For Hattiesburg's territory to extend down to the coast, it will have to extend over 60 miles south while only 30 miles in the other

Counties controlled by Hattiesburg

directions. This is approximately a territory of 60 miles by 90 miles, or 5400 square miles (encompassing the boundaries of ten counties. Extending to the gulf effectively doubles the territory, but I can see it as necessary to eventually make contact with the expeditions. If Hattiesburg "controls" this much territory, she must have absorbed quite a few refugees from lower Louisianna and the Florida panhandle. But is it the only settlement with those counties? Of the county seats, Laurel rivals Hattiesburg and would not have been abandoned. It is within thirty miles of Hattiesburg.

I know that Hattiesburg is the established big city of Mississippi. However, if it has consolidated this much territory into its "city" government, it has its work cut out for it. Perhaps this city-state needs to establish itself as "capital city" of a state with other municipalities.SouthWriter 05:26, February 18, 2010 (UTC)

So, I went back and read the whole article. I see that Hattiesburg utilized the school and the military base, along with the churches, to actually consolidate most of the area. However, I think abandoning the provisional state government set up was perhaps not the best thing to do. Is this co-operation with Nathez going to work into a new "Southern Mississippi," or are they going to incorporate the whole of southern Louisianna into a "Mississippi River Alliance" of some sort?SouthWriter 05:42, February 18, 2010 (UTC)
The provisional state government was intended to govern all of Mississippi (same idea for Natchez's government). Hattiesburg didn't have the means to effectively do that, and they figured that having a Governor, Legislature, etc. for a city was probably overkill, so they went back to the city government setup. Your area I think is close...the county borders are more or less accurate in the north; in the south, only the areas that weren't directly nuked (like Gulfport). BrianD 13:28, February 18, 2010 (UTC)
Hattiesburg 2

Under Hattiesburg's control

Okay. So a new Mississippi government will probably be a coalition of sorts with Louisanna. As far as "governing" Harrison county, that wouldn't be any problem. If a place is just a bombed out, and then washed out (a la Huricane "Katrina"), coastline, it could be a reclaimed fairly easily. Bay St. Louis, though escaping on the edge of destruction from the bomb that took out Gulf Port, would have suffered quite a lot from the hurricane (being right in the path at landfall). Rebuilding after that would have been a challenge, though not as much as reclaiming Gulf Port. However, if you want a new map, Here it is. I took out Harrison and added Jefferson Davis.SouthWriter 21:01, February 18, 2010 (UTC)

The Great Hurricane of 2005

Just as things were getting back to normal, "Mother Nature" come to town. And she's not in a good mood. With warmer oceans due to "nuclear summer," hurricanes would tend to be more severe. A category 3 would most likely be a 4. Bay St. Louis, the third landfall for this great storm (Florida and across the bay in Louisana being the other two), would probably been wiped out completely. I know that we can be sure what the warmer tropics would do "exactly," but we sure can't "rule out" these sort of things. Snow storms might be less severe (in most places, but warmer seas mean more evaporation, thus more snow where it DOES fall), but wind storms will pretty much be with us even (or especially) in an ice free world.

On that note, Hurricane Hugo, which just about destroyed the South Carolina coast, was a Category 5! The survivors the explorers found in Georgetown and Florence would have had to be "hardcore" survivalists indeed. I suspect when we (Piedmont) go looking for them in 1990 (a year after the storm), we don't find them because they are nowhere near the river (fear of flooding, etc.).SouthWriter 21:18, February 18, 2010 (UTC)

OTL equivalent = Hattiesburg metropolitan area

Would not Hattiesburg metropolitan area be a much equivalent than the whole state of Mississippi? That article covers only three counties but it represents most of the demographic of what was finally decided on by the town's government. The rest of the area they claim is mostly sparsely populated.SouthWriter 01:43, April 13, 2010 (UTC)

It is what I said it was. No different than entire states in the 19th century (which in some ways this timeline resembles) claiming areas that were sparsely populated. Just because no one's there now doesn't mean the government doesn't have plans to resettle the area and use it for trade. BrianD 01:48, April 13, 2010 (UTC)
Well, on that same note, Piedmont would like to settle the rest of South Carolina. Or at least incorporate the survivors in the rest of the former state into the present state (to be renamed later?). However, the OTL is meant for indentification purposes. Hattiesburg gave up on being the capital of the state a long time ago. They have no idea how many survivors are up in the northern part of the state. And then there is Nachez, also in the southern part of the state and former claimant to the whole state. Has Natchez given up that claim?
For that matter, whatever happened to the state in the wake of the "great hurricane of 2005"? SouthWriter 03:13, April 13, 2010 (UTC)
If you read both articles, you'll see where both proclaimed themselves the capitals of provisional state governments and later pulled back once they realized they couldn't govern the whole state. I hadn't thought about Katrina in relation to Mississippi.BrianD 03:47, April 13, 2010 (UTC)
By the way, someone else posted that infobox, w/o my asking. Ask him why he didn't put Hattiesburg, Mississippi. BrianD 03:49, April 13, 2010 (UTC)

I have read both articles (though I didn't look at Natchez today or I would not have asked that last question. That confirms my contention that the "OTL equivalent" should reflect the closest equivalent for reference purposes. "South Carolina Upstate" is not an exact match for the Piedmont Republic either. However, if the damage in the mid country was only 3 megatons total over Columbia, and 4 megatons total over the greater Augusta/Savannah area, then there may be more than the four counties I now use as the base of the republic. [However, the story is working well at the present assumed level of massive destruction, so I'll probably stay with it.]

Yeah, Katrina did a number on the lands claimed by the signers of the Natchez Accord. I haven't worked up a scenario for Hugo yet, but since Hattiesburg has been set up as the southern base of operations for the WCRB, we might better think of what shape it was in when they got there in 2009 - five years after the monster storm. I'm betting that the cities would be begging for aid from the Caribbean, Mexico or anyone else who could help them rebuild. For that matter, what matter of communications were set up by late 2005 in the area to get any warning at all? I'm thinking that ham and/or CB radios might have had enough of a network in place by then.

As far as the infobox editor, if he is reading these updates he will probably join this discussion. If not, I'd say follow my suggestion. Or go with just the city as you say. SouthWriter 04:11, April 13, 2010 (UTC)

Flag and Seal

I have added a flag and a flag to the info-box.

I would be thrilled if someone would could maybe change them to reflect TTL.


SouthWriter (talk) 22:03, March 1, 2018 (UTC)

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