * Motive: +8 (Defending Core/Heartland), +4 (Defending part of the Homeland)
 * Population: +7
 * Allies: +5 (Germany), +5 (Poland), +5 (France)
 * Participation: + 10
 * Total = 78

Results
Czechoslovakian and Allied victory

Discussion
It may not be perfect, but you can change thing, that +44 Military was atrocious though -   and you, and now half the... GI JOE!

Seems more like it.  Happy65  Messages  07:22, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

You guys don't seem to understand how the algo works. From what I've been told by Edge, each Leader nation's dev scores are added together and then multiplied by the power. I got 11 overall multiplied by my 4 power is 44. Blocky858 (talk) 08:51, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

This is also why I was asking for your guys' dev scores, which none of you posted. Blocky858 (talk) 08:52, February 24, 2015 (UTC)\

I also believe I have a large air force + high morale. Blocky858 (talk) 08:56, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Austria wouldnt have large anything... no way you can field a large airforce in your current small state. Your reall over-estimating your capabilities.

Power is averaged together, then multiplied by the total development scores. Power is limited by Indsutrial capablity.

I have a large military and a large airforce, Feud, what are you talking about? Blocky858 (talk) 20:09, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Austria
Total:53
 * Location:+4
 * Power:4/2=2
 * Idustry:+2
 * MIlitary:5*2=10
 * Economy:1*2=2
 * Chance:+6
 * Motive:Taken Back territory=+6
 * Motive modifiers:
 * Population:=5 (Assuming Yugoslavia doesn't lead, then this might change)
 * Allies: Austria (L) Yugoslavia (?) Soviet Union (S)=+8
 * Participation:+10
 * Fronts:2

Allied Forces
Total:95
 * Location:+5
 * Power:+6 (Assuming that Germany and co. aren't leading)
 * Industry:+4
 * Military:3*6=18
 * Economy:3*6=18
 * Infra:3*6=18
 * Chance:=5
 * Motive:+6
 * Motive Modifers:+4
 * Population:+7
 * Allies: Czechoslovakia (L) France (MS) Germany (?) Poland (?)
 * Participation:+10

Result
Czech forces hold back Austria.

Disscussion
Need Austria's development. ~Eon

5 Military, 1 Economy. Yugoslavia is a leader. Also, why do I not get high morale..? Blocky858 (talk) 00:04, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

Didn't Yugoslavia send like 200 troops? That amount is so small I highly doubt it would make them a leader. Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 09:42, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

Either way, they sent troops. Also, remove France. Blocky858 (talk) 23:50, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

France will be allowed to stay cause they aren't invading with Germany.

Since it's taken so long to finalize this, it would make sense saying that this war has lasted from 1937 through 1939. Starting to enter into the realms of World War II.

Canadian representative
Canada

After looking at the lack of a Canadian representative, I would like to join.

Thisismacedon (talk) 01:05, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

Just notice that Canada has done stuff (I used to be in charge of it, but then I switched to Poland after debates about Canada's sovereignty). Vatonica (talk) 01:36, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

Canada has done little stuff tho. Nothing else than getting embassies really. Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here)

I still want to join since I am a new joiner of this wiki and Canada did have many internal issues

38.116.192.102 22:20, February 25, 2015 (UTC) Thisismacedon

The German Reich
Total = 175
 * Location: +4
 * Power: +6
 * Large Land Assault Capability: +3
 * Large Aerial Assault Capability: +3
 * Industrial Strength: +5
 * Development: 8+8=16*6=96
 * Chance: +0
 * Motive: +7 [Enforcing Political Hegemony]
 * ​High Morale:+5
 * Non Demo support:=3
 * Population: +15 [Greater than 50 Million], +15 [10x of Enemy Population] = +30
 * Allies: German Reich [+5], Poland [+3] = +8
 * Participation: +10

Austrian Peoples Republic
Total = 59
 * Location: +5
 * Power: +4/2
 * Medium Land Assault Capability: +2
 * Medium Aerial Assault Capability: +2
 * Industrial Strength: +2
 * Development: 5+1=6*2=12
 * Chance: +5
 * Motive: +8 [Fatal Attack]
 * Population: +5 [Less than 30 Million]
 * Allies: Austria [+5], USSR [+4] = +9
 * Participation: +10
 * Fronts:2

Result
Well, once we get Dev scores and this algo turns out to be correct.. Then we can find out! "It's not going  to suck itself."  18:08, February 26, 2015 (UTC)

2 year collapse.

Yugoslavia

 * Location: 2
 * Medium land capability +2/2=1
 * Industry: 2
 * Development: 10*1=10
 * Modivation: Taking territory of similar culture but not part of nation: + 4
 * Motive Mods:Non Demo supported:+3
 * Poulation: Less than 50 mil:+5, 10x larger:=15
 * Recent Wars: Supplier: -1
 * Allies:Yugoslavia (L):=5
 * Participation:+10
 * Fronts:2
 * Total: 55

Albania

 * Location: 5
 * small land capability: +1
 * Industry: 4
 * Development: 10*1=10
 * Modivation: Defending Core/heartland from possibly fatal attack + 8
 * Motive Mods: Demo Supported:+4 (no idea about this tbh)
 * Poulation: Less than 30 million:+5
 * Recent Wars: Supplier: 0
 * Allies: Albania (L) France (S)=8
 * Fronts:1
 * Participation:+10
 * Total: 54

Results
Less than 1 precent. Do not pass go. Do not collect your $200. I award you no points, and may god have mercy on your soul.

Disscussion
I know I did the math wrong, please help me - Scarlet Outlaw

You did it very wrong. Luckily, I have experience regarding the equation. Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 15:50, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

Greece and France both provided weapons to Albania, if it makes any difference. Alexander of Volzhsky Talk  01:11, February 26, 2015 (UTC)

I really don't want to be 'that' guy but I really doubt Greece is in any condition to fund resistance in other nations when it was a 600,000 army which pretty much should have led to complete and total economic collapse for Greece. In any case, Greece shouldn't be providing weapons.. It should be sending soldiers as it is. "It's not going  to suck itself."  06:16, February 26, 2015 (UTC)

Greece could send supplies(only if the whole giant army thing was cancelled/crossed out). Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here)

this is wrong in a lot of ways. A lot. I will fix it later. This is Edge, He is a cool guy when he isn't too lazy to sign his real sig. Hit him up. 20:27, February 26, 2015 (UTC)

Why is the navy not invovled? This is Edge, He is a cool guy when he isn't too lazy to sign his real sig. Hit him up. 03:14, February 27, 2015 (UTC)

Up's seciton will be up later. ~Eon

Edge, Yugoslavia is no longer a kingdom. And given the opposition against them, they would lose. • 15:44, February 27, 2015 (UTC)

The Navy is not invovled due to the fact this is a land attack/land war. - Scarlet Outlaw

I do not see anything about him changing his government at all. May have missed it. If so, direct me to the turn in question.

Ethiopian Representative
Since Canada has been taken today, I feel like I want an Ethiopian representative since it has an independent foreign policy, military and foreign policy.

Thisismacedon (talk) 02:25, February 26, 2015 (UTC)

You don't need to ask on the talkpage to sign up as a nation. You can just go ahead and sign up. Saturn 02:28, February 26, 2015 (UTC)

Liechtenstein
Trollis hasn't posted since the first turn, so as per the rules the nation should be made vacant. • 15:15, February 26, 2015 (UTC)

AFK and Some Algo Calrity
So I will be going on a debate tournament this weekend. Last minute cramming has led to me having to take a bit of time off. Will be back Sunday. Do not kill each other while I am gone. I will fix the German-Austria War and Yugoslavia War later today.

Algo Clarity
 * So this algo is based off of the R-Word Algo, hwoever it is my interpretation of such algo
 * Development Scores count as +1 per turn.
 * If a nation Sends supplies and has a higer industry score then the leaders, use the suppliers
 * if a nation is sending MIlitary support, power should go up, assuming the Military aider has a larger industry.
 * If a nation is leading it must invade on it's own. In this case you use the higher industry, average the powers, and use all nations development.
 * Troop numbers will be added to the algo at some point.

Nuclear Weapons PSA
People seem to be under the misconception that nuclear weapons are easy to create. Yet, I must remind everyone that as of right now, there is no country on earth that can create a successful nuclear weapons program. There are three problems: scientists, resources, and motivation. It took a letter from some of the most well-known physicists in the world at the time to convince the world's leading superpower to begin the nuclear project; there is absolutely no reason some backwater country would start nuke research because of its potential; with the money spent on a nuke project, said nation could have trained and equipped a thousand armies, navies, and air forces.

The Manhattan Project cost 2 billion USD, or 26 billion adjusted for inflation. It involved over 130,000 people, 30+ locations, and almost a hundred scientists. It was, until the Space Race, the most resource-consuming project in human history.

As of right now, America is the closest to the bomb - it has the scientists and resources. However, it lacks the motivation - why start an economically taxing weapons program based on an unproven theory in the midst of the Great Depression? The Soviet Union and Brazil lack the scientists and resources, although it has more motivation. So I want to get this straight right now: no one is producing a bomb until 1945 at the earliest, and most nations apart from America and the Soviet Union (hint, hint, Brazil) won't be able to get them until the late '50s. So please, I don't want to see Japan developing a nuke and dropping it on LA during WWII. The schedule for nuke development (assuming the American player doesn't "accidentally" find the Soviet spy rings in the Manhattan Project) should be as follows:

1945-1948 1949-1955 1956-1960
 * America
 * Soviet Union
 * Germany
 * Britain
 * France
 * Brazil

Just putting this out there before I have to cross out some post in 1941 claiming Australia has detonated a nuclear weapon. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

france and brazil before my great east asia :(. hell one might have been tested in 1945 near Konan Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

Modship
I, TechnicallyIAmSean, want to apply for modship. The game currently has over 35 players, and thus I feel that adding 1 or 2 mods would be good. I am also online for big parts of the day and I can quickly cross out implausibilities and I can work with the algo too. If I'm needed to, I can also help with the map. So yeah, this is my application. Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 11:30, February 27, 2015 (UTC)

Invasion of Timor
GEACOPS
 * Location: 3
 * Power: 4 (7-2 fronts)
 * Development: Mil and Econ (8*4): 32
 * Chance: 4
 * Motive: Economic 2
 * Modifier: Non-Dem supported: 3
 * Population: Greater than 100: 20. 5x: 10 = 30
 * Allies: Japan (L) Imperial China (LV) West Papua (LV) Korea (MV) Menjiang (SV)= 14
 * Recent wars: -3
 * Participation: 10
 * Total: 97

Portugal

 * Location: 5
 * Power: 3/3=1
 * Development: mil and econ (2*1): 2
 * Dev: infra (2*1): 2
 * Chance: 6
 * Motive: defending from possibly fatal: 8
 * Modifier: dem gov support 4
 * Population: less than 30m: 5
 * Allies: Portugese Timor (LV) Portugal (L) Macau (MV) = 10
 * Participation:10
 * Total: 52

Result
((97/(52+97))*2)-1 = 0.30

(0.45142857142)*(1-1/(2*2)) = 0.22

Discussion
After talking with Toby, I am allowing him to take one colony completly. Timor goes to Japan. He takes no land from Macau however.

Invasion of Macau
GEACOPS
 * Location: 4
 * Power: 4 (7-2 fronts)
 * Development: Mil and Econ (8*4): 32
 * Chance: 4
 * Motive: Economic 2
 * Modifier: Non-Dem supported: 3
 * Population: Greater than 100: 20. 5x: 10 = 30
 * Allies: Japan (L) Imperial China (LV) West Papua (LV) Korea (MV) Menjiang (SV)= 14
 * Recent wars: -3
 * Participation: 10
 * Total: 96

Portugal

 * Location: 5
 * Power: 3/3=1.
 * Development: mil and econ (2*1): 2
 * Dev: infra (2*1): 2
 * Chance: 6
 * Motive: defending from possibly fatal: 8
 * Modifier: dem gov support 4
 * Population: less than 30m: 5
 * Allies: Macau (LV) Portugal (L) Timor (MV): 10
 * Conquerent Wars:
 * Participation:10
 * Total:52

Result
Same as above.

Palestine
I'd like to join this map game as Mandatory Palestine (if I'm going about this the wrong way just say). Dreamcaster1 (talk) 11:21, February 28, 2015 (UTC)

just sign up man. put your name by the nation. With Blood and Iron (talk) 11:32, February 28, 2015 (UTC)

Really? Thanks then. Dreamcaster1 (talk) 11:59, February 28, 2015 (UTC)

But Palestine is under British rule, so be careful when you need England to do that, Dominion.

Italian invasion of Yugoslavia
They declared war and said they were invading. There should be an algo on this.Vatonica (talk) 19:16, February 28, 2015 (UTC)

Covet Actions
After looking at the algoritms, you did not talk about covert operations. So my question is that can you perform covert operations in the game and how would it work?

Please remember to sign your posts.

I would say that it depends on the action. Simple spying would probably be allowed, although major things like assassination of major political leaders and the stealing of major state secrets would probably be an issue to be brought up to neutral mods who can decide who such operations end up.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 22:46, February 28, 2015 (UTC)

I was going to try to incite an independence movement so do I just enter the talk.

Thisismacedon (talk) 20:01, March 1, 2015 (UTC) Thisismacedon

Spain
Total:100
 * Location:+4
 * Power:4
 * Industry:+2
 * MIlitary: 7*4=28
 * Economy: 7*4=28
 * Chance:+1
 * Motive:Similar culture=+4
 * Motive modifiers:+4 (Fear of the Portugese Fascist regime)
 * Population:=5+5 = +10
 * Allies: Spain (L) +5, Spanish Mottoroco (S) +3, Spanish Guneia (S) +3 = +11
 * Concurrent War: +0
 * Recent Wars: -3
 * Participation:+10

Portugal
Total:53
 * Location:+5
 * Power:3/4=0
 * Industry:+2
 * Military:8*0=+0
 * Economy:8*0=+0
 * Infra:8*0=+0
 * Chance:=+5
 * Motive:+8
 * Motive Modifers:+4
 * Population:+5
 * Allies: Portugal (L) +5, Mozquabsebe (LV) +3, Angola (LV) +3, Portegese Guenia (LV) +3 = +14
 * Recent Wars: +0
 * Participation:+10

Result
((100/(54+100))*2)-1 = 31% max

(0.31)*(1-1/(2*2)) = 26% in 3 years

Disscussion
This war is bullshit. Spain was no no shape to fight a 3-year war with Portugal. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Don't know how long I should've made it, waiting for Edge to check and fix it. Saturn 11:23, March 1, 2015 (UTC)

Also, remember that the Spanish Civil War in this ATL was only in northern Spain (Mainly Gallica and Navvare). Added with the fact that French and Soviet investments were put into the mimimg industy, and I can see the Republic of Spain trying to invade and try to get rid of the Facist regime, which, by the way, supported the Nationalists (or at least in OTL, I'm guessing it did, since it's practically an NPC,) in the Spanish Civil War. Saturn 11:33, March 1, 2015 (UTC)

Also, if I may step in here, the fascist powers of Europe provided Franco with the resources and troops needed to win against the Republicans. That hasn't happened in the game. So Saturn can technically beat Portugal in a fight, especially considering that all of the military power Spain had in the 1930s isn't being directed against Franco. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 22:03, March 1, 2015 (UTC)

Sooo...why is this war happening?

22:13, March 1, 2015 (UTC)

Well, in the OTL Spanish Civil War, the Facist Regime supported the Nationalists in their side of he civil war. Since Portgual is practically an NPC, (Which the user hasn't posted once, btw.) It would've supported the nationalists in the civil war. The nationalists brought a fierce police state onto Northern Spain, and some of e remaining forces retreated there. Since the state, supplying the other side, saw it as a direct threat. Also with the fact that Franco escaped to Portugal, as well with the fact the brutality of Facism was brought upon the Spanish people, military action was declared on Portugal. Saturn 23:29, March 1, 2015 (UTC)

Wait, I thought portugal had development scores. This means that both the Japanese algos and the Spanish algos are wrong. if he hasn't posted he gets NPC development.

Here is the Portugese players contributions. Hasn't posted once as his nation, only for diplomacy. Fix as needed. Saturn 00:18, March 2, 2015 (UTC)

Because of Viva's war, the Portugese power has dropped from 1 to 0. Also since the player hasn't posted, I fixed the chance from the players last digit to the NPC chance. Saturn120 20:25, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

New Articles PSA
Please, please, please, please, please DON'T categorize every single page as "Axis vs Allies Resurrection Map Game." We have these categories for a reason.


 * Nations (Axis vs Allies Resurrection Map Game)
 * Treaties (Axis vs Allies Resurrection Map Game)
 * Organizations (Axis vs Allies Resurrection Map Game)
 * Wars (Axis vs Allies Resurrection Map Game)

So please, DON'T categorize pages like Argentina as "Axis vs Allies Resurrection Map Game."

That is all. Your friendly dictator and overlord,

PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Archives and AVAR
I now know why everytime I touch the AVAR page chrome crashes - the amount of data on it, therefore archives should be made, and it should be cut until 1940 - QC

Guatemala and El Salvador
Total:167
 * Location:+4
 * Power:3
 * Industry:+1
 * MIlitary: 10 +10*3=60
 * Economy: 10+10*3=60
 * Chance:
 * Motive: Hegemony +7
 * Motive modifiers:+4 (Dem. sup.)
 * Population: 5+5 = +10
 * Allies: Guatemala (L) +5, El Salvador (LV) +3 = +8
 * Concurrent War: +0
 * Recent Wars: None
 * Participation:+10
 * Troops: 100,000/35,000 = 3

Honduran government
Total:89
 * Location:+5
 * Power:+2 (basically no navy or air force )
 * Industry:+1
 * Military:10*2=20
 * Economy:10*2=20
 * Infra:10*2=+20
 * Chance:=+5
 * Motive:+8
 * Motive Modifers: -5 (not supported, due to dictatorship and genera oppression)
 * Population:+5
 * Allies: Honduras +5
 * Recent Wars: +0
 * Participation:+10
 * Troops: +0

Result
22% in 2 years
 * ((167/(89+167))*2)-1=.304
 * (0.304)*(1-1/(2 x 2)) = 0.22

Discussion
Honduras really has effectively no air force. It acquired its first combat aircraft only in 1938, and needed funding from Italian investors to do so. Not only that, but the government can barely fund its existing military; it needed to periodically borrow money to prevent mutinies by its unpaid soldiers. Honduras at this point is still pulling out of the Depression and is unable to afford more than a few hugely outdated planes. It hasn't received the foreign aid necessary for a Central American country to have a functioning air force at this time. As such, I request that the air force bonus be removed.

Franco-Ethiopian War
The Ethiopians are currently attacking French Djibouti. So Mods are need some algoritms in this war against France. When will it be done or does my war part of WW2 Thisismacedon (talk) 12:47, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

It will be done as soon as possible. Chances are it does not count as part of WW2 unless some other power involved in the war decides to give you aid, in which case it would be considered part of the war.

"This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 16:27, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

World War II
Mods, you need to start with terrotiorial changes. Poland launched an offensive into Lithuania, which we should win by now. France attacked Germany, Germany is on its way to attacking the USSR. Will you do algos fast enough? Vatonica (talk) 01:31, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

I'll do them tomorrow before the turn ends. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

​​  Here's a quick overview of all the fronts: Tell me if I've missed any, but I think theese are thee ones. Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 06:31, March 5, 2015 (UTC)
 * Western Front - France attacking Germany and Netherlands
 * Eastern Front - Germany, Hungary, Finland and Poland attacking USSR
 * South East Asian Front - Japan attacking French Indochina
 * Siberian Front - Japan attacking USSR

Idk but I personally think that the Eastern Front should be "Germany, Poland and Finalnd attacking USSR and Lithuania". Basically, there should be no 'Northern Front'. Moreover, I don't think that the French attacked Netherlands since they don't even border each other. Rather it would be France attacking Germany and the Dutch sending support to the Germans. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  07:54, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

its also hungary attacking attacking. With Blood and Iron (talk) 11:50, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

You also forgot Ethiopia.Thisismacedon (talk) 12:25, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

Ethiopia isn't part of WWII tho. And Rimp, I meant that. The Dutch are sending support.

Turkey just attacked Greece so you could also do a Balkans Front. —  Alexander of Volzhsky  Talk  15:00, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

Also, Japan is no longer invading the USSR, so that front is irrelevant.

"<font color="#AACC99">This is not your grave  but you are welcome in it. " 16:26, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

Stop pretending like seperate wars are part of the World War. The Turkish-Greek War is completely seperate. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here)

South Africa
Total: 114
 * Location: +4
 * Power: +2/1
 * Industry: +2
 * Military: 11*2=22
 * Economy: 19*2=38
 * Chance: +8
 * Motive: +7
 * Motive modifiers: +4 = +4
 * Population: +5 +2 = +7
 * Allies: South Africa (L), South-West Africa (LV) = +8
 * Recent Wars: 0
 * Participation: +10
 * Troops: 352,568/100,000 = +4
 * Fronts: 1

Portugal
Total: 71
 * Location: +5
 * Power: 1.6~2/2=1
 * Portugal: +3
 * Angola: +1
 * Industry: +2
 * Military: 12
 * Portugal: 6*1=6
 * Angola: 6*1=6
 * Economy: 12
 * Infrastructure: 12
 * Chance: +5
 * Motive: +6
 * Motive modifiers: +3
 * Population: +5
 * Allies: Portugal (L), Angola (LV) = +5 +3 = +8
 * Recent Wars: -9
 * Participation: +10
 * Troops: 100,000/352,568 = 0
 * Fronts: 2/3~1

Result
South Africa may occupy up to 20.1% of Portuguese territory over a period of five years.
 * ((112/(71+112))*2)-1 = 0.2240437158469945
 * (0.224)*(1-1/(2*5)) = 0.2016

Discussion
This should be two seperate fronts. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 20:03, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

Also, the one vs Angola is a coastal invasion, seeing as you don't have a border with them. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 20:07, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

I do have a border with them, I own Namibia (aka South-West Africa). I even asked in chat if someone would color Namibia in South Africa's colors a while back, but no one said a thing. In OTL, Namibia was a territory of South Africa, and governed by the South Africans until 1990. So...yeah. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:18, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

You are right, someone, not saying names(SATURN), should change that. Doesn't take away that this is two fronts, and thus the algo is incorrect. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 20:37, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

Better? Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 20:44, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

Why does Portugal have NPC development scores when it has a player? Also, my territory South-West Africa is in the conflict as well, so doesn't it get a power and development score too? Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 23:51, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

Someone should probably inform Britain about this war. Also Portugal's player should be removed for inactivity. I'll deal with that second matter.

23:54, March 5, 2015 (UTC)

Guatemala and El Salvador
Total:176
 * Location:+4
 * Power:3
 * Industry:+1
 * MIlitary: 10 +10*3=60
 * Economy: 10+10*3=60
 * Chance:+8
 * Motive: Hegemony +7
 * Motive modifiers:+4 (Dem. sup.), High morale +5
 * Population: 5+5 = +10
 * Allies: Guatemala (L) +5, El Salvador (LV) +3 = +8
 * Concurrent War: +0
 * Recent Wars: -4
 * Participation:+10
 * Troops: 100,000/35,000 = 3

Honduran government
Total:82
 * Location:+5
 * Power:+2 (basically no navy)
 * Industry:+1
 * Military:10*2=20
 * Economy:10*2=20
 * Infra:10*2=+20
 * Chance:+5
 * Motive:+8
 * Motive Modifers: -5 (not supported, due to dictatorship and general oppression), -5 (Low Morale)
 * Population:+5
 * Allies: Honduras +5
 * Recent Wars: -2
 * Participation:+10
 * Troops: +0

Result
18% in 1 year, enough to topple when added to previous war's gains.
 * ((176/(82+176))*2)-1=0.368
 * (0.368)*(1-1/(2 x 1)) = 0.1817

Greco-Turkish War
Need an algo for Turkey attacking Greece. —  Alexander of Volzhsky  Talk  00:42, March 6, 2015 (UTC)

Just going to add in that Italy is also invading Greece. Not sure if its joined with the Turkish Invasion or seperate but Italy is. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  08:23, March 6, 2015 (UTC)

Location
Location is how close the nation is to the place of the conflict. Goes by capital city.
 * At the war: +10
 * Next to the war: +8
 * Close to the war: +4
 * Far from the war: -8
 * Halfway around the world (separated by ocean): -10

Tactical Advantage

 * Attacker’s advantage: +2
 * Defender’s advantage: +5
 * Surprise attack: Attackers +6
 * Home is island: Defenders +4
 * Home is desert: Defenders +6
 * Home is jungle/tropical: Defenders +8
 * Home is tundra/arctic: Defenders +10 in winter, +12 in spring
 * Amphibious landing: Defenders +8 (yes, this means invaded islands will receive a +14 bonus)

Strength

 * Every nation militarily helping with belligerents/defenders: +Military Tier
 * Every nation nonmilitarily helping with belligerents/defenders: +Military Tier/2
 * Every vassal militarily helping with belligerents/defenderes: +Military Tier/2
 * Every vassal nonmilitarily helping with belligerents/defenders: +Military Tier/4
 * Every nation militarily occupied by nation: -1.5
 * Side with greater population: +5
 * Side with greater industry: +5

Technology

 * Every nation militarily helping with belligerents/defenders: +Tech Tier
 * Every vassal militarily helping with belligerents/defenders: +Tech Tier
 * Total technology: +TotalTechTier/(Number of nations*.75)

Motive

 * Life or death (country’s sovereign existence is threatened): 10
 * Religious: 7
 * Social/moral: 6
 * Political: 5
 * Economical: 3
 * Total motive: TotalMotiveCount/(Number of nations*.75)

Morale

 * Recent major military defeats (within past year): -2 per defeat
 * Extermination of conquered peoples: -3
 * Motive is less than 6: -1
 * War lasted beyond 7 years: -3
 * Total motive: TotalMotiveCount/(Number of nations*.75)

Nuclear weapons

 * Strategic nuclear weapon use on capital city: +10 for belligerent, -10 for defendant (of nuke). +2 per additional nuke for belligerent, -2 per additional nuke for defendant.
 * Strategic nuclear weapon use on major city: +7 for belligerent, -10 for defendant (of nuke). +1.5 per additional nuke for belligerent, -1.5 per additional nuke for defendant.
 * Strategic nuclear weapon use on minor city: +5 for belligerent, -10 for defendant (of nuke). +1 per additional nuke for belligerent, -1 per additional nuke for defendant.
 * Tactical nuclear weapon use: +5 for first tactical nuke, +.5 per additional nuke.
 * Nuclear weapon use for belligerent: -5 morale this turn and next turn.
 * Nuclear weapon use for defendant: -2.5 morale this turn only.

Industry

 * Full participationa: +Industry Tier
 * Partial participation: +Industry Tier/2

Troop Numbers

 * (First digit in troop numbers + Number of digits in troop numbers)/1.5
 * EX: 1,000,000
 * (1+7)/1.5 = 5.66667

Chance
Take the UTC time at that moment. (ie 21:32). Then, multiply those numbers. Any zeros count as one. Then take the declaring user's edit count. Then divide the UTC number by the edit count. Multiply that number by pi Take the fifth digit in the number then multiply by 1.5, and there's your chance. If anon user or NPC, use 1000 for edit count.
 * 2*1*3*2= 8
 * ie 2831.
 * 8/2831= 0.00282585658
 * 0.00282585658*pi= 0.00887318966
 * 7*1.5= 10.5

On top of your main nation, vassals wil each receive .25 of your chance score.

Fronts and Total
Once added up, the total score is multiplied by 1.5 divided by the number of fronts. If there is only one front, disregard this part and simply use the total.

Grand Total = Total*(1.5/Fronts)

Result
A score differential of 45 will mean that one side capitulates; the algorithm changes annually, so be careful! An advantage may disappear in a day. Build up your score differential until you win. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Military Strength Tiers

 * Your strength here is what you get for points on the algorithm. You can apply to go up a tier and we will examine your military development and give you the green light or decline your application.

Tier 1 (+1)

 * Lithuania
 * Paraguay
 * Iraq
 * Korea
 * Dominican Republic
 * Latvia
 * Greece
 * Luxembourg
 * Siam
 * Norway
 * Iceland
 * Ecuador
 * Aden
 * Yemen
 * Oman
 * Kuwait
 * Albania

Tier 2 (+3)

 * China
 * Egypt
 * New Zealand
 * Czechoslovakia
 * Belgium
 * Switzerland
 * Romania
 * Portugal
 * Venezuela
 * Mesoamerica
 * Southern Angola
 * Zimbabwe

Tier 3 (+6)

 * Netherlands
 * British Raj
 * Yugoslavia
 * Colombia
 * Poland
 * Finland
 * Saudi Arabia
 * Italy
 * Canada
 * Australia
 * Spain
 * Turkey

Tier 3.5 (+8)

 * Brazil
 * South Africa

Tier 4 (+10)

 * Japan

Tier 4.5 (+12)

 * France

Tier 5 (+15)

 * United Kingdom
 * Germany
 * Soviet Union
 * United States

Tier 1 (+1)

 * Mesoamerica
 * Lithuania
 * Paraguay
 * Iraq
 * Korea
 * Dominican Republic
 * Siam
 * Latvia
 * Egypt
 * Yugoslavia
 * Albania

Tier 2 (+2)

 * Poland
 * Finland
 * New Zealand
 * Czechoslovakia
 * Argentina
 * Belgium
 * Greece
 * British Raj
 * Luxembourg
 * Norway
 * Icelalnd
 * Romania
 * Ecuador
 * Colombia
 * Namibia
 * Southern Angola
 * Zimbabwe
 * Spain

Tier 3 (+4)

 * Italy
 * Netherlands
 * Canada
 * Australia
 * Switzerland
 * Saudi Arabia
 * Portugal
 * China
 * Turkey

Tier 3.5 (+6)

 * South Africa

Tier 4 (+8)

 * Japan
 * Brazil
 * France
 * Soviet Union

Tier 5 (+10)

 * United Kingdom
 * Germany
 * United States

Tier 1 (+1)

 * Lithuania
 * Paraguay
 * Iraq
 * Korea
 * Dominican Republic
 * Siam
 * Latvia
 * Egypt
 * Yugoslavia
 * Poland
 * Turkey
 * Finland
 * New Zealand
 * Czechoslovakia
 * Greece
 * Luxembourg
 * Norway
 * Iceland
 * Switzerland
 * Romania
 * Ecuador
 * Albania
 * Namibia

Tier 2 (+6)

 * Argentina
 * British Raj
 * Spain
 * Canada
 * Australia
 * China
 * Netherlands
 * Belgium
 * Colombia
 * Southern Angola
 * Zimbabwe
 * Mesoamerica

Tier 2.5 (+8)

 * Italy
 * South Africa

Tier 3 (+13)

 * Japan
 * Brazil

Tier 4 (+19)

 * United Kingdom
 * France
 * Germany

Tier 5 (+25)

 * United States
 * Soviet Union

Discussion
Definitely should have consulted all mods before doing this Pita, and i mean all. There needs to be discussion before something like this is implemented

I support Brazil's change in position on both tier lists. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 17:25, March 6, 2015 (UTC)

Switzerland should not be in the basic tier. Come on, same level as Paraguay and Iceland? • 17:28, March 6, 2015 (UTC)

I Support the Dutch tier switch, they definitely have the capabilities and historically punched well above their weight. I see them being able to do so for another few decades alone at the least and after that with some help, Give the dutch military the respect they deserve lol

People were complaining that the current algo was hard to use and understand. I've converted my algo into an excel spreadsheet so you can just input country names and data and it'll automatically calculate the result. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Imho, the new algo is harder for me to understand than the older one, speaking as a neurtal in this situation. Saturn120 18:21, March 6, 2015 (UTC)

It's all on excel; I've uploaded the algorithm and you can download and simply plug in the countries. Strongly advise all mods to download it: http://www.filedropper.com/algorithm_1

PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6) Is this list meant to include every country? If so, it doesn't.Shikata ga nai! 21:19, March 6, 2015 (UTC)

germany needs to return to its tier 4 industrial position. With Blood and Iron (talk) 01:59, March 22, 2015 (UTC)

France-Ethiopia War
France wins 39.166667 to 29.83333333

France retains Djibouti and now have a commanding advantage over Ethiopia in terms of influence.

Ethiopia: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B86n1OTvNyI4dGt2Q1l2QVNXeUE/view?usp=sharing

France: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B86n1OTvNyI4NWxfb19yN0x1Rm8/view?usp=sharing

PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

'''Motive was not economic rather it was the opression of by fellow Somalians and Afars. Also I do not understand this new algoritm.'''

 Thisismacedon (talk) 22:14, March 6, 2015 (UTC)

'''Treat French Djibouti as a belligerent rather than France itself to get a more accurate position. '''

Thisismacedon (talk) 02:11, March 7, 2015 (UTC)

'''I outnumber the French 340,000 to 9,000 in Djibouti before any reinforcements can come. I surely would get more support from the nearby areas since both groups populate the region where my motives can easily be to protect these people.'''

Thisismacedon (talk) 14:26, March 7, 2015 (UTC)

Upgrades
Look at theh top of the page. Post requests there from now on. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

France-Germany Front
Score differential: 24.87732662 in favor of France
 * France: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lWImbQP7TttyrX7GNmu3JHrmCFa1QamlINHLrJRQ43I/pubhtml
 * Germany: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13pRX0gWryHssAMBMef6EkiRlrkPokTB9Y58aljqWV1c/pubhtml
 * 1943.5: France makes minor inroads into Germany, winning 82.0533333 to 76.445.
 * 1944: France wins 84.05333333 to 80.60666667.

Italian Invasion of Yugoslavia

 * Italy: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13rndN4w6GZ60H52iUE8KGAiCr5AV4nVZ5eS-l5QTdWY/pubhtml
 * Yugoslavia: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1X5PTYAHAR0i_65QwxLE3MVPX-u87JtEpq6VMJUakcxc/pubhtml

Yugoslavia repels Italy, winning by a score of 51.6 to 48.73333333.

PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Turkish Invasion of Greece
Score differential: 22.3625 in favor of Turkey Wait, why is my troop count listed as just 125,000? I have at least 700,000 because of the recent drafts of all males aged 16—60 in 1943. —  Alexander of Volzhsky  Talk  20:49, March 7, 2015 (UTC)
 * Turkey: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1yVOQqQRmVMZ1Zutm_S3DtYlAzbtf_hu0z01YrKjQToA/pubhtml
 * Greece: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xteKsrBnG4QcTqNtmaj4XZhjOawIJtfv-HVBPeJKwqc/pubhtml
 * 1942.5: Turkey wins by a score of 51.3 to 44.15 as a historic streak of bad luck hits the Greeks, giving them a chance score of 0 and the Turks a score of 12.
 * 1943:Turkey and Italy win by a score of 53.95 to 38.7375.
 * 1943.5: Turkey and Italy win by 71.95 to 32.3625. Greece capitulates.

Are you gonna do this again? You. Cant. Raise. An. Army. That. Big. How hard is it to understand. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here)

Are we gonna do this again? Why not? Now, with the very existence of the country at stake. All able-bodied men were drafted, factories converted to wartime usage, and for more equipment, Turkish weapons stolen from those who were killed in battle. I do not see at all how I cannot raise an army that big at a time like this. The economic problems by this point are not really important when the country is in such a situation. It is absolutely plausible. —  Alexander of Volzhsky  Talk  21:44, March 7, 2015 (UTC)

I would like to point out that troop count matters very little. The troop count algorithm is "=(MID(B192,1,1)*0.15+4*(LEN(B192))/1.5)" - basically first digit multiplied by .15 times number of digits times 4 all divided by 1.5. Basically, digits is about 26 times more important than first number in the algorithm. An increase from 125,000 to 700,000 makes your troop score from 16.15 to 17.05, less than an increase of one.

Basically, get over it. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Dutch Invasion of Belgium
Score differential: 26.39996633 in favor of Netherlands
 * Netherlands: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZnFQsTi38-6rBlPn0JhuvSTiGlr1VVMmzgbPlxeGITU/pubhtml
 * Belgium: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Xar8rm--zQAir7NPmJzBAX5N5qJQVDLh-2nNEiJmhjA/pubhtml
 * 1943: Netherlands wins by 50.63333333 to 44.3625, making minor inroads.
 * 1943.5: Netherlands wins 56.63333333 to 42.4875
 * 1944: Netherlands wins 61.13333333 to 55.15.

Spanish Invasion of Portugal
Score differential: 32.29996666 in favor of Spain
 * Spain: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1maOBotgBc8sZ6QFjOY5aKYC0WltoIf4sWt1DeAKPEkA/pubhtml
 * Portugal: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bwWmAneFim4JBuukBQAVfcwaCGKoL_rno4wq_hyPSXw/pubhtml
 * 1943: Spain wins by a score of 54.3 to 49.81666667. Portugese forces are driven back, but lines remain steady.
 * 1943.5: Spain wins 69.3 to 54.81666667.
 * 1944: Spain wins 66.3 to 53.31666667.

Polish Civil War
With Poland in Civil War, I think it makes the most sense to have the two sides, which are now politically different, break into East and West Poland. The West would end up Communist, and the east would end up in a dictatorship. The problem is that I probably should be in charge of both. Vatonica (talk) 12:45, March 8, 2015 (UTC)

You know, it doesn't really make much sense for areas bordering USSR to be Pro-German and areas bordering Germany to be Pro-USSR. In fact, Poland shouldn't even be in a civil war. Germany had over a million soldiers soldiers all over Poland, and it would take them no more than 12 hours for the German army to peacefully depose the Pro USSR government considering that in this AvA, Poland has had been sharply Anti-Communist. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  13:08, March 8, 2015 (UTC)

I won't decide about the Civil War, as I think it could technically still work, but you need to swap West-Poland and East-Poland around. Also you shouldn't, nor will you be in charge of both. You can't control 2 nations. Youu can pick one, but have to let go of the other. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 14:29, March 8, 2015 (UTC)

I pretty much agree with the above statement and I personally believe that Vatonica should be played as the "Pro USSR Poland" given his current opposition to Germany... How he tried to join onto the USSR side two turns ago and how he just messed up everything for NK by driving Poland into civil war. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  15:09, March 8, 2015 (UTC)

It did made circumstancial sense for the two sides to be where they were. This is because the military, which was pro-Germany, was stationed on the border with the USSR, and attacked towards Warsaw from there. Also, I know that I would only be able to control one of the two, which was the point of this discussion. I think that I would control the Pro-USSR West, and Germanywould control the Pro-German East as a puppet state extension of East Prussia. Vatonica (talk) 18:35, March 8, 2015 (UTC)

Pretty sure that Poland is going to end up under the Soviets 100%. even if it does spilt in 2, you can not be both.

I wanted to be allied with the soviets, and if not, I wanted t be in their sphere of influence, but that was deemed implausible somehow by the mods. Vatonica (talk) 20:55, March 8, 2015 (UTC)

Actually, at this point, the USSR has been so successful that the Pro-Germans would be killed by them and the Pro-Soviets would have full control. I think the civil war will end in 1944 and Poland will be fully at war with Germany.

Question
Mods, is my turn plausible:
 * New Zealand: On 25 September, Peter Fraser is elected Prime Minister of New Zealand, however, only days after that, he is assassinated by a strong, powerful Māori movement called the Liberated Oceania (LO) movement, the LO then takes over the very weak Government of New Zealand, and Eruera Tirikatene becomes Prime Minister, the new strong government surprisingly joins the Axis, saying that the Axis is the only way to destroy the imperialist colonial West, and that the Axis is strong. We send many heavy weapons to Germany, Poland, GEACOP, and other members of the Axis to combat the Allies, we also propose to GEACOPS to invade Australia and the Soviet Union in order to end Western presence in Asia. We urge Mexico and Iran to join the Axis too. Many firebombs are sold to The Netherlands, Germany and Axis nations. (NOTE: The movement started when the map game began in secrecy, so it has enough power too overthrow a weak government and establish a strong one)

Although not a mod, I don't see why I cannot express my opinion. The population of New Zealand in 1945 was 1,702,329 and the Maori population was 115,646. The Maori therefore constituted roughly 6.7% of the NZ Population. Now, did the Maori have enough influence to overthrow the British-backed government in NZ? I'd say no but let's still move onto other parts of your turn. Now, why would the Maori even join the Axis is completely unknown to me. If UK were in the Allies, it would make sense but no, UK is not even part of the Allies and even then, why would the Maori want to join the Axis considering that the Axis are beaten back. Moving on, New Zealand lacks the capability to safely send weapons to the Axis in Europe due to the French naval blockade over Germany and the hostile British navy (Towards Maori). So let's forget that... and move on. Now, the Maori asking Japan to invade Australia would seem logical since Australia would generally oppose a Maori New Zealand but the rest of what you said such as asking Mexico and Iran to join Axis; and asking Japan to invade USSR. They make no sense. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  08:52, March 9, 2015 (UTC)

This group grew since the POD. And thsi group is a group of supremacist Maori's that see the Axis as a way to decrease European influence on Asia.

I am afraid but there never were really any 'Supremacist Maori' and in fact, the Axis doesn't even exist in this game. Rather, the 'Anti-Communist League' was established by Germany. So I am not even sure how an Anti Communist League that is currently getting their REKT by USSR could possibly help the Maoris.. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  10:04, March 9, 2015 (UTC)

I'll remind you once again that the Maori only constitute 6.7% of the population of New Zealand in 1945 and a great majority of them belong to the poorer class. How exactly could such a group then stage a coup d'état is unknown to me. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  10:10, March 9, 2015 (UTC)

I am sorry about the implausible turn. I shall remove it now.

Well, considering the fact the United Kingdom is or would be undergoing a Communist Revolution, you still do have a fair chance of becoming independent. Although ofcourse, the 'independent' NZ would not be Maori-dominated and would also need a 'Protector' or else it would fall under Australian influence. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  14:07, March 9, 2015 (UTC)

US Peacekeeping Mission in Haiti
So I don't know how I'm supposed to do an algo. Pita can you do one for US occupation of Haiti?

04:19, March 11, 2015 (UTC)

Archive
It's been more than 10 years, so it's time to archive posts up to 1943.5 I think. • 13:32, March 11, 2015 (UTC)

Map
Out of date, add Ethiopian and Tibet tint ins. Uruguay and Angola are conquered now.

Stuff that needs to be added to the Map We okayed his acquisition of the colonies too. -Feud
 * Brazilian vassalization of Venezuela and Guyana [All 3]
 * Brazilian occupation of the British South Carribean Islands
 * South African occupation of Southern Angola
 * Argentinas vassalization of Uruguay
 * Chiles vassalization of Bolivia
 * Independence of Pakistan, India and Burma
 * Annexation of the Baltic Nations by USSR
 * Partition of Poland between Germany and USSR
 * Dutch occupation of Flanders
 * Japanese occupation of French Indochina
 * Paritition of Greece between Turkey and Italy
 * US occupation of British Northern Carribean stuff
 * Spanish occupation of mainland Portugal, Mozambique and whats left of Angola
 * Spanish purchase of Congo
 * Australian purchase of Dutch East Indies
 * S. Africa annexed Zimbabwe.The River Nile-2 (talk) 05:25, March 21, 2015 (UTC)

The Dutch aren't occupying though. Belgium agreed to cede Flanders. That's not occupation. ~Tech

It doesn't really matter Tech. Feud purchased the British South Carribean Islands and those 3 Guyana, but he doesn't seem to care when I used the words 'vassalization' and 'occupation'. -Rimp

They Arent occupied, i didnt even really impose true law until they were wholesale sold, so yeah they arent occupied the islands got annexed straight up and the guyanas as a confederation with each state able to dictate some of its own law and self determination -Feud

Union of Monarchist Indian States
Alright, its OK to allow UMIS and its name Union of Monarchist Indian States into this map game. The Indian government doesn't based off on Wreck-It Ralph because Wreck-It Ralph don't exist and not having used Wreck-It Ralph until 2012 when Disney creates this. Its government and its name Shugarist are based off on Ravi Phunkar's book series The Sweetest Folk and its not having Wreck-It Ralph stuff to do in this map game. Since I passed the Hindu law in when all Muslims must convert to Hinduism, it doesn't likes the Muslims, so Pakistan declare independence from India and the same Burma also in east. People who want Republic instead of monarchy rebels against the Imperial government and joins together simpler with Muslims. This is what called the Indian Civil War between Hindus and Muslims. So I will not use Wreck-It Ralph stuff anymore and I now using my own Sweetest Folk stuff in India here. No Wreck-It Ralph, Fix-It Felix, Vanellope, Sugar Rush racers and the Nicelanders will have to do with map game. NO CREATING THINGS 67 YEARS EARLY!

Not even sure so lets make it simple
 * Your Hindu Law to convert all Muslims to Hindiusm doesn't make much sense as the Indian Governmemt was largely secular, and attempts to convert a religion that constituted 25% of the population would've resulted in a civil war
 * Pakistan and Burma will become independant. That is kind of inevitable and you can't really do much to avoid it unless you want to destroy India.
 * An unknown person called Ravi Phunkar would not become the leader of India, Jawaharlal Nehru or Subhas Chandra Bose would.
 * India would not be a Monarchy, it would be a democratic state.
 * 'Indian National Monarchist Works Party' would be a tiny party. The Indian National Congress and Muslim League would be the two major parties in India. So no, there would not be any 'Shugarist' whatever either.
 * Those wanting to set up a modern Republic in India will definitely not migrate to Pakistan or Burma. They are going to start a rebellion and easily overthrow your Monarchy which shouldn't even be here in the first place.

I accepted, I'm going to rename the UMIS to United States of India as a republic. So I basically undo Indians wanting Republic instead of Monarchy and we are now at war with Pakistan and Burma. Finally, India never have Monarchy after end of British rule in 1945.

Eric no. Shugarism wont exist. It is obviously and completely based on Sugar Rush. You've pulled it before on other map games Eric. Now. Ravi Phunkar, does not exist nor will he be the leader of India. Also, India isn't the first place you'd expect a book series called the Sweetest Folk. Civil War is happening no matter what. You also aren't gonna be converting shit. Stop this now. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 13:24, March 12, 2015 (UTC)

Jinnah dies before Indian independence, and no Pakistan - simple as that. Gandhi could also convince Jinnah to become Prime Minister of a united India, which would also mean no Pakistan. Burma may not be able to go independent as easy as you think it will. Imp (Say Hi?!) 14:06, March 12, 2015 (UTC)

Well, movements for independant Pakistan and Burma have already started, and the Pakistan Movement had already started 7 years before Indian independence. Moreover, the large scale of implausible stuff that Eric has done uptil now doesn't help him much. Anyways, a lot of other states other than Pakistan and Burma have potential to become independant ~ someone
 * Assam - Large scale separatist movements took place in Assam, launched by the various tribes that lived in Assam which eventually lead to the Indian government completely breaking down the province. Since then, independence movements have existed in Assam and fighting and stuff usually happens.
 * Dravida Nadu - A movement existed to create a Tamil state in Southern India and was at its height from inbetween 1940s to 1960s. It was quite popular then but failed to gain much support from other parts of India. Although a 'non-violent movement', it does indeed have the potential to become violent.
 * Nagalim - Generally close to Assam, this state too demanded independence and given how close it is to Burma which is currently fighting for independence; it is quite possible that Nagalim may as well declare independence. Otl, they led a violent insurgency in 1950s.
 * Hyderabad - The richest and most developed Princely state in India, this state was ruled by a Muslim ruler who sought to establish an independant Hyderabad state in 1947. Eventually, troops were sent to annex forcefully annex Hyderabad.

Anyway Eric has already goofed a lot and worsened the political climate in India, so Indian unity is pretty much impossible by now. Pakistan, Burma, and now potentially Bengal are going independent. Also Bengal and Burma have allied with each other against India so Eric has officially dug his own grave.

04:10, March 13, 2015 (UTC)

Switching countries
With you guys insisting that Poland doesn't exist, I would like to switch countriesVatonica (talk) 10:39, March 13, 2015 (UTC)

Nobody is 'insisting' that Poland doesn't exist, it is a fact. You can go pick another nation if you want. -Someone :/

Eric Removing Edits
Ok, I personally think that Eric needs to drop his immature attitude. Recently, he has been ignoring the revolts in Burma, Bengal and Pakistan. He rarely ever mentions them in his turns and acts like everyone is supporting his unknown leader. Moreover, in a 'fuck you' to the Mods; he suddenly passed a law demanding all Muslims convert to Hindiusm and then automatically had the 16.9 million Muslims converted to Hindiusm. This turn when the state of Pakistan was able to secure their otl borders with India, Eric decided to sent an army of 3 million soldiers and 4000 tanks to attack Pakistan. This however was completely implausible as India lacked the resources to arm an army 3 million soldiers nor did they possess 4000 tanks. As mentioned here ​http://althistory.wikia.com/wiki/Axis_vs_Allies_Resurrection_(Map_Game)?oldid=1142672
 * ​I seriously wonder whether India has the resources to arm a 2 million army or the transport system to send such a large army over to Western India without suffering large scale attrition. They're in a state of unrest so yeah. Moreover, right now its 2014 and India has 6,464 tanks so I seriously doubt India would have 4000 tanks in 1946. 

Instead of replying to my edit, Eric instead decided to go and completely remove my edit. I believe that this is a breach of rules as Eric is obviously attempting to cover up his implausible actions and removing the edits of others. I personally have the view that Eric should be punished for his actions.

Moving on, once he had removed my edits; he decided to add a couple of more implausible edits. He declared that India had developed jet engine when India completely lacked any jet fighter otl. Even during World War II, when major developments were brought forth to the Indian Airforce, no jet fighter was developed. But somehow, a recently independant India has managed to develop a jet fighter in this AvA despite no British participation in World War II. He even had two Indian automobile companies "Hindustan Motors" and "Mahindra & Mahindra" become the top automotive manufacturers in India despite the fact that they were little known companies in otl 1945 India and then he went as far as to make it sound as if almost everyone in India had purchased cars from this company despite the fact that only the urban parts in India possessed cars then and scarcely any part of India was urbanized back then. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  15:55, March 14, 2015 (UTC)

I'm just throwing this out there, India did have the resources to raise that many soldiers, as it was the military powerhouse for the British Empire. It wouldn't be completely unfesible for the Indians to raise such an army, converting their alrighty formidable textile industry into one of making uniforms, and utilize the industrial centers in Mumbai, Calcutta, and Hyderabad to produce tanks and weaponry. India was able to build its own weapons, since the British didn't want to flip the cost of shipping in new weapons for the many armies they were raising out of India, so armories were built throughout the sub-continent. As for the infrastructure, the British left India was a massive network of railroads, since it was the "Pearl of the British Crown", and had to be treated as such. One doesn't move thousands of tons of raw materials out of a place like India without some serious logistical planning. Finally, India can have the 4,000 tanks given that what a tank did in the past, as well as the relative cost, is far different from those of today. Today, a tank has air conditioning, turrets that can move while on the move, night vision scopes, high-tech suspensions, advanced communication equipment, and powerful engines, all of which hike up the cost and build time of the average tank. A tank in 2015 cost far more than a tank in 1946. This is the 1940s. An M4 Sherman in 1946 would have cost the equivalent of about $500,000 in today's money. An M1 Abrams costs more than $8.5 million, and don't even get me started on the freakin' Leclercs. Tanks in this era are relatively simple, cheap, and easy to produce. All they need to do is move and shoot, nothing else. It is completely within the ability to India to have what Eric claims to have produced. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 16:08, March 14, 2015 (UTC)

REX, you are not becoming an admin of AvAR map game!

While you're correct in stating that India would easily be able to raise an army of 3 million, I certainly doubt they'd be able to arm such a large army. Given the virtual independence that the Princely State of Hyderabad possessed and their general desire for independence, I would certainly doubt that they would aid the Indian Army. As far as Calcutta is concerned, it should be becoming a warzone very soon due to Bengal fighting for its own independence. That would put all of the pressure on Mumbai, and lets not forget the Dravida Nadu independence movement which would certainly result in Tamil pressure over the Indians for an independent Tamil state and particularly harm Mumbai if the Tamils decided to go on the offensive. As for Indian railways, while I would admit that India indeed as the 'Pearl of the British Crown', Indian railways suffered greatly during the Great Depression and given the war in Burma, Pakistan, Bengal; attempts to sabotage the Indian railway by Indian Muslims or any other group could easily be completed. Even in 2006 and 2006, the Indian army were unable to quickly prepare a force to be transported to the Western Front. This was one the major reasons for not declaring war upon Pakistan then. Now moving on, I certainly doubt that India would be able to construct 4000 tanks in a single year given how the British Indian army rarely possessed tanks and in case they did, they were controlled by the British not the Indians. In fact, a large majority of the Indians in the British Indian Army were enlisted as sepoys. Unless a large majority of the British who were Officers in the army resigned, it would've been quite difficult for India to suddenly announce independence. Therefore, it would be concluded that the British officers resigned, which in turn would create massive problems for the Indian army with rarely anyone to lead an offensive. Finally, why should we all simply forget how India is still made up of hundreds of Princely States out of which many would be quite keen on becoming independent and which in turn would severely harm Eric and whatever hes doing.

Anyways the point is that Eric shouldn't be allowed to just remove any edit that he does not like. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  17:32, March 14, 2015 (UTC)

I agree with Eric in that without a peaceful British intervention India snould be collapsing. Tamil people(as a Tamil myself) today in India identify themselves as Tamils and Indians. India will never be able to raise 2 million men. They would not be able to raise 2 million men properly, the idea of indian is non-existent in TTL. I agree that Eric is being too irrensponsible.

Thisismacedon (talk) 23:09, March 14, 2015 (UTC)

Eric is just pretending that there is no war, but when he does react to the war he acts like he has won it already. The Partition of India was bloody enough OTL, without British oversight it would just be even more bloody and chaotic. This is what is happening. Also, Eric made a fictional person the king but then next turn decided that he was a republic without acknowledging any changes. I personally think Eric is unsuited to be playing this game. Also, Macedon, you can't just say Sri Lanka "is an artificial state". It exists and will continue to exist.

23:22, March 14, 2015 (UTC)

Sri Lanka is an artifical state since it tries to combine three ethnic groups(tamils, singalas and moors) and four religions(Christianity, Hinduism, Buddishim and Islam). Sri Lanka is dividing the Tamil people between Tamils and Singala where resently there was a bloodly civil war between the Tamil and Singala people from 1983 to 2009. Also the republic of Dravida just became so the Tamil people would love to join it.

Thisismacedon (talk) 01:42, March 15, 2015 (UTC)

While I would agree that Sri Lanka could be considered an artificial state due to its attempt to make various religious and ethnic groups work together, I doubt the Tamils would revolt. There was no significant independence movement in 1940s, and the Tamils were not antagonized until the laws that were passed to deport Indian Tamils as well make Sinhala the national language. These laws were passed in 1948, making it possible for unity to be maintained IF such laws are prevented. Make sure that the law that resulted in deportation of Indian Tamils in Sri Lanka was passed by the British, not the Sinhala. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  11:31, March 15, 2015 (UTC)

Eric has a habit of removing edits he doesnt like, he's done it before a few times. About the giant army, I sincerely doubt India could support that army while in a bloody civil war which is tearing them apart. Not only are Burma, Bengal and Pakistan revolting, but so are Hyperabad and Assam(IIRC atleast). Also, I think the fact that Eric's only reaction being:

'REX, you are not becoming an admin of AvAR map game! '

says a lot about Eric in general. If this is seriously the only argument he can make then it proves his immaturity. He has also basically shown he is incapable of playing India, hell, incapable of even p;aying this game in general. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 12:16, March 15, 2015 (UTC)

India
The current player of India is Eric4e. Eric is already notorious for having a short temper, insulting people, general childishness, and his infamous 'wreck-it-ralph-porn threat'. In this game, he already led India to ruin, and won't deal with the revolts. I'd suggest kicking him from India, and then either let IstocnoSarajevo(who led the Indian Independence Movement) or just another player take over. The way it is going, this is just disgraceful <font color="Navy">Hail Sean!  (Get a free potato here) 15:29, March 15, 2015 (UTC)

I am in favor of removing Eric from India and leaving it open to another player. However, whoever seeks to play as India should be prepared to deal with the wars.

22:02, March 15, 2015 (UTC)

I am also in favour of removing eric from india. Toby2: THEY CALL ME Mr. Awesome!!!

I agree Hydrabad would rebell. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_integration_of_Hyderabad The River Nile-2 (talk) 06:15, March 16, 2015 (UTC)

This already happened. Along with a multitude of other rebellions and revolutions. Eric didn't even bother to unite the princely states.

17:39, March 16, 2015 (UTC)

Eric deserved it. He ruined India. Thanks for doing it.The River Nile-2 (talk) 21:33, March 16, 2015 (UTC)

Soviet Invasion of Finland
Score differential: 46.4 in favor of USSR


 * USSR: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1jLhnXngNgzH45EMVGwaKtK5x-KIdgA9nkJ4SQQmzrps/pubhtml
 * Finland: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/14dddLl3Zi4oY7tdn7nKEUkJYmTFPBFK2UrRYxRQziEA/pubhtml
 * 1944.5: Soviet Union wins by 95.9 to 77.2.
 * 1945: Soviet Union wins by 91.4 to 63.7.

Finland ceases to exist as a political entity in 1945.

Saudi Invasion of Kuwait
Score differential: 69.10555556 in favor of Saudi Arabia


 * Saudi Arabia: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18TNMxVmV0nWN_-VegVTixUOXhdoPlgoCAIrGZwwOofk/pubhtml
 * Kuwait: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1mb0VIxlowrlrVbcbW-SU1ZnWZ2V5C1hOdYc-JdgHr_E/pubhtml

Timeline

 * 1946.5: Saudi Arabia wins 90.32777778 to 57.65
 * 1947: Saudi Arabia wins 85.07777778 to 48.65

Yemenese Invasion of Aden
Score Differential: 62.6 in favor of Yemen'


 * Yemen: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VJtT9PavywBxziXFGneBzjXFLfNkMd2L7rL3mvqCqvc/pubhtml
 * Aden: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1OpTPSM5yZEZeyQxNK0QjBULvBPRkLjMjB9N_UNwbj0s/pubhtml

Timeline

 * 1946.5: Yemen wins 88.73333333 to 50.18333333
 * 1947: Yemen wins 81.73333333 to 57.68333333

Greek rebels?
Can I play as the Hellenic Freedom Army? —  Alexander of Volzhsky  Talk  00:23, March 22, 2015 (UTC)

I'd say no, as it's not really a state. It's just an independence movement which for some reason is having great success. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here)

Gran Colombian Unification War
We need an algo for this Ecuador-Colombia war (Ecuador has Brazil on its side, Colombia is fighting two fronts, and the USA is helping the Western Colombian front). We also need a name. Vatonica (talk) 19:18, March 22, 2015 (UTC)

Brazilian-Colombian War
Score differential: 17.23333333 in favor of Brazil
 * Brazil: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DrE02hOS6VIrrGfEom9r3JmbeUVSsukhTCKNXTQI0FE/pubhtml
 * Colombia: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1QnmIGjrwEi5mOhC95t1t_FnNziWLh_oQis19vYIDpXc/pubhtml

Timeline

 * 1950.5: Brazil wins 76.78333333 to 63.8, making large inroads into Colombia.
 * 1951: Brazil and Co win 53.225 to 48.975, making slight inroads into Colombia.
 * There is no Co, Guatemala was never accepted into the war and im fighting on a seperate front from Ecuador. You need two seperate algos, Brazil front and Ecuador front.
 * Just to make clear, Guatemala is not participating in this war at all due to the Brazilian refusal. It hereford should be removed from a ll algos. Shikata ga nai! 23:04, March 24, 2015 (UTC)

Discussion
Ecuador is not a vassal of Brazil, but an ally. The two countries don't even border each other. The original offensive was Colombia trying to attack Ecuador. The war has two fronts: the Colombia border with Ecuador and the Colombia border with Brazil controlled Venezuela. And the USA is aiding Ecuador btw. Vatonica (talk) 23:22, March 22, 2015 (UTC)

Impeachment
I, Scrawland Scribblescratch, call for the removal of PitaKang as a moderator of this game on grounds of being an ass and using his position to his advantage. I believe a two-thirds majority of mods and players is enough to make it happen. 01:06, March 23, 2015 (UTC)

Mod Votes
10:16, March 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * Support:
 * 01:06, March 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * I'm going to have to vote yes. Upvote   - The March Sig Piq_28524_400x4002.png 01:07, March 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * Object:
 * Prinsenvlag.svg <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here)

Player Votes

 * Support:
 * Daeseunglim (talk)
 * Object:
 * Flag of the Hurian Federation.png Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 01:15, March 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * Shikata ga nai! 01:16, March 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  05:50, March 23, 2015 (UTC)

Discussion
This is fucking bullshit. See the event I made befor the war started: Oil prices peak in January before steadily dropping to pre-depression levels as economies begin to retire. The Great American Depression is brought to an end, although Canada is still in shambles. If I was Godmodding, I wouldn't end the American depression before the war started. Furthermore, I gave America a large buff in Industry power (+20->+25) right before the war started. When the Canadian depression hit, I was trying to provide Tb a way to spur on revolution in his nation, be told me he didn't feel like Canada was doing anything in the game. I was still Colombia at the time and had NO IDEA I would be launching a war in 1951 as Britain. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Pita causes disasters around the world (not that I have an issue with that, things happen), but he puts NA and SA into a depression, convinces Tb to turn over the British Navy to England, then after that conveniently decides to become the UK. That is my major issue with him. Then after giving several nations revolts, when Scotland secedes (Which it has tried to do multiple times, with several close votes), all of a sudden, that is not ok. Daeseunglim (talk)

Pita's a good mod, when compared to other mods that is. Crimson and Feud have not been any better, while Pita has been rather active and aggressive in combatting implausibility. Also, I think we're all getting a little to heated over the issue and I suggest calm. Vivaporius: "I don't need a slogan" 01:16, March 23, 2015 (UTC)

This is fucking bullshit. I ENDED the Depression before the war started, and I CONVINCED (HINT: NOT FORCED) Tb to give me back my Navy. I also let Scotland secede. Regardless, I fucking resign. This is bullshit. I have not benefited myself IN ANY WAY. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

I feel Pita has not done wrong. The only thing I'd have objections to is that Pita appears to think of himself a the 'God of AvA' sometimes. I mean, he is, but no mod should think like that. For the rest, I will vote against the impeachment. He hasn't godmodded. Can't we all just get along dammit. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 10:15, March 23, 2015 (UTC) I don't particularly remember Pita ever Godmodding. Personally, this game will fall apart if ya'll start arguing over petty stuff like "I got a depression, let's impeach that mod". <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  12:58, March 23, 2015 (UTC)

Malaysia
I read that the Federation of Malaysia was established in 1948, however it is not seen on the Nations section and it does not seem that GEACOPS (japan?) occupies it - Quebec

Also, does 1952 begin today? I have to pöost a very important turn as Egypt. - Quebec

He's righ on Malaya.The River Nile-2 (talk) 12:24, March 25, 2015 (UTC)

Switching (Again)
I know this will be my fourth country, but I want to switch from Ecuador to Yugoslavia as it's freed up and is much more important. Vatonica (talk) 11:05, March 25, 2015 (UTC)

Stop asking for permission. You can swithc if you want. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 19:55, March 25, 2015 (UTC)

Britannic Nuclear Weapon
I don't know who it was, but someone crossed out my "nuke in 1952.5" announcement, claiming, "[t]hat seems highly unlikely to me. Your country had two revolutions and recently Scotalnd and Ireland seceded. No way in hell."

This person has clearly not done his research. First, I'd like to dispel any claims that Britain created a nuclear weapon only with the help of the United States. According to The Atomic Origins of the British Nuclear Deterrent, America (specifically President Truman) refused to share the secrets of nuclear power with Britain. This was cemented in the Atomic Energy Act of 1946, also known as the McMahon Act, which banned the sharing of American nuclear secrets with any country. Britain independently created its own nuclear weapon and conducted Operation Hurricane on October 3, 1952.

A revolution does not cancel or halt military projects. In fact, given the amount of penetration the Soviet Union had in the United States, it is likely that Britain heard even more nuclear secrets in AvA than in OTL and at least began considering a nuclear project earlier than in OTL. The secession of Scotland and Ireland also have almost no impact on this project as most of Britain's nuclear material came from Sellafield, located in England.

So yes, I will be detonating a nuclear weapon next turn. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

It is most likely because PATO is planning on waging war upon you. If you were to gain a nuclear weapon, it would be quite disastrous for the PATO Invasion Fleet as you would be in a position to annihilate their force. In case you were to use your nuclear weapons, it would most likely lead to nuclear retaliation by USA however that is not what Scraw wants. He most likely would not want to start a nuclear war but rather a conventional war, since he is capable of easily defeating you in the latter but would suffer heavy damage if it were to be the former. '''In simple words, whoever crossed that out definitely is in PATO and PATO is waging war on England. To say that it was crossed out simply because the mod deemed it 'implausible' is incorrect. A certain degree of bias also played its part. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  05:47, March 26, 2015 (UTC)'''

Woah woah woah. Calm down here guys. First of all, yes I am in PATO. But no, I don't care really. I'm not even contributing to the war, I only declared in honour of the agreement. Second of all, those are some pretty heavy accusations Rimp. Now. Pita, Britain went through a communist revolution, and then another revolution, and then Scotalnd and Ireland seceded. You know the main problem with this? The British economy would suffer under that, heavily. This Britain isnt the OTL Britain. Another mod can make the final decision now, but I stay with my own. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 06:21, March 26, 2015 (UTC)

Comeon Sean, everybody loves a bit of conspiracy. Besides, Scotland and Ireland seceded had no effect upon British nuclear research as Pita has already mentioned. However, the Communist Revolution could particularly have resulted in scientists running off to idk... Canada? Could be possible.. But then again, during World War II; Britain suffered quite a lot but ended up developing its nukes nevertheless. Same could be said about Britain right now. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  08:50, March 26, 2015 (UTC)

Sean, I don't think you quite understand. The first communist "revolution" was nothing at all like the Russian Revolution. There was no nation-wide civil war, but a rather bloodless transition of power. The second one was quite similar - in other words, there was no catastrphic conflict to devastate government projects and such. Furthermore, North Ireland and Scotland seceding has less impact than you may think. Scotland is about 8% of Britain's total economy, and since we are engaged in mutual trading, the economic hit was not all that much. Instead of directly building ships in Glascow, Britannica is now contracting private corporations based in Britannica to do it for them, resulting in basically the exact same thing.

Another issue is that Britannica in AvA did not fight a catastrphic World War II. World War II completely disrupted the Britannic economy and lead to thousands of potential workers dead in the Blitz and even more dead in the beaches of Normandy. I'd actually say that they're at a far better position economically than in OTL.

You can reserach it for yourself, but I think you'll find that you'll come to the same conclusion as I did. A small portion of our enriched nuclear material did come from Canada (around 5%~) but that can easily be compensated for. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Britannic Invasion of Gibraltar
Score differential: 72.16666663 in favor of Britannica
 * Dominion of Britannica: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1zW5Ql8LO2Q0yEXLc9CtHMuvqqchkjlO2KJesOj5K_MU/pubhtml
 * Canadian Gibraltar: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZsP7fzNb52ZSs8IvERbeqJTScyNIeKuWhMB-2TTwwg0/pubhtml

Timeline

 * 1952.0: The First and Second Airbourne Divisions secure the island in the name of Britannica.

Discussion
Seems pretty unlikely to me. Gibraltar is easily defendable, even for a nation across the ocean. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 20:10, March 26, 2015 (UTC)

It would be if it wasn't Canadians guarding it. Lol. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

Guatemalan Invasion of Stuff
Score differential: 57.83333334 in favor of Guatemala
 * Guatemala: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1eKF9cpewk7g_9qkKtFQlV0WImKiS4LAjkJ6Gpn1nKQs/pubhtml
 * Nicaragua: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1eKF9cpewk7g_9qkKtFQlV0WImKiS4LAjkJ6Gpn1nKQs/pubhtml

Timeline

 * 1951.5: Guatemala wins by 67.06666667 to 42.65
 * 1952: Guatemala wins by 70.06666667 to 36.65

Saudi Invasion of Qatar
Score Differental: 46.1 in Favour of Saudi Arabia TIMELINE:
 * Saudi Arabia: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1LyodJna8Mk12LspK8AKxDwlDz12isNVgdrzzgD4Zm9Q/edit?usp=sharing
 * Qatar: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1UzT_COVQPbqst-TOYUB9jvfR5QyTCN5SVdaetx-mgCg/edit?usp=sharing
 * Turn1: Saudi Arabia wins 61 to 48.9
 * Turn2: Saudi Arabia wins 83.3 to 48.9. Collapsed this turn.

South Africa vs France
Score differential: 61.83333334 in favor of South Africa
 * South Africa: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ZoXvx4muFOdGWZs50zQESIspti1tFV6VPc5UUlOuW8Y/pubhtml
 * France: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1SoOrS8ooZktyfiTgS5uE1Gx6yINg2eTlhAoXpPajOXM/pubhtml

Timeline

 * 1952.5: South Africa wins 82.91666667 58.75
 * 1953: South Africa wins 90.41666667 to 52.75, defeating France.

Britannica Invasion of Scotland
Score differential: 46.45 in favor of Britannica
 * Dominion of Britannica: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U3ea2da8jjlkzi-J_x3wstYGcZEIBRRduHNJGXNWDFw/pubhtml
 * Independent Scotland: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VEYcoB8DBP2ZCrCiOInuHtR98cQgs2PIs62A2ZelPrM/pubhtml

Timeline

 * 1953: Britannica wins 116.1 to 70.05, taking Scotland back.

Absence and Leaving of the Game
Yeah so by the time you read this I'll probably be on my way down to San Fran, so I won't be on between Saturday and Tuesday most likely. Plus with that four day absence I'll more than likely back out of playing this game because once I take a long absence like that I'll more than likely be fucking bored of it. So yeah. AvA was pretty fun I guess, definitely one of the better map game experiences, but to be truthful all my other map games were pretty shitty. This one felt less shitty. So yeah. Have fun, be cool. Be back Tuesday. -  .....   Because I'm Just... Too... SSSWWWEEEEEETTT!!!

PS: Pita cheats...

PPS: Viva cheats...

PPPS: :P

Don't worry we'll rekt France for you while you're gone. PitaKang- (Talk to me | Kill count: 6)

We'll need a France player. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 17:09, March 28, 2015 (UTC)

Indian borders
What are the Indian borders since the map borders look so weird. I need to distignish lingiustic borders against political borders.

Thisismacedon (talk) 23:35, March 28, 2015 (UTC)

Those are the borders of the nations. That's normally what the map is for y'know.

23:38, March 28, 2015 (UTC)

Sweden has no tier?
Sweden and Norway have no tiers(Military,Technology,Industry) so i can't do the algorithm for the invasion of Norway i have done...

>Wrto12 (talk) 10:48, March 30, 2015 (UTC)

I would suggest looking at this. I also think a Swedish invasion of Norway is unrealistic unless a coup d'état happens in Sweden or something.

You are right gonna do a coup d'etat now... and how did you that?I have no idea how to do signatures and stuff.

I updated the text i think now its better. SO what tiers does Sweden have?I would say sweden should have industry tier at least 2.5 and at least 3.5 and military tier 3(they were very advanced compare to other countries at that time)

Well i suggest looking at the military size of Sweden in the 1950s and calculating/comparing it with other nations that are bigger. - QC

Sudan
Is Sudan a independent state yet? Or is it controlled by colonists? (I need a fast response because I am planning on invading them) - QC

Dont you technically seen control it? <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 11:05, March 30, 2015 (UTC)

Well there was the Anglo-Egyptian Codominium  but since Britain experienced a few revolutions in AvAR I think Sudan would have become independent or something, i dont know - QC

I just saw the new map, didn't see it. So I guess i controll it? - QC

Yeah, the Codonominium and shit. Have fun with your desert. <font color="Navy">Hail Sean! (Get a free potato here) 18:47, March 30, 2015 (UTC)

Saudi Show of Muscle
'''Result: 63 points in Saudi Arabia's favor. UAE collapses.'''

Saudi Arabia

UAE (Added to the algo in my version)

Timeline

 * Saudi Arabia:73.06, UAE: 46.71
 * Saudi Arabia:79.06, UAE:43.21

Disscussion
Pita, you have a problem to look into. Opening the algo in different tabs/refreshing causes the algo to change.

Vatonica and Wrto
Recently, these two players have switched their nations from one they possibly deemed unfavourable to one they liked. Now, the problem here is that their actions directly after switching have created some problems.


 * Vatonica: He/She joined as Yugoslavia in Turn 1952 and had soon initiated the persecution of every single miniority in Yugoslavia. It should be of particular notice that at this very moment, Yugoslavia was known as the Kingdom of Yugoslavia not a Fascist Republic. In any case, the minorities together outnumbered the Serbs but that didn't convince Vatonica to stop. In turn 1945.5, Germany declared war upon Yugoslav and the sinister mind of Vatonica came up with a plan. He posted for two nations [Japan and Yugoslavia] in the same turn. Moreover, as Japan; he created the Tokyo Pact. Then he posted a Yugoslav Dip to join the Pact, and then he went to accept the Dip back as Japan. Basically, he switched and then somehow had his former nation get into a Pact with his new one. Personally, I've no longer any problem with this as Germany has occupied Yugoslavia, however... This action by Vatonica has resulted in another player doing the same.


 * Wrto: The player has been playing as Ethiopia for quite a while and was famously known to have offered an alliance and also threatened to declare war on France, in the same turn. In any case, Ethiopia recently joined the Organization of African Unity (OAU) as well as the Tokyo Pact. Personally, I had no problem with either however; he then immediately switched from Ethiopia and joined as Egypt. It should also be worth mentioning that he posted for both Ethiopia and Egypt [Two Seperate Nations] in the 1956.0 Turn just like Vatonica. Moving on, in his first turn as Egypt; Wrto somehow overthrew the Popular leaders such as Muhammad Naguib and Nasser Gamal in apparently a coup d'état orchestrated by Japan and OAU. Now the problem starts here... Under QuebecanCanada who played as Egypt from 1951.5 to 1955.5, Egypt was a nation aligned to a West and one that supported Pan-Arabism. Even under otl circumstances, Egypt always supported Pan-Arabism and there certainly was no room for Pan-Africanism. If we were to look at Egypts turns, then we would learn that it had also signed a Mutual Defence Pact with the United States and supported a Middle Eastern Union with Saudi Arabia. In comparison, contact with Japan was completely restricted and the only contact with OAU was in reference to an NAP in Turn 1945.5. Therefore, I question the validity of the OAU/Tokyo Pact coup d'état in Egypt. If we were to go by this, I could just switch to France and announce a Communist Revolution. So personally I'd say that action needs to be taken to prevent players from unnecessarily changing their nation.

<font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  03:55, April 3, 2015 (UTC)

This is macedon was the original Ethiopian player but I agree that Vatonica is screwing around. Also Egypt's involvement in OAU does in fact seem kinda ridiculous. Anyway I believe players shouldn't be allowed to switch nations that frequently and have opposed it for a while now.

03:58, April 3, 2015 (UTC)

Oh yes, you are right that This is Macedon was the original Ethiopian player. However, I believe he left for Dravida Nadu and Wrto joined in as Ethiopia instead until his recent switch. <font color="#3178e0">"It's not going  to suck itself."  04:03, April 3, 2015 (UTC)

Every time I switched, I asked if I could switch. I did not persecute every minority, only the Bosniaks. I did not post that Yugoslav dip when I had switched to Japan; I think Wrto did. Wrto was Yugoslavia until they were captured, which was like one turn after he joined. I would never do that. Every time I switched, it was for a valid reason. The mods couldn't agree on what Canada was allowed to do, then Poland was captured, and then Ecuador had no ability to act independently of Brazil politically or economically. I liked Yugoslavia. I was going to stay with them. Then, when 3 major countries had their players quit to make a new map game, I assumed that this one would soon collapse, and would need to find new players for the major countries quickly. I asked if I could join as Japan, as Japan, Brittanica, and Yugoslavia were already secretly connected. I was given permission, and I posted as Japan, and Japan only, and removed my name from Yugoslavia. I know I jump around. But I always ask permission and actually switch. Vatonica (talk) 14:17, April 3, 2015 (UTC)

Also, Germany only invaded when I told Nkbeeching that I was no longer playing as Yugoslavia. Vatonica (talk) 14:20, April 3, 2015 (UTC)