Talk: American Alliance (1983: Doomsday)

Potential allies

With you developing the scenario for the liberation of Jackson, my thoughts are that it could become the second member to be added to the Dixie Alliance/Southern Free Trade Pact, with the first being Portland. I have no issue with Portland joining the Dixie Alliance; given the LoN's blessing, and Virginia's help in the region, plus Portland's previous history with Cave City. Portland would have no problem deciding to join this group. And, over time, with LoN/Dixie help, Portland could become the capital of a revived state/republic of Tennessee.

Re: the other survivor states in the south: it makes the most sense for the survivor states in the south to either be independent or join up with a Dixie Alliance. I can only speak for the ones I've created. I don't know that East Tennessee would be jumping to reform Tennessee (given the many years it's been on its own) but it's not opposed to such a thing either. Blue Ridge and East Tennessee are very open to membership, and would prefer that all states join one alliance rather than have a dozen of them in the region. I don't know if distance would lessen the viability of Hattiesburg, Natchez, and Louisiana, but then again Mississippi and Louisiana were U.S. states in an era where the engine had not yet been invented.

One thing I would like to see with the Dixie Alliance is how such a political alliance works in a post-nuclear war world. Defense, trade, military, economic, cultural.

Another issue I want to raise is with the name: I don't see a problem with, though I think in TTL some people would have a problem with it. Understand that Dixie, for some people, in the 1980s was synonymous with the Confederacy, racism and slavery. For many people (all white), Dixie was not synonymous with racism and slavery, but as a form of southern culture and southern pride. The last time Yank and I argued over Dixie, I missed this point that he was trying to make.

Finally, I believe Virginia and Kentucky would be thinking ahead, not just militarily, but politically....who are their neighbors? What about the LoN? What happens if the Islamic Republic of Anderson requests membership? Lots of possibilities here. Good job on establishing the foundations, and keep up the good work. BrianD 19:40, March 2, 2010 (UTC)

I can say that if the Islamic Republic of Anderson would request membership, they would be eagerly accepted. This is because the request itself shows the current members that the citizens of Anderson are eager to pursue peaceful relations with their neighbors.

Yankovic270 23:00, March 2, 2010 (UTC)

Raven Rock Mountain

Really, this is their HQ? Not one of the capitals or major cities, or at least a base in the interior of the member states, but a former American base on the outskirts of their territory. Also the Raven Rock Mountain Complex is too likely to be a nuclear target that all that would be left of the area would be irradiated ruins. There has to be a more logical place for the HQ of the Dixie Alliance. Mitro 19:11, March 8, 2010 (UTC)

Then do you have any suggestions on an alternate HQ? I am in the middle of searching for a suitable abandoned structure in West Virginia. Yankovic270 19:29, March 8, 2010 (UTC)

hang on here lets not abandon the Raven Rock Mountain out here. Let's not forget that the The Greenbrier Hotel and the Mount Weather Emergency Operations Center survived for Reagan & Bush to seek refuge in. Why not Raven Rock as well?--GOPZACK 21:23, March 8, 2010 (UTC)

Even if it did survive it seems odd that the HQ for a military alliance would be on the frontier of one of the members. It would be like NATO putting their HQ at Nome, Alaska. Besides, The Greenbrier was likely unknown to the Soviet Union, though I can't say the same for Mount Weather. Either way the theme of the TL is a dystopia and since there are so many other likely locations for the HQ, I just don't see a reason for a picking a place that was a potential nuclear target. Mitro 21:32, March 8, 2010 (UTC)

Oh I think enough people have been slaughtered to give this TL the distinction of "dystopia". Mount weather was known to the soviets because the american media reported on it in 1978 after the crash of flight 514 in the area. Yet it got off scott free in terms of nuclear destruction. Sure the location is a tad obscure but that makes it good in a way. It keeps the location somewhat secret from other nations. --GOPZACK 21:45, March 8, 2010 (UTC)

Even then Mount Weather has been a part of canon for so long that to change it now would upset to many articles. This is the same reason why the Nimitz still exists in this ATL. With Raven Rock we can prevent those issues by avoiding the problem from the beginning. It is a potential target and IMO would be nuked. If not it would most likely be in a state of decay when it was rediscovered by Dixie Alliance forces. Why spend the money and manpower rebuilding a run down base out on the frontier when you can use a pre-existing one settled nicely in your own territory? Also lets look at the HQ location for some OTL alliances. NATO uses Brussels. The Warsaw Pact didn't even have a de jure HQ. The CSTO is located in Moscow. I guess what I am saying is that it is unlikely that Kentucky, Virginia and the other DA members would agree to put their HQ on the frontier of Virginia. Mitro 21:56, March 8, 2010 (UTC)

There's propaganda advantages as well: Virginia likely would not be allies with the American Provisional Administration were it still existing in this timeline. Virginia can state that Bush abandoned the region, but Virginia and Kentucky are there. Bush left as a coward, the 101st Airborne came and built a civilization. Yada yada yada. The Greenbrier is now a symbol of not a failed organization, but a strong organization just getting off the ground whose glory days are ahead of it. BrianD 22:48, March 8, 2010 (UTC)

They chose the Greenbrier facility as the HQ. That doesn't matter. They would still not let Raven Rock go to waste. I'm getting the impression that Raven Rock is the Eastern Seaboard equivilent of the Cheyanne Mountain facility. Even if struck, the heat of the blast would at most seal the entrance, effectively turning the facility into a giant time capsule. Is this the case?

Yank 02:10, October 25, 2010 (UTC)

Potential Enemies

Would the North American Union be a potential enemy to the Dixie Alliance since Virginia is balking at the idea of the United States coming back???

The NAU is on the other side of the continent. It would take decades for them to even come close to sharing the same border. Furthermore the NAU is NOT promoting the restoration of the US. Remember the NAU includes a Canadian survivor state and nationalist Lakotah. You are thinking of PUSA. Mitro 23:45, March 8, 2010 (UTC)

Potential future members

Who's handling Portland - Zack or Yank? Whomever has it, are you considering reuniting western and central Tennessee? That might be the most natural direction for the region to head in the next year (under Dixie Alliance supervision). And thanks for putting East Tennessee and Blue Ridge on the docket - I have no problem with that whatsoever. BrianD 03:03, April 5, 2010 (UTC)

I honestly don't know which of us are handling it but if I had to speculate I'd have to say were handling it jointly. I don't want to speak for Yank but I defiantly want to see Tennessee reunited. A few other future members I would suggest could be Broken Bow (pending the rewrite of Texas and it's effects on it) Hot Springs, Joplin, State College and Oil City. --GOPZACK 03:20, April 5, 2010 (UTC)

I would pursue it for the Portland and Jackson territories. We would need to explore how much eastern Tennessee feels tied to the rest of the former state - and how much it feels tied to the Blue Ridge and Piedmont regions. BrianD 03:23, April 5, 2010 (UTC)

Guys, I've added the former CSA (Muscle Shoals) states to the list of potential members. South and I haven't really developed the Appalachian States alliance beyond a mention here and there in the Piedmont and Blue Ridge and East Tennessee articles; I don't know how he would feel about joining the East American Alliance but I am open to Blue RIdge and East Tennessee joining. I also think the CS states should formally join. The Tennessee (Adamsville) state is one that Zack had adopted some time ago; I caretake Corinth and Florence, and the other states haven't been adopted by anyone so they could easily be added if you like. Thoughts?BrianD 16:35, November 2, 2010 (UTC)

Also, I re-read Zack's comments regarding reunification of Tennessee. We'd have to consider how separate East Tennessee culture is from the rest of the state, and what reunification would look like. East to west and back is much longer and less easier post-DD than it was pre-DD and is now in OTL. You'd have to have reliable, and safe, roads and railways connecting east to west. Kentucky and Virginia would also probably have to prop up the state while it reorganized and got back on its feet. The capital would need to be in the middle of the state, to balance east and west.

I like the idea of reunifying Tennessee, and for that matter Mississippi and Alabama further down the road. Right now though the immediate need is to get the former CS states into the Alliance fold. BrianD 16:44, November 2, 2010 (UTC)

I also want to see Tennessee reunite. It may be true the the old name the "Dixie Alliance" implied that they only focused on the former Confederate states, that cannot be said about its new name the "East American Alliance". All nearby nations are welcome to join, in spite of position relative to the Mason-Dixon line. That means Toledo and North Pennsylvania are just as much potential members as East Tennessee or Blue Ridge.

Yank 19:00, November 2, 2010 (UTC)

First, I must admit I would be wary of joining the "East American Alliance" if were just an extension of the Virginian dream [I'll leave the definition of that up to the reader]. However, if Virginia is just an equal member among others, then I can see the Republic of Piedmont seeing joining to be a very real option. This is especially true if the other Appalachian Alliance members (East Tennessee and Blue Ridge) become members as well. The AA would have formed early on, as I see it, and needs to be back-written into the time line. As knowledge of the more powerful alliance to the north grows, I am sure that interest in Piedmont would have grown as well.

P.S. I am sorry that this has been hanging over us for almost a year now. But real life intervenes sometimes.  :-)

SouthWriter 16:47, October 21, 2011 (UTC)

Quite alright South...better late than never!

The AA would have been established early on. Feel free to back write it or I can if you want. --BrianD 21:36, October 21, 2011 (UTC)

Name Change

The article opens with : The East American Alliance (formerly the "Dixie Alliance") is a military alliance... This indicates that in TTL the alliance was once know as the Dixie Alliance. However, there is no indication of this change being made officially. Are there any mentions of the "Dixie Alliance" outside of the pages of member nations? If not, perhaps the Dixie Alliance can quietly be edited out as never having been used in TTL. I can do it if you want. SouthWriter 17:14, October 21, 2011 (UTC)

I would leave it in, Retconning it only if it is what Zack and Yank want. --BrianD 21:35, October 21, 2011 (UTC)

Gettysburg as Future Potential Member

Hello. As the adopter of the Gettysburg article, I noticed that Virginia was near Gettysburg's location. I wrote that Gettysburg was offered membership in the alliance when it was formed in 2005. Is that okay?

Godfrey Raphael 13:50, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

Flag

The flag is rather racist. That aside, it's also pretty cliché. I suggest it be replaced. --Firestarthegodcat (talk) 04:06, 9 February 2021 (UTC)